Can I be an environmentalist and also enjoy vehicle dependant travel?

[pwc]

Beerman, are you sure of that? I live over in the Puget Sound area and used to hear stats that 80% of our energy was from hydro, like you guys. But then I found this graph from Puget Sound Energy that my power comes from 42% hydro and 36% coal (from Montana). Still not bad and better than 90% coal like some places, but I didn't realize hydro was that low.

 

[Clutch]

I have been giving this thread some thought...

and this one too...http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5053

We all have an impact, we all use oil in one way or another.

From what I have read, people try to justify their actions. From my perspective, we should just live our lives the best we can, don't point fingers or stand on soap boxes. Do what makes you happy, and don't care what others think of you. The only person you can count on is yourself. Why try to give yourself a title? I sure don't want one. I am many things, not just one defining title.

The Earth is in constant change and evolution, because of the past is the way we live today, and yes, someday it will be gone, then something will be given birth in our place. It is the nature of life and death. http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/planetearth/extinction_sidebar_000907.html

Be thankful in what you have, and live a good life your way.

I think my signature sums it up quite well.

 

[Martyn]

Amusing thread, did you figure in all of the pollution required to produce all of the stuff your " expedition equipment" is made of? You can tread lightly, but you're just fooling yourselfs if you think, driving anything burning any fuel crushing tender vegatation and microbes is eco-friendly. Oh and would some of the Global warming people please get off their butts and turn the sun down a notch???? That all knowing often misquoted source NASA, has determined it's burning hotter than it has in the past. But I'm sure we can solve this by banning the backyard BBQ.

Yes you are correct the sun is getting hotter, and the research seems to back it http://www.lubbockonline.com/news/092897/study.htm the point you seem to have missed is:

"Willson said that most researchers expect greenhouse gases to warm the planet by 3.6 degrees Fahrenheit in the next 100 years. Solar irradiance could add another 0.72 degrees F and ''that is not an insignificant number. It is smaller than the greenhouse effect, but it is not trivial,''

As we have no control over the output of the sun and therefore cannot "turn it down a notch" our only recourse seems to be to control our own output of greenhouse gasses.

 

[dieselcruiserhead]

If you guys get a chance check out the current issue of Vanity Fair, the green issue.. Lots of good info about hydro and energy breakdown..

 

[PhulesAU]

Yes you are correct the sun is getting hotter, and the research seems to back it http://www.lubbockonline.com/news/092897/study.htm the point you seem to have missed is:

"Willson said that most researchers expect greenhouse gases to warm the planet by 3.6 degrees Fahrenheit in the next 100 years. Solar irradiance could add another 0.72 degrees F and ''that is not an insignificant number. It is smaller than the greenhouse effect, but it is not trivial,''

As we have no control over the output of the sun and therefore cannot "turn it down a notch" our only recourse seems to be to control our own output of greenhouse gasses.

Didn't miss the point. My point was that a group of people saying something, doesn't make it the truth. Half or whole. And selective blame for certain groups, is what causes backlash and rebellion.

 

[Martyn]

Didn't miss the point. My point was that a group of people saying something, doesn't make it the truth. Half or whole. And selective blame for certain groups, is what causes backlash and rebellion.

My take on this thread is a group of people who generally accept the responsibility for causing pollution and wanting to find ways to reduce it. Truth is always up for debate, but I don't see any finger pointing or casting of blame. Am I missing something here?

 

[DesertRose]

I agree, Martyn - this thread is fine, it's not a polemic on global warming.

Shall we get back to topic?

 

[DesertRose]

I struggle with credit trading due to the fact that it is a thinly veiled wealth redistribution system. This plan would discourage countries that have yet to develop industrial capabilities to enhance their own local capabilities. Basically it is just a tax placed on successful corporations.

Can you explain this a bit more, beerman? Since it's a voluntary program in many places (all? I haven't done all my research yet, just for the US and UK) I don't see it as a tax.

I was also talking more about the growing personal-carbon-credit purchasing trend, rather than trading (which is the corporate version). I put some links on the first or second page, postings to some information on that.

I also don't see how it could discourage enterprise and resourcefulness in developing countries - there is still a basic need for cheap energy at the consumer level . . .

