An LR3 on the Rubicon

[JAK]

Don,

Thanks. I have been looking at the design of the OE bushing at that joint and see that it looks like it is designed to give radially (along the direction of the a-arm tube). This means that there could be inherent binding in the geometry of suspension or to provide for manufacturing tolerances to be taken out by this bushing during movement. This would explain why the metal sleeve failed and not the weld. There is a bending moment in the sleeve along the joints axis. Basically the upper a-arm is trying to move in and out while it is going up and down. The poly bushing restrains this movement and the part eventually fatigues and cracks out.

Do you recall how much your bushing "creaked" during suspension travel? I wonder if this could be an indicator of more binding. Only my rear bushings creak. I am thinking now that this is not so much about tire size or vehicle weight but suspension geometry. It may be a good time to change those bushings to RRS bushings instead of the polys.

Thanks again,
Jeremy

 

[acmcgaha]

I think 35s on a LR3 is doable...but a completely new suspension would be required. New arms, knuckles, CVs, then cutting.

At that point, doing the "body lift" like that guy wit the RRS seems to make more sense. I think he was able to fit 35s. I'd prefer to re-gear, going that tall, dunno what the aftermarket gear availability is for these trucks.

There are no current "shorter" gears available for the LR3.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

 

[acmcgaha]

Don, while I haven't attempted the Rubicon... Yet... ... I would love to swap stories some time. I have put 35's on my '05 LR3 (you only live once right), and did some "rock crawling" with a local Off Road Club here in Memphis (99'ish % Jeep) and over 2 days broke both front inner tie rods. I'm putting in lockers now so hopefully I can crawl more, but wouldn't consider the driving overly aggressive that caused the failures. I'm working with a couple of companies to design a beefier inner - I'll post if I figure something out - and FYI, not common knowledge, but also not a secret, per RCV, Lucky 8 and them are close on an HD axle for LR3.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

 

[morrisdl]

The supercharged RRS has enough power to turn 35"s. It also has "disconnecting" hydraulic sway bars. Just wish there were some slider, sliders, and bumper options for the RRS.

 

[Victory_Overland]

It also has "disconnecting" hydraulic sway bars.

Interesting! Why would the put hydraulic disconnecting sway bars on the RRS? How does that work?

 

[zelatore]

I've been away from ExPo for quite a while recently but just checked back in to see this old topic had drifted back to the top.

Actually just came back from playing on the Rubicon over father's day, but this time I took the D1. It's _sooo_ much easier than the LR3!

Regarding 'having the power' to turn 35s...it's not just a matter of power. If you've spent much time in the rocks you'll know gearing is where it's at. Yes power is important but gearing is more important. It's simply more controlled. I don't care if you're in a 500 hp supercharged rig, you still want the control of deep gears. That's a major drawback of the LR3 platform when you start going to bigger tires.

Comparing my D1 to my LR3 in the rocks is hardly fair. The approach, departure, and ESPECIALLY the break-over angels are so much better in the D1 it's not even funny. The LR3 has it's advantages though, particularly it's tigher turning radius, the better body control (less chance of bouncing around into a wall), and the lack of low-hanging diffs are all good. But not enough to make up for the drawbacks.

I believe it's possible to push the LR3 platform past where I've taken it (literally and figuratively) but at this point I don't need to. I actually haven't been driving the LR3 much at all - my last outing with it was Death Valley a few months ago, where the long road sections, high temps, and mild wheeling made it a good companion. But at least for a while yet the D1 is getting all the love. I'll actually have it out this Saturday for some play-time up at Prairie City with the club on our regular MORG. Any of you in the area are welcome to stop by. I should be easy to spot - not too many other topless Discos around.

 

[morrisdl]

Interesting! Why would the put hydraulic disconnecting sway bars on the RRS? How does that work?

Like most of the vehicle, its wasn't primarily designed for offroading. The hydraulic sway bars primary purpose it to sense cornering situations and tighten up by closing the valves. Then on straight roads it opens up to more gently absorb bumps. It does unlock when the Terrain Response is in Rock Crawl (and possibly other modes). When its open, it can easily accommodate the full range of suspension so essentially just its like disconnected sway bars.

It does a great job at serving opposing needs, but the down side it one more complicated and expense system that wears out around 100k miles!

 

[jymmiejamz]

Like most of the vehicle, its wasn't primarily designed for offroading. The hydraulic sway bars primary purpose it to sense cornering situations and tighten up by closing the valves. Then on straight roads it opens up to more gently absorb bumps. It does unlock when the Terrain Response is in Rock Crawl (and possibly other modes). When its open, it can easily accommodate the full range of suspension so essentially just its like disconnected sway bars.

This isn't quite how you put it, but you are close. The system is inactive at speeds under 2mph, regardless of Terrain Response mode. The system uses the accelerometers to determine if the vehicle is off road which limits the force applied to the sway bars when you are under 25mph.

Another cool thing it does is when you are in an off camber situation it will effective "lock" the sway bars to prevent excessive lean.

It does a great job at serving opposing needs, but the down side it one more complicated and expense system that wears out around 100k miles!

While it is a more complicated system, it doesn't "wear out" with the exception of the bushings. Sure, it can have problems, but most of them are minor. The most expensive one is leaks from the active sway bars.

 

[Victory_Overland]

Thanks for the explanation guys. Yeah, seems like a decent system with a lot of thought behind it. Not sure I would want it on my vehicle but if a manufacturer puts something like that into an innovative design process, well then I give them props for that for sure.

My sway bar bushings and links are destroyed on my LR3. They will be replaced in the coming weeks along with the rest of the worn out parts.

Cheers

 

[morrisdl]

I took my rear sway bar off and dont miss it. It definitely added a little more flex. I dont daily drive the LR3 anymore, so YMMV.

 

[pmatusov]

ha... I haven't seen your write-up, Don, until Conal posted a link on FB - I can only imagine what it was like in an LR3.
I guess I should put on hold the plans to inherit the LR4 from my wife and turn it into a crawler.

And I didn't realize just how many obstacles we have bypassed last September until you pointed them out. Still not sure if I should do it again in the same D1 - definitely not without at least one locker.

 

[Dino6912]

Just because you can doesn’t mean you should
The Rubicon – that’s a name to inspire dreams! Unquestionably the most famous trail in the country and possibly the world, the Rubicon is on every off-roader’s bucket list. It’s certainly been on mine for a while now.

——————-
Wow! That is a great story…an enjoyable read. I have an LR4 and I have the same itch. I really want to run the Rubicon Trail in my 2012 LR4. Looks like I will have to opt for the ARB front lockers after reading your story. Interested in going again? ? I’d like to tackle the trail with other Land Rovers.

 

[bri]

Just because you can doesn’t mean you should
The Rubicon – that’s a name to inspire dreams! Unquestionably the most famous trail in the country and possibly the world, the Rubicon is on every off-roader’s bucket list. It’s certainly been on mine for a while now.

——————-
Wow! That is a great story…an enjoyable read. I have an LR4 and I have the same itch. I really want to run the Rubicon Trail in my 2012 LR4. Looks like I will have to opt for the ARB front lockers after reading your story. Interested in going again? ? I’d like to tackle the trail with other Land Rovers.

 

[bri]

" I really want to run the Rubicon Trail in my 2012 LR4."

Any particular reason you wish to destroy your LR4?

 

[TexasTJ]

It’s been done if I remember he broke the front end and it was a job getting it fixed in the wild.