Building 180Ah 12V LiFePO4 power pack

ShamusTX

Observer
After having issues with Lead acid I decided to build a LiFePO4 battery for my trailer.

The problem I had to solve was actually acquiring the 4x 3.2V batteries.
US source had 100Ah for ~$130 + shipping and 180Ah for ~230 + shipping each.

China sources had the same batteries for $70 and $115 each. The problem when ordering from China is getting what you paid for. Luckily Alibaba has a trad assurance program that for a small fee your transaction is guaranteed or you get a refund and the seller has to meet certain shipping windows too.

So I took the gamble and ordered 4x from Alibaba
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The batteris above at 180Ah CALB 3.2V Cells.
These batteries are big, 11" tall, 7" wide and 3" deep. The next challenge was to get a box to hold them. I thought about just building one but then I stumbled on some surplus ammo cans and found one that would work perfectly.
IMG_6667.jpg

This is a 30mm ammo can that has been cleaned up and powder coated. Found it on Home Depot's website.
IMG_6668.jpg

Next was to build and insert to hold each cell securely.
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Next created Bus Bars from 1.5" x 1/8" Aluminum bar stock. Stacked two bars on top of each other and used heat shrink tubing.
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Now came the wiring.
wiring.JPG

In the diagram above my plan was to have 2x IO ports. One that is directly connected to the solar controller and reprogram the controller for LiFePO4. The solar controller would only charge to 80% then cut off the loads at <20% capacity.
The other connections is protected by a BMS. The BMS is set to open at 90% and 10%. This connection would go to an inverter or 12V 20A LiFePO4 specific AC charger. The AC charger is not configurable so it charges to 95+%.
I could charge the batteries to 100% by connecting the AC charger to the solar controller port.

IMG_6669.jpg

45A BMS
 

ShamusTX

Observer
IMG_6670.jpg

This is the Active balancer.

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wiring the batteries up with the balancer connections

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Cleaned up the wiring and installed the BMS and Balancer

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Installed the ports and a simple voltmeter / USB port. Also install a switch to turn off the voltmeter and USB port.

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everything buttoned up and testing the 400W Inverter connection.



I still need to install the thermal couple from the solar controller to the box to stop the charging below 40F.
 

shade

Well-known member
That's one of the higher capacity portable packs I've seen. What does it weight?

Maybe you already plan to do this, but I'd suggest packing any voids on the sides with a dense foam or similar material to prevent any shifting. The plywood divider joints may never fail, but they'll experience less stress if there's no space for movement in the first place, and that will stabilize the batteries even more.
 
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1leglance

2007 Expedition Trophy Champion, Overland Certifie
Total wgt just to be curious?
And total cost for comparison sake?
 

Martinjmpr

Wiffleball Batter
Nicely done! I love these!

Is heat a concern? I guess if your charger and inverter are external to the box it is not?
 

john61ct

Adventurer
CALB are top notch.

Link to Ali vendor you used?

A capacity test - discharge a load at CC rate, precisely timed - will show their State of Health relative to rated Ah.

Some vendors sell used as new, or factory seconds.

Some have been successful in buying direct, but probably pallet-quantities at least, if not a full conex.
 

john61ct

Adventurer
Some bulging - say 5-10% - is normal over time, but should ideally be contained with end-plates and strapping.

Extreme bulging can be the result of too-high C-rates, does correspond to reduced lifespan.file.jpgOMA.LBPA12V540.jpg
 

john61ct

Adventurer
Here's my "boilerplate" summary for LFP care advice, mostly from marine electrics discussion forums involving long-term users and professionals, with special thanks to Maine Sail, Bruce @ OceanPlanet, tanglewood and nebster (see below).

Note that most people talking "lithium" or "lithium-ion" batteries, mean completely different chemistries, not nearly as safe or long-lived as LFP, and with completely different setpoints and behaviors. Especially those coming from EV or RC contexts.

_____
Let me state from the outset, I am committed to "the cause" of extending lifetime cycles far past manufacturer specs, while still drawing down to high DoD when needed, rather than doing so by oversizing the bank.

I at least want to **know** as much as possible about how to get optimum lifespan; I think well over 10,000 cycles is achievable, unless calendar life issues, like ambient temperature, start interfering with the life-cycling factors.

I may not actually want or be able in all use cases to **implement** the necessary requirements, but I want to "not-do" so consciously, not out of ignorance.

If manufacturer spec'd lifetime cycles is sufficient for you, then charge to their spec, for 4S Absorb voltage 14.6V, holding to endAmps of .005C, or whatever you think best.

In which case, there is also not much point in your engaging in these discussions further just to say "y'all are fussing too much" just because you don't share the goal of optimizing for longevity.

_____
Any and all feedback is welcome, especially if more "canonical" information, e.g. from the links cited below, conflict with this text.

______
Systems: OPE-Li3 (Lithionics/Ocean Planet), Victron, MasterVolt, Redarc (Oz specific?)

Bare cells: Winston/Thundersky/Voltronix, CALB, GBS, Sinopoly and A123 (now Lithium Werks / Valence / Super B)

Best to size your cells for two parallel strings for redundancy, unless you have a separate reserve/backup bank. Don't go past three such strings, or you may see balancing issues that affect long-term longevity, but if you really need to, maybe four strings in a pinch.

