1990s MB truck owners. Looking for some details!!

[sprocket3]

I'm considering the SK / AK / Actros (NOT UNIMOG) . I've got tons of questions

I keep seeing these 1990s Mercedes trucks on European sites and I'd love to get some feedback. They look really cool and have that neat euro vibe, but are the costs too high for the coolness. There's hardly any information online about these old trucks and I've read US owners have struggled with parts and repairs.


1) Can you get parts and repairs done in the US at all?
2) What models are the sweet spot in ride quality and power, without being insanely oversized? I'd really like to have over 500ft/lbs and some of these seem way underpowered.
3) Any major issues of concern mechanically?
4) Is a late 90s SK with the OM 441 LA a good candidate? So far that's what i'm zeroed in on.
5) Can they get 10mpg / (24L/100km) from with ideal highway gearing?
6) Any regrets from owners who've had them for a while?

Anything you can offer pros/cons would be great. There's just not a lot of these around in the US.

Thanks

 

[Joe917]

I can jump in I had a 1993 917 AF for 10 years 2 continents and 200K+ km
North America Parts. Filters belts etc. can all be ordered relatively cheaply online.
There are only a couple of mechanics in North America that can confidently deal with these trucks and supply parts. Parts can be ordered from Germany. The good news is North America has some of the best and fastest shipping in the world, the bad news is it may be expensive.
Power. The 117 has 170 hp. its a dog, however if you are not in a hurry (and traveling full time we were never in a rush) it is a pleasure to drive and we consistently got 13mpg (US gallon). With a turbo change and increasing the fuel flow you can get 240 hp (all with Mercedes parts and no stress on the engine). You will see a loss of fuel economy.
It will be a love hate relationship, much like a yacht, the happiest day is the day you buy it and the second happiest day is the day you sell it!
Although the truck had some gremlins we never solved, it never let us down. It is not a cheap vehicle to maintain, however the cool factor and the number if people we met because of the truck was amazing.
I would buy as new as you can but still have mechanical fuel injection.

 

[DiploStrat]

To add to Joe's comments, and in anticipation of VerMonster and others.

Doing it over, based in the United States, I would not buy an LN-2 again. It is painfully slow, terribly underpowered and probably lacks the basics, like air conditioning. This is not a turnpike cruiser. Gears on ours are wrong for any speed much above 55 mph/90 kph. We really drive more on the tach, trying to keep the revs around 2000 rpm.

When we bought ours, we paid in the tens of thousands of dollars to try to do preventive maintenance on a 1990 vehicle, even though it only had 30,000 km on the broken speedometer. We drove straight to Terry Lee Enterprises the day we bought the truck. Were there for weeks. Basic consumables are not a problem but the oddest things are simply not available - in our case, a radiator hose. Some subsystems, e.g. Bosch fuel injection, are not really a problem.

Parts are a real challenge as US Mercedes dealers will not look at the truck and they do not have access to the parts catalog. There are ways you can buy a copy, but it is a special effort. Sometimes you get lucky, but it is hit or miss and many of the European parts houses will not ship to the US.

Once in Europe, we have spent another $5,000 in maintenance at an excellent Unimog shop, where they have direct access to most of parts we need (they are an authorized Mercedes repair facility). That said, a surprising number of parts are simply "no longer available." That has taken care of most of the miscellaneous oil, fuel, and air leaks and tighten up the steering. Drives like a much newer vehicle.

We have not played with the suspension and it is pretty grim on all but good roads. Not at all what you want in an expedition vehicle in Africa. VerMonster has done more suspension work and he can comment on how it is working in South America. We have found the ride on most roads to be comfortable, and we have racing seats with no suspension.

Converting to single rear wheel, especially if you have 8 bolt wheels, is a challenge. The General Grabber OA tires are several grades too stiff for our weight, so we keep reducing the pressure and that is helping. The bad road ride has been a real disappointment. I can't imagine doing the Sahara< or any serious washboard, in this truck.

