1993 Camel Trophy 200TDI
- Thread starter Tohelluride
- Start date
Disco2Guy
Observer
Webb Arnold's story
It's time to hear Webb's side of the story. He gave me permission to post our email conversations where he tells the truth of what happened. Even the judge recognized that Webb was getting screwed because of the way the law is written.
12/24/2013
Hello Brenton,
Here is the story; Land Rover sold me the 1993 CT Discovery as a thank you for training the US teams for all of those years. Yes, it was in bad shape as it actually blew over on I-70 on the way to the New York Auto Show. I didn't have the funds to repair the body to new, but cared for it's mechanical needs. We used it for years as a snow plow and for training Camel Trophy Teams.
I had the CT Discovery at my brother's farm as he was using it to pull a small disk plow in his horse arena. I didn't need it, as I was building a house at the time. A friend of his asked to borrow it, to use at a local mud bog. My brother allowed this, in exchange for the repair of the ignition switch. Unannounced to me, it sat at this guys place for months.
Without permission from myself or my brother, this now ex-friend of my brothers sold the CT discovery on Craig's list. Brent was at the guys place within 12 hours of it appearing for sale, because he knew what a deal it was for a special vehicle. Brent did in fact purchase the CT Discovery from ex-friend. At this point Brent was a victim. Brent then forged a bill of sale from me to the ex-friend, which was dated 2006, even before we had loaned my brother the discovery! Brent was informed by a Mesa County Sheriff deputy and myself that the vehicle was in fact stolen, to which he replied, "Tough luck, it is mine now."
Brent's forgery and then perjury on the stand this last week, verified that he was no longer a victim. He stated under oath that a Camel Trophy Discovery was worth no more than a "dime a dozen Discovery." I certainly no longer consider him a victim.
I am just trying to recover my Camel car... My son, that was involved growing up very involved in the Team training every year wanted it to stay in the family.
One thing that might help is, a real world +- value of a The Camel Trophy Discovery the winning car for the 1993 Camel Trophy. This is so rare a car that worth is very hard to determine. The guys with in Land Rover Club's are the only people that would have an idea of its value.
Thank You for Your help,
Webb Arnold
Team USA Camel Trophy 1991
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3/27/2014
I send a link about Brent's story to Webb, posted on the CTOC.
http://forum.cameltrophy.co.uk/Forum/index.php?topic=3184.60
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hello Brenton
I am unable to see the post.
But the way Colorado law is, the only person Ican go after is the clown that sold it. He is what lawyers call judgement proof.
He has nothing and does not work so he will never have anything.
So Brent in his lies in court forged docs, is going to keep the car we tried to purchase the car back he said hell no.
some of this i believe comes from the attention he has gotten from the Land Rover Post. He has never had any attention
of any kind he is a real dweeb. The posts have put him on a pedestal that he has never had, and does not want to fall off.
He is part of an illegal sale of a Land Rover, Colorado laws how ever messed up let him keep the car, not to do what the right thing
is. As long as the Land Rover community keeps telling him he did a good thing, he will continue doing the wrong.
If you are ever in the area give me a call would be nice to meet.
Please excuses my bitterness.
Webb Arnol
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Since he didn't have access to the CTOC forum section, I send Webb the post with Brent's side of the story.
Brenton
He has some of the facts correct. But the Car was never given or abandon. There was forgery he never denied it, the seller did.
The part on the Lawyer he is correct, if you are corrupt the get a corrupt lawyer. For the Paper work we kept a faxed copy of Land Rovers invoice
to me in the car for prof of ownership. I have the original and will always own this unit despite corruption with in our system.
I have spoke with a attorney on the matter, if I go on a open forum and tell the truth on this matter I will be open for a more
corruption within the system. I only can hope that some day what goes around comes around.
Webb
It's time to hear Webb's side of the story. He gave me permission to post our email conversations where he tells the truth of what happened. Even the judge recognized that Webb was getting screwed because of the way the law is written.
12/24/2013
Hello Brenton,
Here is the story; Land Rover sold me the 1993 CT Discovery as a thank you for training the US teams for all of those years. Yes, it was in bad shape as it actually blew over on I-70 on the way to the New York Auto Show. I didn't have the funds to repair the body to new, but cared for it's mechanical needs. We used it for years as a snow plow and for training Camel Trophy Teams.
I had the CT Discovery at my brother's farm as he was using it to pull a small disk plow in his horse arena. I didn't need it, as I was building a house at the time. A friend of his asked to borrow it, to use at a local mud bog. My brother allowed this, in exchange for the repair of the ignition switch. Unannounced to me, it sat at this guys place for months.
Without permission from myself or my brother, this now ex-friend of my brothers sold the CT discovery on Craig's list. Brent was at the guys place within 12 hours of it appearing for sale, because he knew what a deal it was for a special vehicle. Brent did in fact purchase the CT Discovery from ex-friend. At this point Brent was a victim. Brent then forged a bill of sale from me to the ex-friend, which was dated 2006, even before we had loaned my brother the discovery! Brent was informed by a Mesa County Sheriff deputy and myself that the vehicle was in fact stolen, to which he replied, "Tough luck, it is mine now."
Brent's forgery and then perjury on the stand this last week, verified that he was no longer a victim. He stated under oath that a Camel Trophy Discovery was worth no more than a "dime a dozen Discovery." I certainly no longer consider him a victim.
