1976 Scout Traveler, Ultimate Expedition Build

silverscout

Adventurer
In this day of cnc and solidworks, I notice guys overlooking the value of their hands, old school techniques, and standing back to give a good "eyeball"... I think it explains why old cars and planes stir the emotions, and most of the lineup of 2013 cars leaves me feeling pretty bored.

On a less philosophical :)beer::beer:) note, have we crossed paths before?

I'm in the middle "Shop Class as Soulcraft" and you echo this authors sentiments.
(found here: http://www.amazon.com/Shop-Class-Soulcraft-Inquiry-Value/dp/0143117467)
 

skibum315

Explorer
I know a lot of fab guys with talent and tools, but are often found lacking in design implementation. Rob has that rare "Artistic eye" along with the talent and tools.

This ... absolutely this.

I just read through the thread, after discovering it over the weekend, and I have to say it's one of my new favorites. The tenor of the build and intent of how it's come together really resonated with me for some reason ... probably because I've fantasized about something similar for quite a while. To whit: genuine room for four, simple engine & manual trans/t-case (12v Cummins & NV4500, perhaps), Ox lockers f & r ... etc, etc, etc. It's really too bad that Nissan (I'm a Nissan guy for whatever reason) doesn't have anything from this era, in this size class. The idea of trying to re-skin something more common with a 60s era Patrol body has crossed my mind, but that seems overly complicated for the end goal of KISS.

At any rate, I just wanted to chime in and ask if you were an engineer in a past life ... I'm working as an aerospace engineer, and the attention to detail you've put into this truck, and what I see with how you're going about the design; make it look like something that could have come out of one of our shops. Kudos on what you've done here, and add my voice to those who are eager to see this thing through body, paint and use!

-Jonathan

PS - You made the right call on the front bumper ... not that you needed my input, but there it is at any rate.
 

78ScoutII

New member
As a fellow Scout owner I am really loving this build!! Making me wish I would have pursued being a custom fabricator for a career instead of an architect, lol. Subscribed.
 

Metcalf

Expedition Leader
LOL, apparently I should have, you are not the first to suggest that:ylsmoke:

My train of thought:

1)I have had much better luck in the past keeping u bolts tight and torqued with round u bolts rather than square, especially with long travel thick leaf packs. I have had even worse luck trying to keep high clearance folded plate style lower spring plates, and neither style would have worked effectively on the front end.

2)Springs are pretty far outboard, allowing the tire to help carry it over obstacles

3)This isn't a "hardcore" rockcrawler, ease of maintenance and simplicity were placed high on the priority list.

4)Hardcore rockcrawlers don't need them either...they don't use leaf springs.:D


Honestly, if i was building more of a rockcrawler or high performance bias, I would have insisted on linking up the rear.
Long travel leafs are just the ultimate K.I.S.S. set up for a rig like this. Leafs like this rarely outright fail, will do a good job of handling varying loads, can be repaired in an open roadside stall in the middle of Baja, etc, while still providing a decent amount of travel and axle control on a reasonable budget. The downside, of course, is clearance...


.

1. It will be fine. I am just being picky so I can contribute something to the thread ;D. I imagine its working around the cast leaf spring perch that would make it hard? Maybe weld some sleeves to the housing and use a normal bolt? I made welded 'folded plate' style units for my Willys. I had to tuck the vertical surface very close to the side of the spring to keep them from bending inboard. Maybe take some bar stock and mill out a slot of the spring. Then pocket bore the u-bolt holes to keep the heads flush? That would be pretty dang strong and a total pain in the rear to make.

2. Agree. But the springs are lower than the diff which is kinda a bummer.

3. Yes. I do think the units you made a super nice, with a normal thickness spring pack I probably wouldn't have noticed even....but dang.

4. PPPPPPPPPPPPPPFFFFFFFFTTTTTTT!!!! Leaf springs work just fine for most stuff, even what people would call crazy most of the time :)
 

rube bonet

Adventurer
1. It will be fine. I am just being picky so I can contribute something to the thread ;D. I imagine its working around the cast leaf spring perch that would make it hard? Maybe weld some sleeves to the housing and use a normal bolt? I made welded 'folded plate' style units for my Willys. I had to tuck the vertical surface very close to the side of the spring to keep them from bending inboard. Maybe take some bar stock and mill out a slot of the spring. Then pocket bore the u-bolt holes to keep the heads flush? That would be pretty dang strong and a total pain in the rear to make.

2. Agree. But the springs are lower than the diff which is kinda a bummer.

3. Yes. I do think the units you made a super nice, with a normal thickness spring pack I probably wouldn't have noticed even....but dang.