We have been traveling in the beast since about 2017 and have covered the US several times. We are now in the south of France, hunkering down for the storm.

So what works?

-- Visibility from the cab is wonderful.
-- Turning circle is amazing.
-- We don't have to worry about weight.

If you want a hobby, go for it. If you really want to go camping, buy something else.

(There is a whole another conversation to be had about driving a 9 tonne camper in UK/UE. Anything over 3,5t gets into lots of road/bridge restrictions. 2.5m is WIDE for a lot of roads which can often be very narrow. And a 1990 diesel will not pass low emission zones. Not usually a problem, but panic inducing when the GPS beeps!)

Note that is is a discussion of the base truck, not the camper.

Doing it over, I would have gone with a 5 ton, US truck.

If you really want one, get back to me in about two years when we will be selling.

 

[Joe917]

The "cool factor" of these trucks is hard to overestimate. We met some amazing people that we would not have met with a typical North American vehicle.

 

[charlieaarons]

There’s a world of difference between a 1990 and 2000-06 truck.
Vehicles of my (mine?) lineages (Unimogs) are exemplars. On my recent trip across North America (5500 miles Anchorage to Halifax), I had 2 copilots, neither had any truck experience. Admittedly #2 did ride across Mongolia in a 4wd UAZ van a year ago. Both were greatly surprised at the (relatively) low noise and comfortable ride and the complex electronics that control everything that actually worked 100% of the time.
A comparable 1990 vehicle (in my case a U2450L38 Mog) would have been very noisy, rough riding (no air seats or suspended cab), and had a forest of shift levers (transmission, low range, diff locks, 4wd, reverse.
The electronic controlled OM906LA (successor to the famous OM366 in a 90s truck) runs absolutely perfectly (so far…).
I think in a 4wd medium truck you’d see comparable differences.
The “golden period” would be pre DPF, not pre electronic IMHO. I can and have run my engine on high sulfur fuel with no problem and excellent oil analysis when drained.
The one reliability issue, maybe not until 07 in EU trucks, is EGR. But it’s easily removed.
If you’re subject to 15 year rule (Canada) I’d look for an 05-06. 25 years…
Fire trucks are popular because they’re usually low mileage and well maintained.
As far as maintenance, I do it some myself but also found an independent heavy truck shop owned by a Freightliner shop foreman that actually likes working on it. But I always supply parts and workshop manual printouts. Only things I had them do so far was replace AC compressor (bad shift clutch) and one of the hydrostatic radiator fan motors (slight leak but ACL might’ve rejected it at Halifax).
My 2 copilots admitted it pleasantly surprised them, it was a “modern truck”. A 1990 truck won’t elicit that response.

 

[sprocket3]

There’s a world of difference between a 1990 and 2000-06 truck.
Vehicles of my (mine?) lineages (Unimogs) are exemplars. On my recent trip across North America (5500 miles Anchorage to Halifax), I had 2 copilots, neither had any truck experience. Admittedly #2 did ride across Mongolia in a 4wd UAZ van a year ago. Both were greatly surprised at the (relatively) low noise and comfortable ride and the complex electronics that control everything that actually worked 100% of the time.
A comparable 1990 vehicle (in my case a U2450L38 Mog) would have been very noisy, rough riding (no air seats or suspended cab), and had a forest of shift levers (transmission, low range, diff locks, 4wd, reverse.
The electronic controlled OM906LA (successor to the famous OM366 in a 90s truck) runs absolutely perfectly (so far…).
I think in a 4wd medium truck you’d see comparable differences.
The “golden period” would be pre DPF, not pre electronic IMHO. I can and have run my engine on high sulfur fuel with no problem and excellent oil analysis when drained.
The one reliability issue, maybe not until 07 in EU trucks, is EGR. But it’s easily removed.
If you’re subject to 15 year rule (Canada) I’d look for an 05-06. 25 years…
Fire trucks are popular because they’re usually low mileage and well maintained.
As far as maintenance, I do it some myself but also found an independent heavy truck shop owned by a Freightliner shop foreman that actually likes working on it. But I always supply parts and workshop manual printouts. Only things I had them do so far was replace AC compressor (bad shift clutch) and one of the hydrostatic radiator fan motors (slight leak but ACL might’ve rejected it at Halifax).
My 2 copilots admitted it pleasantly surprised them, it was a “modern truck”. A 1990 truck won’t elicit that response.

