Adventure Van on a Budget - ‘98 Econoline
- Thread starter CLM
- Start date
Congrats on the Acquisition, and Props on the execution of your build. ALWAYS impressed by “Built Not Bought”. While I am not building a van out, I am still doing some ‘parallel’ design, and hope that I can gain (objective) insight from you and those following your Build Thread. I say ‘objective’, because to date, the only opinions that I’ve collected (other sites) are from those pushing/selling product.
I am building out my Jeep Cherokee XJ to (live) in. Not totally by choice, which, as implied, means that Co$t is Very Much a consideration. But, in recognition to You, I prefer to do my own work. There is a Build Thread which details several aspects of his build that I am emulating. But, he doesn’t Reply, and leaves out specifics that I seek.
Back to You .... can you detail the “House” electrical build ? My Jeep is VERY Space-Constrained, and again ... the Budget ....
I plan to run a Smaller “Cranking” battery (BCI 51R) and Mount it under floor at framerail in an enclosure. In stock Battery tray, I will use an oversized Deep Cycle (BCI 34) for “House” (compact fridge, Inverter, Induction cooktop, coffeemaker ...). The heavy AWG wire, Fuses, etc. I have courtesy of BMWs at PickNPull. Possible higher amperage Alternator. But .... Safe Battery Mgmt .... ?
How did you plan yours ? You don’t cut corners, but don’t spend $s just for the “bling”. I cannot afford a $400 Management device (homeless...). I know a little about VSRs (Voltage Sensitive Relays), less about DC-DC Chargers, even less about Smart Battery Mgmt devices ($$$s).
The Deep Cycle House battery has a different charging ‘profile’ than the smallish Cranking battery. The Deep Cycle is “harder” to charge to full capacity from (just) Alternator, and will be compromised if repeatedly charged to only partial.
Your opinions, (or others’) would be Great ! Perhaps when Life eases up, I can take on a Van build using Yours as inspiration ...
Thank You
I am building out my Jeep Cherokee XJ to (live) in. Not totally by choice, which, as implied, means that Co$t is Very Much a consideration. But, in recognition to You, I prefer to do my own work. There is a Build Thread which details several aspects of his build that I am emulating. But, he doesn’t Reply, and leaves out specifics that I seek.
Back to You .... can you detail the “House” electrical build ? My Jeep is VERY Space-Constrained, and again ... the Budget ....
I plan to run a Smaller “Cranking” battery (BCI 51R) and Mount it under floor at framerail in an enclosure. In stock Battery tray, I will use an oversized Deep Cycle (BCI 34) for “House” (compact fridge, Inverter, Induction cooktop, coffeemaker ...). The heavy AWG wire, Fuses, etc. I have courtesy of BMWs at PickNPull. Possible higher amperage Alternator. But .... Safe Battery Mgmt .... ?
How did you plan yours ? You don’t cut corners, but don’t spend $s just for the “bling”. I cannot afford a $400 Management device (homeless...). I know a little about VSRs (Voltage Sensitive Relays), less about DC-DC Chargers, even less about Smart Battery Mgmt devices ($$$s).
The Deep Cycle House battery has a different charging ‘profile’ than the smallish Cranking battery. The Deep Cycle is “harder” to charge to full capacity from (just) Alternator, and will be compromised if repeatedly charged to only partial.
Your opinions, (or others’) would be Great ! Perhaps when Life eases up, I can take on a Van build using Yours as inspiration ...
Thank You
Rico, I will try my best, but I'm by no means an expert. I started out wanting super simple and cost-effective, yet ran into some of the same info you probably have.
So plans changed a little, but I tried to keep four goals in mind:
- cost
- simplicity
- isolation
- keeping the fan running to cool the van in warm weather
Some of the things that changed my path are like you mentioned:
- deep cycles charge differently than the regular starting battery
- AGM batteries don't require venting, so I could mount inside
- most of the automatic isolators fail at some point
- larger alternators are similarly priced to 100 watts of solar
What I plan on running (which I think you named off way more than one battery can handle):
- LED lighting
- Maxx Air Fan
- USB chargers for phones and devices
I'm not running an invertor or anything that normally needs 110volt.
