Aperture 3 from Apple - Released

[Lost Canadian]

Check this out.
Straight out of camera flat RAW's converted to jpg. All 4 sport different profiles. 1) Adobe Standard, 2) D2XI, 3) Neutral, and 4) Aperture's. Aperture's profile is sporting a really heavy tonal curve. It looks nice straight away but I prefer to start as flat as possible and work in any contrast and saturation. With Aperture's profile I will have to pull back the highlights and bump the shadows up a tad. It looks nice, plugging the file straight in that is, perhaps that is what Apple had in mind. It's certainly a different way of working for me.

 

[Ryanmb21]

Trevor - that is an interesting comparison.

 

[Michael Slade]

Here's my advice:

Make a commitment and then learn the tool. All this switching around and comparing will do nothing but waste your time. Quit spinning your wheels and start moving.

 

[Lost Canadian]

Here's my advice:

Make a commitment and then learn the tool. All this switching around and comparing will do nothing but waste your time. Quit spinning your wheels and start moving.

Spinning my wheels? Wasting time? What's the hurry? I'm just looking. You wouldn't buy a car without taking it for a test drive would you? Not to mention I'm a hobbiest, not everything I do needs to be stuffy and serious, sometimes it's nice to just sit back and play with new toys ya know. That's all this is. Just playing around and trying to figure out what works best for me. If I share my thoughts along the way and others share theirs who cares?

 

[nwoods]

If I share my thoughts along the way and others share theirs who cares?

I do. I appreciate the sharing of thoughts and expereinces very much!

 

[Michael Slade]

Spinning my wheels? Wasting time? What's the hurry? I'm just looking. You wouldn't buy a car without taking it for a test drive would you? Not to mention I'm a hobbiest, not everything I do needs to be stuffy and serious, sometimes it's nice to just sit back and play with new toys ya know. That's all this is. Just playing around and trying to figure out what works best for me. If I share my thoughts along the way and others share theirs who cares?

Oh no it's not a criticism of kicking the tires...I'm just saying that the longer you delay a decision, the further you put off mastering the tool. Kick the tires all you want. The internet is full of photographers who haven't taken any pictures because they are waiting for the next and best-est version of Camera X.

You are not in that category because you are already photographing a lot. I just see that there is a potential with any given purchase to put it off due to research and indecision. There comes a point when what you've purchased will be a long-term commitment and you have to knuckle down and learn the tool. Switching back and forth because you are tempted by feature Y and component Z is very dangerous.

I remember back when Nikon gave me my one of the very first D1 cameras. I stuck with their system through all of it's ups and downs...even during times of very bitter disappointment with their product and generally bad corporate attitude towards the customer base. I knew if I went back and forth all I would be doing was spending a lot of money and having to re-learn a system and losing time. I am glad I have not vacillated the way a lot of early digital shooters did.

I did find your color space illustration very interesting. I spent all afternoon re-calibrating Trinitron CRT's in my digital lab.

Tire kicking is fun. Good luck making an informed decision you can stick with for a while. Knowing it is a long-term commitment makes the initial decision that much more important.

 

[Lost Canadian]

Well it's only day 4 or 5 of the 30 day trial, and I think I have a pretty good idea of what's in store for LR3, so this will more than likely be it for me as far as looking goes. If I hadn't switched systems this would be a non issue, but now that I'm working on a Mac I figured I'd give Aperture a fair shake while waiting for the next incarnation of Lightroom. When LR comes out of beta in the next month or so I'll have a choice between an upgrade to LR3 or jumping ship,...at that point I will most certainly make up my mind.

Sony CRT's eh. Cool. Too big for my working area but I know there are still a lot of guys and gals who dig them. Is it their tonal range?