Due to import limit into the USA i'm stuck with a truck from the 1990s. There's just hardly any of them around locally, so i've been looking at some in Europe just to get ideas on prices. Thinking something with the OM 441 LA engine in the SK, but i know there are some Actros trucks that I could import as well. I was told those are not very reliable due to a lot of "new tech" that hasn't aged well.

 

[sprocket3]

I can jump in I had a 1993 917 AF for 10 years 2 continents and 200K+ km
North America Parts. Filters belts etc. can all be ordered relatively cheaply online.
There are only a couple of mechanics in North America that can confidently deal with these trucks and supply parts. Parts can be ordered from Germany. The good news is North America has some of the best and fastest shipping in the world, the bad news is it may be expensive.
Power. The 117 has 170 hp. its a dog, however if you are not in a hurry (and traveling full time we were never in a rush) it is a pleasure to drive and we consistently got 13mpg (US gallon). With a turbo change and increasing the fuel flow you can get 240 hp (all with Mercedes parts and no stress on the engine). You will see a loss of fuel economy.
It will be a love hate relationship, much like a yacht, the happiest day is the day you buy it and the second happiest day is the day you sell it!
Although the truck had some gremlins we never solved, it never let us down. It is not a cheap vehicle to maintain, however the cool factor and the number if people we met because of the truck was amazing.
I would buy as new as you can but still have mechanical fuel injection.

That's the feeling i'm getting with parts and supplies. My friend just bought a 1990 Mercedes 190 car and is having trouble with some parts. I think the bigger engine is a must in the MB, or you might as well just get the Fuso and not deal with the headaches of a euro truck.

Just sold my boat, so i know the feeling too well. Sounds like you enjoyed the ownership for the most part.

 

[sprocket3]

To add to Joe's comments, and in anticipation of VerMonster and others.

Doing it over, based in the United States, I would not buy an LN-2 again. It is painfully slow, terribly underpowered and probably lacks the basics, like air conditioning. This is not a turnpike cruiser. Gears on ours are wrong for any speed much above 55 mph/90 kph. We really drive more on the tach, trying to keep the revs around 2000 rpm.

When we bought ours, we paid in the tens of thousands of dollars to try to do preventive maintenance on a 1990 vehicle, even though it only had 30,000 km on the broken speedometer. We drove straight to Terry Lee Enterprises the day we bought the truck. Were there for weeks. Basic consumables are not a problem but the oddest things are simply not available - in our case, a radiator hose. Some subsystems, e.g. Bosch fuel injection, are not really a problem.

Parts are a real challenge as US Mercedes dealers will not look at the truck and they do not have access to the parts catalog. There are ways you can buy a copy, but it is a special effort. Sometimes you get lucky, but it is hit or miss and many of the European parts houses will not ship to the US.

Once in Europe, we have spent another $5,000 in maintenance at an excellent Unimog shop, where they have direct access to most of parts we need (they are an authorized Mercedes repair facility). That said, a surprising number of parts are simply "no longer available." That has taken care of most of the miscellaneous oil, fuel, and air leaks and tighten up the steering. Drives like a much newer vehicle.

We have not played with the suspension and it is pretty grim on all but good roads. Not at all what you want in an expedition vehicle in Africa. VerMonster has done more suspension work and he can comment on how it is working in South America. We have found the ride on most roads to be comfortable, and we have racing seats with no suspension.

