Best practice for running petrol Honda EU2000i at altitudes of 9,000 - 12,000

[outwestbound]

Hi. I've been researching best practices to deal with altitude on a one-year vehicular expedition to South America, where I'll be going up and down a lot. Here's what I learned so far.

Option 1: Re-jet the carburetor using Honda's 2 options per the "carburetor jetting for high elevations" instructions.
Option 2: Modify the Honda to ALSO burn propane making it a dual fuel generator.

On 1, Honda sets out its initial configuration for 0 - 5,000 feet, than a "first" re-jet for 5,001 to 10,000, then a "second" re-jet from 10,001 to 15,000, per the attached pamphlet. It's plus/minus 1,000 feet overlap. From what I read, implementing the "first" re-jet makes most sense for my use and I'd just let it run a little rich if over 10,000 and re-jet if I returned to sea level. I haven't studied the shop manual, but re-jetting as I go up and down seems a pain. Evidently, running the generator re-jetted at sea level can burn it up, because it runs too lean and over heats.

On 2, this seems good just on it's face, in terms of having flexibility to burn two fuels. More specifically in terms of altitude, I gather it's essential to PREVENT the propane mod kit from using the Honda's carburetor to provide the mix. Rather, the whole point seems to be to allow for manual mixing of air/fuel, on the propane regulator, so that the mix can be adjusted for altitudes. This manual mixing method is claimed to require no re-jetting and provide more power at elevation than a properly jetted 2000i burning gas. This is a big claim I've read and I don't know how viable it is.

Option 2, while more money, seems like a clear winner to me. Also, I have a quick connect propane source in the compartment where the Honda is, because that compartment formerly held an Onan 3.6Kw propane generator. I put a QC on for my grill. Implementing this would be a no-brainer, if it's merits make sense.

Anybody have thoughts about how best to use the Honda EU2000i at altitude? Does option 2 make sense?

Thanks so much!

John

 

[dreadlocks]

Ive got a 2200i, live at 6k feet.. camp at 8-10k feet all summer long and never had any issues with the jets it comes with, still starts on the first pull, ran it many times for 6-8h.. however I'm not running it at full tilt either, 40% tops to recharge batteries.. I can still kick it to full tilt to run a microwave/coffeemaker for <10mins.. are you expecting heavy loads or really long runs? Not like you need Air Conditioning at high altitude.

Option 3: Leave jets alone and just carry a spare spark plug incase you foul it out from running rich, thats all you could do to hurt it at altitude.. I camp between below sea level and 12k feet, this seems like safest option for me.

 

[outwestbound]

Ive got a 2200i, live at 6k feet.. camp at 8-10k feet all summer long and never had any issues with the jets it comes with, still starts on the first pull, ran it many times for 6-8h.. however I'm not running it at full tilt either, 40% tops to recharge batteries.. I can still kick it to full tilt to run a microwave/coffeemaker for <10mins.. are you expecting heavy loads or really long runs? Not like you need Air Conditioning at high altitude.

Option 3: Leave jets alone and just carry a spare spark plug incase you foul it out from running rich, thats all you could do to hurt it at altitude.. I camp between below sea level and 12k feet, this seems like safest option for me.

Thanks for responding. Yes, heavy loads, but not because I'm loading it with devices like microwaves. I live off my inverter/charger, so it I ran the generator, that would be to charge batteries through the inverter/charger, that needs about 8AAC to generate about 40-50ADC to charge the batteries. Based on the attachment to my post, at 13,000 feet, the Honda's performance is de-rated down to 60%. 60% of 13.3 is about 8AAC. If I'm understanding this, I'd be running it wide open to get only 8 amps out of it. BUT, that chart in the attachment assumes the re-jetting has been implemented. It doesn't give a chart for power output running rich having done no re-jetting. I'm concerned that I'd be screwed at 13,000 without re-jetting, because of the inefficiency of running rich. By screwed, I mean I couldn't use my Xantrex charger, or maybe I could let it lower until it started charging. I'm not sure.

In some unverified reading earlier, a fellow claimed that, at altitude, the honda would have more power using LP than gas, even if it was re-jetted. If true, the LP modification could allow over-performing the chart on that Honda document attached, if I understand it right. A marginal difference like this might be useful over 13,000 feet.

 

[BritKLR]

Interesting.....I didn't even know you could get high altitude jets for a Honda generator. I've had my 2000 for 15 years. It's been packed around the US and never had a problem. I live at 8300 ft and have used it for everything from running the household during power outages to power tools with no problem. I now have a whole house 10k generator and it's never had a problem at this altitude. I second the extra plug. Good luck on your travels!

 

[dreadlocks]

my battery charger is 45A DC and it still basically idles the generator at 9500ft, and I'm lithium so I can put full amps in all day long unlike lead batteries that never ever see what you can provide em for more than a short while.. I know I've gotten at last 12A out of it for Coffee Maker but it dont have to run for very long to make coffee.. then again I have +200W (1.6A) out of my 2200 than your 2k but thats not huge.

I think you got your head too deep in the spec sheet, I think when you go out into the real world you'll find its not as big of a deal as your making it out to be.. I've ran my 9500btu AirCon @ 7k feet according to your graph I should be at 75% power properly jetted, which is only 13.75A and thats well below the starting surge specs sheets say I need to fire it up (>16A IIRC)

 

[outwestbound]

my battery charger is 45A DC and it still basically idles the generator at 9500ft, I know I've gotten at last 12A out of it for Coffee Maker but it dont have to run for very long to make coffee.. then again I have +200W (1.6A) out of my 2200 than your 2k but thats not huge.