What I ended up with:
- Sam's Club, Duracell Platinum AGM 31DTMAGM and reasons why:
* Easy to find Sam's for replacement
* Cost (about $211 out the door without core) which was much cheaper than any other deep cycle AGM I could find
* Yes, it is a combo (deep cycle/cranking) battery, but I felt after doing the calculations that it would be fine
- 100 Watt Renogy Solar kit with the controller (about $200 on Amazon)
* Great reviews with a quality controller, however, it only has 3 LEDs telling you what type of battery, if the battery is charging or charged and if you are getting solar
* Everything needed to start charging a battery with Solar
- 5 switch panel with volts and USB chargers
* I can only see volts, so I can't see how much solar is coming in or how much power is going out. I tried to size the system where I didn't think I would have to watch it closely
* 1 switch cuts the power to the voltmeter and USB chargers
* I switched three sets of lights separately
* 1 switch to cut power to the fan
* I basically wanted to be able to open the door and reach switches to cut power to everything
- Fuse panel so each switch has a fuse
- Main battery switch between the cranking battery and deep cycle
* This allows me to flip the switch on and let the alternator charge the deep cycle while driving, but let's me isolate everything the rest of the time.
* I used a manual switch so that it is user error if the front battery gets drained, not from the failure of a cheap isolator
As for wiring the van
- Used grommets or rubber isolation anytime I needed to pass through metal
- Heat shrink connectors for extra security
- Made sure everything is fused to prevent a short and has a switch to cut power
Backup plan
- I can always add a larger alternator if I find that I am not getting enough power to keep the fan running and van cool.
- I could also add a small 110volt battery charger if I think I would ever be staying close enough to power to plug in.
Hope that helps. As I said, I'm not an expert, just did a bunch of reading on deep cycle and solar, searched for power draws on the things I wanted to power and ran the online calculators to see what I would need, then combined that with what I knew already about wiring 12volt or a boat/vehicle. I've built a couple of boats and completely wired those as well as cars.
So plans changed a little, but I tried to keep four goals in mind:
- cost
- simplicity
- isolation
- keeping the fan running to cool the van in warm weather
Some of the things that changed my path are like you mentioned:
- deep cycles charge differently than the regular starting battery
- AGM batteries don't require venting, so I could mount inside
- most of the automatic isolators fail at some point
- larger alternators are similarly priced to 100 watts of solar
What I plan on running (which I think you named off way more than one battery can handle):
- LED lighting
- Maxx Air Fan
- USB chargers for phones and devices
I'm not running an invertor or anything that normally needs 110volt.
What I ended up with:
- Sam's Club, Duracell Platinum AGM 31DTMAGM and reasons why:
* Easy to find Sam's for replacement
* Cost (about $211 out the door without core) which was much cheaper than any other deep cycle AGM I could find
* Yes, it is a combo (deep cycle/cranking) battery, but I felt after doing the calculations that it would be fine
- 100 Watt Renogy Solar kit with the controller (about $200 on Amazon)
* Great reviews with a quality controller, however, it only has 3 LEDs telling you what type of battery, if the battery is charging or charged and if you are getting solar
* Everything needed to start charging a battery with Solar
- 5 switch panel with volts and USB chargers
* I can only see volts, so I can't see how much solar is coming in or how much power is going out. I tried to size the system where I didn't think I would have to watch it closely
* 1 switch cuts the power to the voltmeter and USB chargers
* I switched three sets of lights separately
* 1 switch to cut power to the fan
* I basically wanted to be able to open the door and reach switches to cut power to everything
- Fuse panel so each switch has a fuse
- Main battery switch between the cranking battery and deep cycle
* This allows me to flip the switch on and let the alternator charge the deep cycle while driving, but let's me isolate everything the rest of the time.
* I used a manual switch so that it is user error if the front battery gets drained, not from the failure of a cheap isolator
As for wiring the van
- Used grommets or rubber isolation anytime I needed to pass through metal
- Heat shrink connectors for extra security
- Made sure everything is fused to prevent a short and has a switch to cut power
Backup plan
- I can always add a larger alternator if I find that I am not getting enough power to keep the fan running and van cool.
- I could also add a small 110volt battery charger if I think I would ever be staying close enough to power to plug in.