Converting to single rear wheel, especially if you have 8 bolt wheels, is a challenge. The General Grabber OA tires are several grades too stiff for our weight, so we keep reducing the pressure and that is helping. The bad road ride has been a real disappointment. I can't imagine doing the Sahara< or any serious washboard, in this truck.

We have been traveling in the beast since about 2017 and have covered the US several times. We are now in the south of France, hunkering down for the storm.

So what works?

-- Visibility from the cab is wonderful.
-- Turning circle is amazing.
-- We don't have to worry about weight.

If you want a hobby, go for it. If you really want to go camping, buy something else.

(There is a whole another conversation to be had about driving a 9 tonne camper in UK/UE. Anything over 3,5t gets into lots of road/bridge restrictions. 2.5m is WIDE for a lot of roads which can often be very narrow. And a 1990 diesel will not pass low emission zones. Not usually a problem, but panic inducing when the GPS beeps!)

Note that is is a discussion of the base truck, not the camper.

Doing it over, I would have gone with a 5 ton, US truck.

If you really want one, get back to me in about two years when we will be selling.

Thanks for the detailed reply. It sounds like everyone likes the trucks, but hates the repair issues out of Europe. What US truck would you buy? I don't see much on the market beside FMTV or Fuso 4x4. Unless you go with something like a F550 and just deal with the longer cab.

How would you compare the ride quality to trucks that are available in the US. I've only driven a 2005 Isuzu FTR and newer NPR/FTRs.

I really like the MB trucks, but it's sounding like a pretty bad idea.

 

[MogsAndDogs]

Mine is a Unimog which you specifically do not want but, in my limited ownership experience of a vintage MB firetruck in the US, my opinion would be that if you are all about practicality, then this is not the way to go. I would only do it if you are interested in and including an (maybe large) element of "different" and 'special" to your decision making spreadsheet - very much at the expense of ease and affordability.

I haven't owned one myself but when I hear Scott Brady talk about using old Land Rovers for travel on his podcast I get the sense that it is a similar experience.

 

[DiploStrat]

Thanks for the detailed reply. It sounds like everyone likes the trucks, but hates the repair issues out of Europe. What US truck would you buy? I don't see much on the market beside FMTV or Fuso 4x4. Unless you go with something like a F550 and just deal with the longer cab.

How would you compare the ride quality to trucks that are available in the US. I've only driven a 2005 Isuzu FTR and newer NPR/FTRs.

I really like the MB trucks, but it's sounding like a pretty bad idea.

We really need Jon(https://vermonsterrv.com/) and (https://vermonsterrv.com/patagonia-here-we-come/) to chime in.

Going both ways around the world, including a stop in Europe for an inspection/overhaul? Old MB fire truck, especially the DOKA cab, may not be a bad idea. The slightly shorter wheelbase and turning circle are nice in Europe and some Andean villages.

Want a vehicle for US/Canada/Mexico to Panamá? Get a 550 series truck. I really like the Chevrolet/GMC. Get gasoline as opposed to diesel. This is based on the purchase cost, cost of diesel fuel, and maintenance. That said, the stump pulling power of the Duramax hi-tech diesel is wonderful! I was actually surprised at the lack of torque on the 1990 170hp diesel. I thought that all German engines were torque monsters. I was wrong.

Ride quality? My Chevrolet 3500 based camper rode MUCH better than the MB - highway or dirt road. No comparison. BUT, the MB carries a slightly larger camper without being anywhere near the weight limit. How big a camper do you want? (Translates to how many people, how long?)

 

[sprocket3]

Mine is a Unimog which you specifically do not want but, in my limited ownership experience of a vintage MB firetruck in the US, my opinion would be that if you are all about practicality, then this is not the way to go. I would only do it if you are interested in and including an (maybe large) element of "different" and 'special" to your decision making spreadsheet - very much at the expense of ease and affordability.

I haven't owned one myself but when I hear Scott Brady talk about using old Land Rovers for travel on his podcast I get the sense that it is a similar experience.