 

[DesertRose]

There must be some recognizable stages in the learning process that people go through to arrive at the conclusion that their actions have repercussions on the environment, and that modifying their actions could have a beneficial or detrimental effect on the environment.

In Sports there are three recognized stages;
Incompetent – Incompetence
Competent – Incompetent
Competent – Competence

I think I have outgrown the incompetent –incompetence stage and I'm in the Incompetent -Competence phase. I realize I have an impact but I'm uncertain as to what to do. I think that we all have to travel through these stages and rather than ridicule those with less competence it is our job to enlighten them.

With this goal in sight Adventure Trailers is starting an Alternative Technologies Division that will start to concentrate on alternative power, diesel, and diesel electric.

Great thoughtlines here - I think it's always a struggle, though - not sure it's possible to get to competent-competent in this topic. Not that they're all that accurate, but according to the BP calculator, if I factor in the flying I do for my work, my carbon footprint is huge (68 tons); cut out the flying, and it's 21 tons, and the main culprit for us is then the 2 SUVs we have and drive 10,000 miles a year or more. Replace one of those with a high-efficiency vehicle, and it drops to 9 tons or 13 with a small diesel.

So that's made me more aware of the fuel economy and emissions of my vehicle. The challenge is that America is in the throes of its worst Biggie-Size-Me cycle ever, and while emissions are going down on vehicles, the size and weight go up (like Americans) and the fuel economy plummets.

I'm always thrilled when a successful company like Adventure Trailers doesn't just sit on their laurels and become blind consumers - you are questioning, questing, and testing. How great you are starting an alternative fuels division - let us know how we can help promote and support you!

 

[Jonathan Hanson]

Personally I find the entire "carbon credits" trading scheme highly distasteful, and nothing more than an industrialized way to avoid individual responsibility. I believe every corporation on the planet should be maximizing its own efficiency and energy savings, not simply buying off from someone else.

I feel the same way about those who scoff at personal attempts to reduce impact on the earth. The "Nothing I can do will make any difference" line has been used to excuse everything from littering to child pornography. In the end, everything comes down to personal responsibility, whether you're an overlander trying to save gas or a CEO considering more efficient manufacturing processes.

 

[PhulesAU]

My take on this thread is a group of people who generally accept the responsibility for causing pollution and wanting to find ways to reduce it. Truth is always up for debate, but I don't see any finger pointing or casting of blame. Am I missing something here?

I limit my driving as much as practicle. recycle what I can, and support others that do likewise. But I'm tired of hearing " I'm not doing enough". I'd like to have the new engine that's going to be in the class8 trucks in a couple years. NO cooling system ( no more green or pink stuff to kill the family pets!) will burn almost anything from Diesel to bad scotch. Rated at 560 bhp. BUT In an ideal situation they'd make a couple different sizes and make them adaptable to a large number of older vehicle. Why must I do a homebrew transplant or buy a new vehicle loaded with computer junk?? this thing is lower in emmisions than most Hybrids and needs none of the computers and associated problems. It's always cool to see what Ideas people come up with, in the challenge of problem solving. If the guys at A T need gueiney pigs I volunteer.

 

[bigreen505]

People who think they're Virtuous because they drive a Prius and drink soymilk are not quite getting it.

That is too funny. I've said it before, but my Dad's Suburban is one of the most efficient vehicles I know. It runs just shy of 19 mpg and spends its weekends loaded with four people, bikes and dogs in the summer and skis in the winter. I'm not saying he should get a medal for it, but it would probably take three Prii (would that be the plural or Prius?) to haul what it does on a regular basis and I doubt they would still be happily be chugging along at 200,000 mi.

 

[Clutch]

I'd like to have the new engine that's going to be in the class8 trucks in a couple years. NO cooling system ( no more green or pink stuff to kill the family pets!) will burn almost anything from Diesel to bad scotch. Rated at 560 bhp.

Do you have any more information on that?

I haven't heard of those type of engines.

 

[PhulesAU]

Lemme dig for the link, I can't find it right at the moment. ( just because you asked)

 

[PhulesAU]

I can't swear this is the same article I read, but the same tech. being developed. The part-timers is kicking in again, I guess I'll have to start book-marking everything.
http://www.turbinetruckengines.com/