Hope that helps. As I said, I'm not an expert, just did a bunch of reading on deep cycle and solar, searched for power draws on the things I wanted to power and ran the online calculators to see what I would need, then combined that with what I knew already about wiring 12volt or a boat/vehicle. I've built a couple of boats and completely wired those as well as cars.
First trip in the books. Van did great and we stayed warm for the night in 29 degree windy weather. Bed was super comfortable. Think we might go down to a smaller buddy heater, it was a little too warm even on low and went thru a bottle of propane every 5 hours. We averaged 12 mpg for the trip.
GregSplett
Adventurer
I need to thank you for taking the time to document your build. It has really helped me plan out mine. I almost pulled the trigger on your bed design yesterday but changed my mind at the last minute. Did not stop the wife from going to Ikea though! I am going with your mattress though. Funny how husbands know how good or bad the guest bedroom bed is? lol, mine sucks.
I decided to keep the alternator for my charging but am going to pre-wire for solar later. Mine came with a second small battery in the factory frame rail location. It is only used for starting if the starting battery gets drained to a certain level, the house runs off the starting battery.There is a small dial switch on the steering collum that brings the second battery up if it won't start.I am going to adapt this to my house needs. I am going to add shore power wiring also, mostly so I can run a small heater and maintain the batteries during storage.
I am not taking down my headliner at this stage, I just do not want to mess with it.I think I am going to keep the a/c venting through the roof vents but do the heater like yours. I may delete the rear heater if it means I can get rid of this.....
https://www.amazon.com/Gates-22318-...adiator+hose&qid=1540225798&sr=8-8&ref=sr_1_8
Brother in law says these lower coolant hose likes to blow. He carried a spare. He maintains a fleet of fords on top of owning the van prior.
Right now mine is stripped to the headliner. and the floor is insulated and sound deaded with subfloor down. Hopefully next weekend I will be at my uncle's tranny shop using a lift to rebuild the steering linkages and replacing the shocks.I also need to take a look at the differential, same as yours L/s 3.55, I am afraid it needs some love too.
I did take mine for a three hundred mile cruise a couple of weeks ago. Seats stripped but loaded with gear for a week of camping. All high way but maybe forty on logging roads and averaged 16 miles to the gallon. Kind of surprised me.I have a 08 f150 3V that got nineteen on the same trip.
I decided to keep the alternator for my charging but am going to pre-wire for solar later. Mine came with a second small battery in the factory frame rail location. It is only used for starting if the starting battery gets drained to a certain level, the house runs off the starting battery.There is a small dial switch on the steering collum that brings the second battery up if it won't start.I am going to adapt this to my house needs. I am going to add shore power wiring also, mostly so I can run a small heater and maintain the batteries during storage.
I am not taking down my headliner at this stage, I just do not want to mess with it.I think I am going to keep the a/c venting through the roof vents but do the heater like yours. I may delete the rear heater if it means I can get rid of this.....
https://www.amazon.com/Gates-22318-...adiator+hose&qid=1540225798&sr=8-8&ref=sr_1_8
Brother in law says these lower coolant hose likes to blow. He carried a spare. He maintains a fleet of fords on top of owning the van prior.
Right now mine is stripped to the headliner. and the floor is insulated and sound deaded with subfloor down. Hopefully next weekend I will be at my uncle's tranny shop using a lift to rebuild the steering linkages and replacing the shocks.I also need to take a look at the differential, same as yours L/s 3.55, I am afraid it needs some love too.
I did take mine for a three hundred mile cruise a couple of weeks ago. Seats stripped but loaded with gear for a week of camping. All high way but maybe forty on logging roads and averaged 16 miles to the gallon. Kind of surprised me.I have a 08 f150 3V that got nineteen on the same trip.
Greg, lol, luckily my spare bed time is spent early in the morning watching my car shows when I’m letting the queen sleep in.
I have to be honest, the heater hoses are the only thing on this van that I don’t trust. I’ll replace the ones running back to the rear heater at some point, but if the ac lines running back there ever fail, I’m removing the unit. My rear heat and ac is all one unit and uses the same vents. They blow cooler air this way than they did thru the roof.
Also, I have decided to add shore power, mainly to run an electric heater when I have somewhere to plug in. The three bottles of propane this weekend made me decide that.