 

[nwoods]

I found this to be interesting. Here is a link to some free presets:
http://www.apertureland.com/about-aperture/free-aperture-3-presets/

Here is a interesting comparison about Aperature vs Lightroom RAW:
http://fadedandblurred.com/blog/15-general/69-aperture-3-raw-comparison


Here is the interesting photo from this blog: http://photo.rwboyer.com/2010/02/10/aperture-3-nikon-nef-free-preset/

 

[Lost Canadian]

With regards to the second link, I'd like to know if he kept the auto noise reduction in Aperture enabled, as it's defaulted to on in the raw panel. I'm going to assume so with this comment:

This is a straight import, with the default settings on each of the applications

Problem is luminance noise reduction in both LR2 and beta 3 is defaulted at zero, so if noise reduction is being applied to the Aperture file by default it's not really a straight comparison. The beta 3 does appear to be holding the most detail and the noise structure is nice, not blotchy like LR 2. Clearly the Aperture file is the cleanest, but I would put an asterisk next to this comparison.

With the pictures I do see a difference but it's not a lot. The second set on the right looks a little brighter in the shadows although the sky is a little more blown out, and they are a tad warmer. There's some weird halo thing going on with the girls head in the photo on the left. Compression artifacts I'm guessing. Do you know which one is a preset? I'm guessing the one on the right. Pretty good either way.

 

[DiploStrat]

Zen and the Art of Color Digital Photography

Trevor,

I'm with Mike Slade on this; Pick one and be happy. I went with Aperture in 2006 and have never looked back. (Happily it was AP 1.5; AP 1 was very rocky in the RAW department.) When LR3b came out I downloaded it and played with it a bit to see if it would knock my socks off. It didn't. I tried the different profiles and didn't find them that useful. I found that it blew highlights that weren't an issue with AP. I missed my full screen editing and soft proofing. But the biggest, most overwhelming reason not to switch was that I wasn’t very good with the software. How could I be? I was a total newbie. One the other hand, I have been using AP for years and have barely begun to plumb the depths of what it can do. Lightroom has nothing approaching light tables or books. But I have never used either feature, so it doesn't matter to me.

Bottom line, put up a bunch of images and I guarantee that you will not be able to tell what brand of camera was used, much less which software. It is a bit like the Canon vs. Nikon debate – pick the one that works for you and don’t worry about me. While I am clearly a Nikon/Aperture phanboi, we are all being silly - there is no "objective" proof that one is better than the other. Lightroom sells more. So does that mean you should switch back to a PC because they sell more? Pick the one that feels right and grow with it.

Minor, pedantic note, Lightroom 3b defaults to a ton of noise reduction in the RAW development module – just look on the second screen of the “Development” panel. (Also does a bunch of other things as well.) Remember there is noise reduction and there is noise reduction as there is sharpening and more sharpening; these are applied, by default in the RAW development or converter module and they appear again in the edit/adjustment modules. This is easy to see in Aperture as each of the “bricks” is stacked top to bottom, in the order in which it is applied. In LR, Luminance noise reduction, in the edits area, does indeed default to zero (In fact, in my beta copy, it was not yet implemented.) but there is most certainly noise reduction in the RAW module.

The problems with Aperture 3 stem from massive underlying changes in the Apple software architecture. With Snow Leopard and a bunch of other things in the OS, Apple is getting ready to really use multi core machines. In many ways, this was a terrible time to try to spring a new release but, I suspect, the noise from the "is Aperture dead" crowd was just too much. AP3's feature set is impressive; its performance issues a tremendous embarrassment for Apple. (This is a Mac, things are supposed to “just work.”) I have every confidence that AP3.X will fix the problem and fortunately it is easy for me to wait.

PAX! You need a break – go take some pictures!

 

[Lost Canadian]

Geesh you guys are pushy. I haven't had the trial of Aperture for a week, Lightroom 3 is yet to be released, and I have to choose,... like right now, jumpin!! I am well versed with LR, and NX2 for that matter, but I'd like to give Aperture it's fair shake before I decide on either an update for Lightroom or a switch to Aperture. I am trying to decide if I like Aperture enough to make the jump, and since this thread is dedicated to Aperture 3 I would love to keep dialogue open. Am I being critical of Aperture, damn right, if I'm going to drop $200 bones on a program you bloody well believe I want to know its goods and bads. In order to really iron things out with what's good with one converter compared to the other I want to look at both critically, and yes I have the time right now to do this so please enough with the harping.