4. PPPPPPPPPPPPPPFFFFFFFFTTTTTTT!!!! Leaf springs work just fine for most stuff, even what people would call crazy most of the time :)


I helped develop these flip kits back in the 90's, you know, when leaf springs were considered acceptable for rockcrawling :D

http://www.man-a-fre.com/parts_accessories/uboltflipkit.htm

While they work good, and better than any other version we tried, I noticed they still needed retorqueing after relatively normal use, at least until the sq u bolt stretches into its final shape. I just think round u bolts stretch and fit more uniformly to clamp better than any of the other styles. With the amount of washboard roads this thing is going to travel, and this type of vehicle typically seeing a LOT more miles between maintenance/ prep... I wanted something he shouldn't have to worry about. Also the general overall lower profile is about the only gain, vertical clearance only changes by .5 over my spring plate. I always wanted to have lower plates forged in the high clearance design...it was just never cost effective.

Truth be told, if rockcrawling becomes the bias usage for this scout...a few more changes will be in order. And a complete lack of common sense, but that has never stopped me before.

And don't worry about your contributions to the thread, I thoroughly enjoy the debate! I worked for a really good fabricator once, and he would quiz me on my reasoning for everything. If I built a part, he would ask about every aspect, and I had better have had a REASON why I did everything...no matter what it looked like, or how well it worked or didn't work. He always told me "Rob, remember you are a fabricator...in both senses of the word. If you don't have a good REASON, you better be good at bull****!" :sombrero: Of course, he also told me "When you start believing your OWN bull****...it's time to quit"

.
 

Metcalf

Expedition Leader
I totally agree. Having people question why you do things is half the fun...

How about a few pictures of your shop? I would love to see how much space you are working out of. In some pictures it looks like a big garage, in others a fairly large shop. You turn out some great quality work that is for sure.

Any news on some of the new projects yet?
Keep up the good work.
 

rube bonet

Adventurer
I totally agree. Having people question why you do things is half the fun...

How about a few pictures of your shop? I would love to see how much space you are working out of. In some pictures it looks like a big garage, in others a fairly large shop. You turn out some great quality work that is for sure.

Any news on some of the new projects yet?
Keep up the good work.

Sorry for the late response, I had been out of contact for a little bit.
My shop is located on my property, only about 800 sq ft, but will (hopefully) be expanded this spring. I also have a separate garage where I keep all my machine tools (mill lathe etc) and a lot of concrete. I will try to take some pics later...

Currently working on finishing a TLC street legal buggy, http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/toyota-land-cruiser/669068-other-woman-build.html

I also just got back from KOH, where I spent some time driving my old junk around Joshua Tree
20130209_152157_zpsfecd42fb.jpg
 

rube bonet

Adventurer
I did manage to get the Scout back from exhaust, it has been sitting waiting for the vanco booster to show up so I can get all the final details taken care of.

Pro Dyno did the exhaust, all stainless, and all tig welded. It was a tight fit, but everything clears everything...

Super big muffler, should be quiet and clean with the dual cats. 2 into 1 allowed me to keep the passenger side clear...future spot for a propane tank, or possibly an auxillary fuel or water tank.
20130131_142847_zpsfc5f4e21.jpg


It tight on the passenger side dropping out of the manifold!
0fc91110-bc98-4ba7-ab3f-d457ec0388e7_zps0b7268a8.jpg



Drivers side area has a lot more room
8f5bb61a-69d0-4216-b37b-1f5f9b5e07e5_zps6894253e.jpg


Tail pipe routed out the back, flush with skid.
20130131_142728_zpsf90769c6.jpg
 
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Metcalf

Expedition Leader
Very cool stuff.

On that FJ40 could you flip the tie rod under the steering arm ( keeping it behind the axle ) to tuck it closer to the pinion? Maybe it could buy you a few inches of compression travel before the tie rod would end up in the frame?
 

rube bonet

Adventurer
Very cool stuff.

On that FJ40 could you flip the tie rod under the steering arm ( keeping it behind the axle ) to tuck it closer to the pinion? Maybe it could buy you a few inches of compression travel before the tie rod would end up in the frame?

I wish. 1 " lower is it, flipping to the other side of the arm is too low. A different arm would be best, this one flat would be much better. I have to build an engine cage/shock hoops anyways, so the frame is going to be notched.

My main concern is the ackerman, or lack there of towards higher speed handling. My gut instinct says it won't matter much ( outside tire is loaded anyways, coupled with 37" balloon tire and rear spool), but it will be an interesting experiment.
 
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