I am just trying to recover my Camel car... My son, that was involved growing up very involved in the Team training every year wanted it to stay in the family.
One thing that might help is, a real world +- value of a The Camel Trophy Discovery the winning car for the 1993 Camel Trophy. This is so rare a car that worth is very hard to determine. The guys with in Land Rover Club's are the only people that would have an idea of its value.
Thank You for Your help,
Webb Arnold
Team USA Camel Trophy 1991
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3/27/2014
I send a link about Brent's story to Webb, posted on the CTOC.
http://forum.cameltrophy.co.uk/Forum/index.php?topic=3184.60
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hello Brenton
I am unable to see the post.
But the way Colorado law is, the only person Ican go after is the clown that sold it. He is what lawyers call judgement proof.
He has nothing and does not work so he will never have anything.
So Brent in his lies in court forged docs, is going to keep the car we tried to purchase the car back he said hell no.
some of this i believe comes from the attention he has gotten from the Land Rover Post. He has never had any attention
of any kind he is a real dweeb. The posts have put him on a pedestal that he has never had, and does not want to fall off.
He is part of an illegal sale of a Land Rover, Colorado laws how ever messed up let him keep the car, not to do what the right thing
is. As long as the Land Rover community keeps telling him he did a good thing, he will continue doing the wrong.
If you are ever in the area give me a call would be nice to meet.
Please excuses my bitterness.
Webb Arnol
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Since he didn't have access to the CTOC forum section, I send Webb the post with Brent's side of the story.
Brenton
He has some of the facts correct. But the Car was never given or abandon. There was forgery he never denied it, the seller did.
The part on the Lawyer he is correct, if you are corrupt the get a corrupt lawyer. For the Paper work we kept a faxed copy of Land Rovers invoice
to me in the car for prof of ownership. I have the original and will always own this unit despite corruption with in our system.
I have spoke with a attorney on the matter, if I go on a open forum and tell the truth on this matter I will be open for a more
corruption within the system. I only can hope that some day what goes around comes around.
Webb
Tohelluride
I like wheel'in around!
It is true. I saw a diesel that was worth money, I still thought it was a fake CT disco or something. I didn't think it was really worth that much. I had a couple of offers, if it was the Real Winning truck, but at that time I did not know for sure if it was real. I was wondering if it was, because then I could make some money and pursue missing parts. So I did my research and found Webb through Tom Collins. When I called, he said it was stolen. It was NOT reported stolen on the Colorado vin check before I purchased the vehicle. I also received what looked to be real documents, unaltered. Then he called the sheriff and said it was stolen. But Webb had not mentioned that I had documents. Then when he received my documents, he thought it could be a forgery. The Sherriff was no expert on forgery and did not let this go through due process, which is illegal. I protect my right.
The whole part of "Me" forging documents is false and straight slander, and he has zero proof of that. My girlfriend was present when I received the documents/vehicle from Bob and testified on stand. Also, Webb claimed my documents were real in court And presented no evidence to back up this "Original Document", actually ZERO evidence at all. Not only that, there is the sheriffs report, that is open to public if requested, that sates that webb's brother admitted to trying to sell it with Bob. Point the finger all you want, the brother is not innocent.
Either way, it is still legal for sale.
Also: Dweeb, lol? Really.... He is to the point of name calling.....
Last edited:
grimbo
Explorer
Not really I know lots of people, myself included, who have stored vehicles that mean much to us at other peoples property and they have never been sold without our authority.
Sell it back at purchase price if you think you have done nothing dodgy.
Viggen
Just here...
But $2000 =/= $35000
CamelDave9
New member
Holly Molly I had no idea what a mess. Webb is a salt of the Earth kind of guy. I want to buy the damn thing back and give it back to him.
Viggen
Just here...
Since you know him, why not see what he wants to do?
The Rover Shop
Explorer
I'm glad the truth has finally came out here.. I couldn't say anything as it wasn't my place to tell Webbs side of the story... I have copped flack like no tomorrow because everybody was basing it on the sellers side of the story, which naturally made Webb out to be the bad guy who abandoned his truck like it was some piece of trash... This and so much more has come out on the defender source thread too.. I think Webb should have his vehicle returned to him.. Anybody know a good attorney well versed in Colorado law that could throw some time to it.. I would be glad to contribute to the fund.. Let's get this guy back his piece of history that has been stolen from him...
Red90
Adventurer
The other side of the story came out. Nobody knows the "truth". There are always three versions of a story. Party 1, party 2 and the real story....
The Rover Shop
Explorer
There is a lot more that has come out on the defender source thread...
http://www.defendersource.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46213&page=13
http://www.defendersource.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46213&page=13
mtnbike28
Expedition Leader
Seems like public opinion and first court ruling is on the side of the current owner. Even on the link Rover Shop posted.... it does seem they gave up on the truck.... loaning such a "valuable" truck to a mud bog (if not to compete, then what, pull out stuck trucks? That seems worse)
I am sure many "barn finds" over the years have ex-owners wishing they could get them back.....
I am sure many "barn finds" over the years have ex-owners wishing they could get them back.....
The Rover Shop
Explorer
Yes.. But did you see the bit where it was not the owner that lent it to this mud bog guy... As far as the owner knew it was sitting happily at his brothers place... The owner was totally unaware that it was at someone else's place.. And the owner was totally unaware that it was being sold..the first he heard of it was when the purchaser got in touch with him to see if there were any more spares for it...