_______
Every cell vendor, also those selling ancillary hardware touted as "LFP ready", gives charge-termination voltage / endAmps profiles **way too high** for those striving for maximum longevity.

How has this come to be?

First off, recognize the cell manufacturers are huge billion-dollar companies, and all their focus is on their main customers, first the Chinese military, and secondly EV manufacturers. These have their own PhDs in battery science and DC power, and priorities are high-C-rate discharge for propulsion and range / per-use cycle capacity - expected lifespans are relatively short in those use cases, and optimizing for longevity is just not high on their list of priorities.

The purchase of LFP cells directly by consumers for use as "House bank" storage in a mobile context and for solar storage is at most .0001% of the cell manufacturers' sales, not even on their radar in economic terms, even as a niche sub-market, .

It is for these same reasons that industry and academic research is not targeted toward maximizing longevity, but oriented around those EV & other high C-rate use cases, so **very** different from our much gentler House bank cycling.

And thus no testing / different specs are developed by industry for the House bank use case; that has been left to the end users, and the more objective/technical vendors like MaineSail.

The specs laid out by cell manufacturer are **absolute maximum** ratings, the limits to which the cells can be subjected for short times, without causing immediate irreparable damage. These are "stress ratings" only, and not recommended for normal functional operating conditions. As with all electronics, regularly operating at these maximum rating conditions for extended periods may reduce longevity and reliability.

The auto industry could easily have developed utilitarian cars and parts supply chains, so that their customers could have the option of buying vehicles that routinely last 50-100 years.

The free market gives them, as rational players, no incentive to do so. Just as there is no incentive to study or teach customers how to double or triple the lifespan of their LFP banks.

Not talking any "tin foil hat" conspiracy here, just an understanding of basic economics.

So, following those vendor charge specs is fine **if** you only want the cycle lifetimes they advertise. You can however get **much** longer life by looking at the vendor's SoC vs Voltage chart, and "avoiding the shoulders" at both ends; stay well within the smooth, low sloped parts of the curve.

Their "theoretical 100%" SoC may be defined as, for example,

holding 3.65V until a taper as low as 0.02C (2A per 100Ah)

________
My usual end-charge voltage setting for charging LFP is 3.45Vpc, which for 4S "12V" packs = 13.8V max. Note that is usually at an amps rate of .2 - .3C (.3C = 30A charge current per 100AH bank size). At higher rates, to shorten ICE run-times, it is safe to go to 3.5Vpc / 14.0V.

Note even at the "low" max charge voltage, letting the charge source continue to "push" even low currents long **past** the endAmps point is over-charging, in the sense of reducing potential lifecycles.

At low charge rates, as with many solar setups, under say 0.2C, I reduce termination voltage down to 3.40Vpc / 13.6V.

If your charge rate is **very** low, below say 0.05C, or very variable above and below that ballpark, then you are in real danger of overcharging - even at that seemingly low voltage of 3.40Vpc / 13.6V. In fact, monitoring voltage while charging will not even be meaningful wrt SoC.

Some may think to use an AH counter to control charge termination in that situation, but for me that shows too much trust in what is usually a too-inaccurate tool.

IMO the best approach if this low-current scenario can't be remedied, is to periodically stop charging and let the bank rest isolated. Then, with a very accurate DMM, measure the bank's open-circuit cell voltage. When that reaches 3.34 - 3.35Vpc, the bank is Full, there is no point in going past that.

For daily use cycling, best and simplest is to use a 0.2 - 0.3C rate, and "just stop" charging when your end-point voltage is reached. A long Absorb stage is holdover "lead thinking".

Summary:
Stop at 3.45Vpc / 13.8V for 4S, for amps rate of .2 - .3C.

At higher rates, to shorten ICE run-times, it is safe to go to 3.50Vpc / 14.0V.

At **very** low charge rates, as with many solar setups, back off to 3.40Vpc / 13.6V and do not hold Absorb / CV at all.

---------
For precise benchmarking of your definition of 100% SoC, an endAmps spec of .03C (3A per 100AH) or even .05C is fine, but otherwise Absorb time only gets you another few percent of actual SoC capacity, mostly surface charge or dissipated as heat, and at charge voltages over 3.5Vpc will reduce longevity if held too long.

Note that "stop charging" may simply mean isolating the LFP bank, if you want your charge source to carry ongoing loads rather than discharging your LFP bank.

But if you can't do that or just prefer to Float, then at least set the Float voltage well below your bank's resting Full voltage point, maybe say 13.25V. But that is a compromise, and *may* still shorten life cycles.

With LFP, you don't **need** to ever fill up all the way, as far as the cells are concerned. In fact, it is **bad for them to sit** at Full for any extended length of time.

Therefore the optimum for longevity is to only "fill up" if consumer loads are present, ready to start discharging within the near term.

Charging at .5C (or even higher) is no problem **if** you want to minimize ICE runtime and don't mind sacrificing some longevity - just how much will depend on temperature. As long as your wiring and other infrastructure is robust enough to handle it safely; vendors may spec much lower rates out of legal caution. But do understand, .3C or lower charge rates are **much** better for longevity.