I wished mine had the second battery on the frame rail, but I laid under there measuring and just couldn’t find a good spot with the lowered floor.
Only other time I had checked mileage was local driving and I got 14mpg. So I was surpised the highway mileage was down from that. But she apparently doesn’t like highway speeds and wind.
I have to be honest, the heater hoses are the only thing on this van that I don’t trust. I’ll replace the ones running back to the rear heater at some point, but if the ac lines running back there ever fail, I’m removing the unit. My rear heat and ac is all one unit and uses the same vents. They blow cooler air this way than they did thru the roof.
Also, I have decided to add shore power, mainly to run an electric heater when I have somewhere to plug in. The three bottles of propane this weekend made me decide that.
I wished mine had the second battery on the frame rail, but I laid under there measuring and just couldn’t find a good spot with the lowered floor.
Only other time I had checked mileage was local driving and I got 14mpg. So I was surpised the highway mileage was down from that. But she apparently doesn’t like highway speeds and wind.
Big news! We have a title, it arrived today! So we bought the van with a rebuilt title from IL, it had been wrecked 10 years ago. I could see where they spot welded a few places under the hood when the pulled the metal straight and replaced a fender (no big deal). Sticker on the windshield and b-pillar saying rebuilt and inspected by IL Highway Patrol. Well, three months after applying for the title (in Missouri) I realize that it had never arrived. Took my receipt down to the license office to see what is up and after 30 minutes she ask me “did the title say anything”. Yeah, rebuilt. Well, appparently it was wrecked with a Missouri title and the last title they had on record was salvage. So, I pay $27.50 for a form and then wait 2 weeks to receive the other forms telling me why they wouldn’t give me a title (dated the day I was at the license office). I wait a couple weeks until my schedule opens up and call to make an appointment for the Missouri highway patrol to inspect it, which the first one available was a month out. So I take that day off work, go spend half my day driving down and waiting for them to inspect. Get the forms all mailed to Jeff City. Now three weeks later I have a title finally. Only took 6+ months. I really hate the Missouri DOR/DMV!!
GregSplett
Adventurer
I would have never guessed that Missouri had vehicle inspections after five years. Looks like you have a bill in front of you that would end that nonsense.
They blow cooler air this way than they did thru the roof. ......I am surprised they even blow cold after traveling the length of the van uninsulated.I came as close as I could get to driving a screw into one of the a/c lines last night. Giggled thinking It might have been a blessing in disguise. We have the same unit
I have three or four of the buddy heaters of different sizes. My go to is the original little red one. It sips propane. I have a hunters one that chews through a five lb bottle overnight.
I gave up on the frame rail location last night for the same reasons. The secondary battery I have now is a small critter and it is going to be an operation just to get to that. Because I am sticking with the alternator I am going to go behind the driver's seat in the house. I ran wire last night to put a master switch for the house like yous. Just reach in and shut it all off. Like it. I live in the Olympic mountains of Wa. I am not confident in solar as a primary here.
Here in western Washington are lucky to have a speed limit of 60 mph on the Highway. Even at 60 you can feel the vacuum on the rear of the van come and go. Combine that with a fifteen headwind and it is a strange drive for sure.
They blow cooler air this way than they did thru the roof. ......I am surprised they even blow cold after traveling the length of the van uninsulated.I came as close as I could get to driving a screw into one of the a/c lines last night. Giggled thinking It might have been a blessing in disguise. We have the same unit
I have three or four of the buddy heaters of different sizes. My go to is the original little red one. It sips propane. I have a hunters one that chews through a five lb bottle overnight.
I gave up on the frame rail location last night for the same reasons. The secondary battery I have now is a small critter and it is going to be an operation just to get to that. Because I am sticking with the alternator I am going to go behind the driver's seat in the house. I ran wire last night to put a master switch for the house like yous. Just reach in and shut it all off. Like it. I live in the Olympic mountains of Wa. I am not confident in solar as a primary here.
Here in western Washington are lucky to have a speed limit of 60 mph on the Highway. Even at 60 you can feel the vacuum on the rear of the van come and go. Combine that with a fifteen headwind and it is a strange drive for sure.
Corneilius
Adventurer
this thing turned out awesome. great work