Let me add that I already know where LR falls on it's face and where it shines, what I don't know however is how well it stacks up to Aperture as far as the way I work and the final output. That's the point of this thread is it not, to talk about the program, not simply go gaga over it. I can give everyone a laundry list of things I don't like with LR if it makes people feel better.

Next, with respect the the link posted above what we were looking at was mostly luminance noise, not colour. Lightroom does not apply luminance reduction. I'm not sure what kind of auto reduction Aperture is doing but there's a box checked labelled auto reduction when I open the RAW panel so one only knows. I'm not saying Aperture is being heavy handed or doing much of anything, I'm simply pointing out that it's an unknown factor, at least for me, at this point. More empirical evidence would be nice to see, that is all.

...and I took 23 pictures today, 31 if you count the iPhone shots. How many did you guys take.:elkgrin:

 

[DiploStrat]

Holy Grail!

Dude! Get some sleep!

As for photos taken. None. My day job keeps getting in the way.

Another link for your enjoyment: http://photo.rwboyer.com/2010/02/15/aperture-3-nikon-nef-files-screencast/

Rob Boyer showing how to match hue to make your own profile. The importance of this is that it works with any adjustable RAW developer, not just Aperture.

Let's face it, the ONLY real drawback to Aperture 3 is the question of speed/stability. If you have those issues, you would be wise not to take the plunge until there is a clear update or similar from Apple. AP3 is acting much too beta (or alpha) like for many people. For me, however, it does seem stable and faster than AP2. And the more I use the new features, the more I like them, especially as I do not have to go through the learning curve of switching to LR.

Gotta get back to work! :coffeedrink:

 

[Michael Slade]

I like the CRT b/c of the shadow detail in the blacks and the ability to hold detail in the highlights. I like the Trinitron specifically b/c they have a very nice tube and hold calibration very well. I also like the fact that they are cheap. I don't pay more than $20 for a big 19 inch G520.

I know that sellers don't get any calls for them, so I put my offer in early when I see them come up and then re-offer about 2-3 weeks after making my initial one. I usually end up getting them. I have 20+ Sony Trinitrons in my lab right now.

As for pictures? Yesterday I didn't take any, but I did work on my 11x14 and 8x20 so that I can go make an image this weekend.

Unfortunately I don't get to take pictures every day. Fortunately I am around photography more than most.

 

[Lost Canadian]

Fortunately I am around photography more than most.

Very fortunate my friend. To teach what you love to do is rare.

Dude! Get some sleep

Shift work, gota love it.

Let's face it, the ONLY real drawback to Aperture 3 is the question of speed/stability. If you have those issues, you would be wise not to take the plunge until there is a clear update or similar from Apple. AP3 is acting much too beta (or alpha) like for many people. For me, however, it does seem stable and faster than AP2. And the more I use the new features, the more I like them, especially as I do not have to go through the learning curve of switching to LR.

Honestly, I don't mind learning a new program if it works better for me. Speed and stability aside though there are some things worth looking at. For instance, LR has an awesome gradiant tool with all the adjustments of the brushes, it does split toning, and certain things take a less steps to complete. In Aperture though, the number of adjustments you can brush in is crazy cool, the output of the files look nice, and as I said, as a digital asset manager it's wickedly good. So with Aperture, I gain a few things, loose a few things, gain a way better digital asset manager but lose stability. The D.A.M side of things is a big deal to me because I take a lot of pictures. I place a premium on keeping things organized, but I do want a program that runs good and isn't tweaking out on me every other day. So you see it's not black and white, never is though is it. LOL Like I said , I'll give Aperture it's fair shake, perhaps we just got off on the wrong foot, who knows.

 

[Ryanmb21]

Another cool feature that I haven't used yet but look forward too, is the integration with third party Photo Books.

My wife and I were very happy with our wedding pictures and our photographer offered beatiful albums printed from vendors that do an outstanding work. The downside is was that costs thousands to get them printed in the type of albums we liked. We held off purchasing them through our photog for the time being. (although we did get a DVD of of all the high res images as a part of our package)

I was stoked when I found that I can make my own photo book from Leather Craftsmen with Aperture 3, this might potentially save me thousands on my wedding album.