And of course, we're always talking about gentle "partial C" House bank discharge rates. Size the bank appropriately, and be careful feeding heavy loads like aircon, high-gph watermaker, a winch or windlass, heat-producing appliances, etc.

_______
Many sources point out that there is a "memory effect" from keeping charge voltage and ending point exactly the same every time if well below manufacturer specs as I advise; that can apparently over time lead to seemingly lower capacity.

There is no consensus as to just how serious this problem is, and IMO as long as you both

"go higher, into the shoulder" every so often, similar to "conditioning" a FLA bank monthly, and

vary your end-charge setpoints a bit, sometimes go a point or two higher or lower, put in some Absorb time, etc.

then there is no permanent loss of capacity from this phenomenon.

_______
Store at a low SoC. "Not over 50-60%" say most, to compensate for self-discharge, if not getting topped up regularly (I would at least monthly). "Lower the better" say many more recently, as long as you take **zero chances** letting self-discharge drop below 10-15% SoC, IMO not below 3Vpc.

Isolated from everything, **including your BMS** and the cooler the better.

Letting the batts go "dead flat" = **permanent unrecoverable** damage, possibly instantly rendering that expensive bank into worthless scrap.

_______
Same with charging in below 32°F / 0°C freezing temps.

Note that all voltage / performance specs assume a temperature near 25°C/77°F. both charging and discharging behaviours change more significantly the farther you get from there. Persistently hot ambient temps is the #1 lifetime shortener, both in cycles and calendar life in storage.

And although cold temperatures are great for calendar longevity, they drastically impair cycling performance.

1 of 2 parts
 

john61ct

Adventurer
2/2

Next the question "what sort of BMS?" For me "a BMS" is just one implementation of several different types of protective functionality. That BMS **functionality** does not require buying "a BMS".

And those protections may be implemented on three separate levels, whole-bank, pack-level or per-cell.

Following the "avoid the shoulders tips above", the need for cell-level functionality is greatly reduced.

Letting the BMS do active balancing can thus be unnecessary and even potentially harmful; it is **very** common for the complexity of cell-level BMS devices to be the cause of serious incidences, reducing longevity by a lot.

Thousands of owners do just fine with only the higher pack- or bank-level protections.

Check cell-level voltage balance, say monthly to start, then quarterly, finally every six months if there are no imbalance issues, but only if that seems safe to you.

IMO look for just LVC / HVC and temperature protection. Multiple layers of protection are advised if it is a very expensive bank, so you don't rely on any one device to keep working.

Again, going above 3.5Vpc won't add much if any AH capacity, but will shorten life cycles dramatically.

_______
This thread is long but informative

make sure to give both Maine Sail and Ocean Planet your close attention.

Also MS' summary notes here

**Everything** at that site is worth reading, very valuable, feel free to make a donation to help with those expenses https://marinehowto.com/support. He also has great articles in Practical Sailor.

Best of luck, and do please report back here!
 

luthj

Engineer In Residence
Its important to put some compression strapping on the batteries. It keeps them from moving, and provides support for the large plates inside.

Your bus bars will add cyclic stress to the battery internals, especially with batteries that can float in their box (even a mm or two is a big deal).

Did your batteries come with a test sheet? Ideally you want batteries with internal resistance within 2%, and capacity within 3%.

180AH cells are the Max side would use for a mobile pack, for something that will get tossed around like a portable pack, 100AH would be my preference. the bigger the cells, the more vulnerable to vibration damage.

Why did you feel the need to put two balances on the pack? At 45A max draw, you will not need more than 100ma based on my math. Having two of them increases the standby power consumption.
 

john61ct

Adventurer
If they are recent mfg date, never cycled Grade A

actual measured capacity will be well over 180Ah, likely 185+
 

jonyjoe101

Adventurer
Instead of voltmeter I recommend a coulombmeter. Lifepo4 always has resting voltage reading of 13.1 volts. My 220ah lifepo4 is reading 13.1 volts but its down to 100ah of capacity. I would run the solar controller through a bms or at least an overvoltage protecion relay just in case. One note about running a regular bms (mosfet electronic relays) is if it stops charging while connected to solar, you will encounter voltage surges which will destroy any 12 volt devices connected to battery.

My recommendation is to get a chargery bmst8 bms(uses mechanical relays), its what I got and run everything through it, it works excellent with solar. I got the same active balancers in your setup and have kept the battery in perfect balance for the past 2 years.

tk15 couloumbmeter
tk15 couloumb.jpg
 

ShamusTX

Observer
That's one of the higher capacity portable packs I've seen. What does it weight?

Maybe you already plan to do this, but I'd suggest packing any voids on the sides with a dense foam or similar material to prevent any shifting. The plywood divider joints may never fail, but they'll experience less stress if there's no space for movement in the first place, and that will stabilize the batteries even more.

Each battery weighs ~12lbs and the wood / ammo can weighs 25lbs. Total wight is is around 75lbs. I have some packing foam I plan to put in the slots to fill them.
 

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