I think you got your head too deep in the spec sheet, I think when you go out into the real world you'll find its not as big of a deal as your making it out to be.. I've ran my 9500btu AirCon at Lake Pueblo @ ~5k feet, according to your graph I should be at 80% power, which is only 14A and thats well below the starting surge specs sheets say I need to fire it up (~17A IIRC)

Thanks. My 2000 watt unit surges at start up to 16.7, then settles for a continuous run at 13.3 max. I'm sure the chart used continuous amps. Yours would be greater. Yea, I don't want to beat it to death, but doing this now before shipping out is simple and cheap. Finding out I was wrong on the Altiplano Plateau at 13,000+ could be unforgiving I'll see how it goes.

 

[dreadlocks]

I really dont think on a small engine like this the jetting going to be much as far as performance.. I run 4 stroke dual sport up here and re-jetted it for altitude, throttle response was slightly better and it idled way smoother.. but it didnt really make it any faster or make up for the fact that there's just no friggin air up here.. I think jets might not be good for more than a quater of an amp if even that.. most output is reduced because of lack of oxygen, far less because your running rich.

If your this worried, dont you have your diesel engine setup able to recharge batteries? what about solar? I mean if you wanna convert your honda to LP, then go for it.. but I betcha will find out at 13k feet if it runs off LP it'll run off gas too.. or you could just get a bigger generator?

 

[Joe917]

do not switch to propane, it can be very hard to get in SA. We have had no issues with our 4.5hp Honda at altitudes well over 10000' although we don't need to run it much.

 

[outwestbound]

I really dont think on a small engine like this the jetting going to be much as far as performance.. I run 4 stroke dual sport up here and re-jetted it for altitude, throttle response was slightly better and it idled way smoother.. but it didnt really make it any faster or make up for the fact that there's just no friggin air up here.. I think jets might not be good for more than a quater of an amp if even that.. most output is reduced because of lack of oxygen, far less because your running rich.

If your this worried, dont you have your diesel engine setup able to recharge batteries? what about solar? I mean if you wanna convert your honda to LP, then go for it.. but I betcha will find out at 13k feet if it runs off LP it'll run off gas too.. or you could just get a bigger generator?

I have solar and the alternator. The generator is just one of several sources. I'm still looking at it. The LP mod would allow me to eliminate or greatly reduce carrying petrol, which would be nice. I have a 17 gallon LP tank and only the cooktop, water heater and prospectively the generator on LP; all else on diesel. The like to have at least 2 ways of doing anything that's important.

 

[outwestbound]

do not switch to propane, it can be very hard to get in SA. We have had no issues with our 4.5hp Honda at altitudes well over 10000' although we don't need to run it much.

Thanks. If I did, the Honda would still also burn petrol. It would be dual fuel. I'm still thinking about it. Thanks for the input. I've been weening the vehicle off propane because of it being hard to get. I have a fixed tank, which I gather is an even greater PITA to fill. I replaced the refrigerator with a Danfoss 12v compressor refer and plan to use an Espar D4 diesel heater for the habitation area.

My rig has a 12 year old basic 3 burner Majic Chef LP cooktop that Winnebago speced in 2006. It's ok, but I was wondering if it will perform ok at altitude. I'm still looking at it. As a backup, I'm taking an MSR Dragonfly camp stove that burns diesel, gas, white gas or kerosene. I'm thinking I'd take some kerosene to keep the Espar clean, so just burn that in the MSR if the LP cooktop wouldn't fire up. I'm just trying to preempt any issues now, because my complaint box in the rig gets full when stuff doesn't work

 

[Joe917]

The LP you get here is also not always Propane, often it is a Butane mix and you have to take what you get. Butane will be useless in the cold.

 

[dreadlocks]

I think you made up your mind before u even posted your question

hey I get it, I'm eventually gonna make mine tri-fuel because I wanna be able to run the NG furnace at my house off it indefinitely.. cant have too many backups.. I'll hook it up to LP on the trailer as a secondary fuel source, but not primary.

 

[Joe917]

Our Smev cooktop ran fine at 1400', pots get a little sooty though. Our twin 55l fixed tanks have been a pita to fill. you need to get filled from a tanker truck. Unfortunately the portable tank filling trucks are far more common. If you only have the cooktop left I would eliminate the propane completely. That is our next step.

 

[outwestbound]

The LP you get here is also not always Propane, often it is a Butane mix and you have to take what you get. Butane will be useless in the cold.

Very good point Joe. While I gather the butane is better at altitude, I've been thinking butane will be useless below about 40F (4.5C). Is that about right? If I'm getting sun, I'll be ok with a small, one burner induction cook top. Been thinking about that. Or, seeing if there is something a step up from the little MSR one burner cooker. May I ask, what cooking method do you use at high altitude?

 

[dreadlocks]

does your espar have setup for high altitude? I been shopping furnaces and was hearing of stock espar's crapping out after a few days in like Aspen, rich diesel will foul out alot quicker than rich LP and this is mostly why LP stuff does better at altitude than most others.. its cleaner burning, but as far as energy density it sucks compared to diesel/gas