I think the cool factor is what's making me want to look past the inevitable repair issues down the road. Looks 10 Practicality 0

I've always wanted a Unimog, but was recently drawn to the other trucks as i think they would be more Highway orientated. Realistically i think my use would be around 90% pavement and easy gravel roads. The Unimog just seems like more than i'd need to haul down the highway. Cool as hell though.

 

[sprocket3]

We really need Jon(https://vermonsterrv.com/) and (https://vermonsterrv.com/patagonia-here-we-come/) to chime in.

Going both ways around the world, including a stop in Europe for an inspection/overhaul? Old MB fire truck, especially the DOKA cab, may not be a bad idea. The slightly shorter wheelbase and turning circle are nice in Europe and some Andean villages.

Want a vehicle for US/Canada/Mexico to Panamá? Get a 550 series truck. I really like the Chevrolet/GMC. Get gasoline as opposed to diesel. This is based on the purchase cost, cost of diesel fuel, and maintenance. That said, the stump pulling power of the Duramax hi-tech diesel is wonderful! I was actually surprised at the lack of torque on the 1990 170hp diesel. I thought that all German engines were torque monsters. I was wrong.

Ride quality? My Chevrolet 3500 based camper rode MUCH better than the MB - highway or dirt road. No comparison. BUT, the MB carries a slightly larger camper without being anywhere near the weight limit. How big a camper do you want? (Translates to how many people, how long?)

I guess it's really hard to quantify ride quality and really subjective. I have only driven the Isuzu us trucks so far. I'm sure it all depends on suspension setup and how noisy each cabin is. I need to get some seat time.

 

[charlieaarons]

SECOND HAND IN54MB SK 1234 AF

Chassis Mercedes-Benz Zetros 2733 6x6 Regular cab Wheel base 4745 mm + 1450 mm ( 186.8“ + 57.1 „ ) Engine Performance 240 kW / 326 hp, Euro 5 (with AdBlue) 6-speed Allison automatic transmission Cruise control Transfer gear-box with off-road reduction All wheel drive with central differential...

unicatexpeditionvehicles.com

For some reason what you read on the link is inaccurate. It’s really a 1999 chassis with Euro 2 motor and manual 12 speed. Gotta click on it.
I believe this was just sold to someone who’s a US citizen and will bring it to Alaska next year.
Hopefully and very probably Unicat has thoroughly checked out the chassis. Unicat is a good example of “you get what you pay for”.

 

[sprocket3]

I admit right now that I have nothing useful to add to this conversation!

But I have to say it is very entertaining to see THE HOOPS some people are willing to jump through to be possibly be mistaken for "European Overlanders"!

There is A LOT of GOOD American hardware out there! But it takes research... It is not like "flipping the page" to the Mercedes "AF" options in their truck book.

View attachment 803813

Like what? A Chevy topkick?

 

[DiploStrat]

SECOND HAND IN54MB SK 1234 AF

Chassis Mercedes-Benz Zetros 2733 6x6 Regular cab Wheel base 4745 mm + 1450 mm ( 186.8“ + 57.1 „ ) Engine Performance 240 kW / 326 hp, Euro 5 (with AdBlue) 6-speed Allison automatic transmission Cruise control Transfer gear-box with off-road reduction All wheel drive with central differential...

unicatexpeditionvehicles.com

For some reason what you read on the link is inaccurate. It’s really a 1999 chassis with Euro 2 motor and manual 12 speed. Gotta click on it.
I believe this was just sold to someone who’s a US citizen and will bring it to Alaska next year.
Hopefully and very probably Unicat has thoroughly checked out the chassis. Unicat is a good example of “you get what you pay for”.

If yer gonna buy one of these beasts, THAT one looks really nice. Ticks a lot of the truck and camper boxes. And, it has UNICAT in the mix. Looks like they built and mounted the box, another plus.

But to the OP, note the replacement springs, fore and aft.