chiptune dpf delete problems

[Flys Lo]

Gidday again Jfet

You would think it should be as simple as tricking analogue sensors (18kohms is close I think) and making a tee'd branch off the pipe with the in and out pressure sensors fitted so they read the same pressures......... But it's not. My understanding from Isuzu is that the ECU does a compulsory regen burn even if the pressure sensors indicate the DPF is not building up back pressure.... There has been a lot of people try thinking that a DPF Delete on the NPS will be straightforward and then 300 or 400 ks down the road it's back to the drawingboard

I don't know whatever panned out with those guys from Singapore that claimed to have a answer ....... ATW had been looking at this for underground mining applications where a DPF burn could be quite dangerous but so far have no solution.

Regards John

I can offer little in the way of advice for Fuso's or Isuzu's specifically, but you will be 100% correct.

I have gone down the path of deleting the DPF off my RHD F250, and you need to recalibrate the entire ECU to prevent things like this occurring. Fortunately for me in the case of my F250, because it has a large enough aftermarket support 2 companies have done this, and there are (expensive) off the shelf products available from both of them to both support DPF (and EGR) removal with some power increases as a bonus (nearly 500rwhp and 1400Nm at the rear wheels :sombrero: ).
Prior to importing it to Australia, I successfully ran 500ppm diesel in Mexico (deleted).


If someone wants to go down the path of retuning their engine to accept the DPF removal, a CarDAQ should enable you to recode and reflash the stock ECU (if you know what you are doing).
http://www.drewtech.com/technician/products/cdplus.html
Installing aftermarket ECU's with OEM sensors gets hairy in my limited experience.

 

[lehel1]

dpf removal

hi all

interesting reading. yes the fuso computers are abit complicated just as many other trucks, and designed to be that way to aviod tampering with there systems. the cost of a fuso specific diagnostic tool is also prohibitive to the private owner. ive been told $5000 if you can get fuso to even sell you one, ive been hearing different stories on weather or not they will if your not a dealer. and you can lease one for $250 a week. neither of these options sound very good to me.

the inability to get out of a limp mode is unacceptable for an expedition rig. i just cant imagine being up in canada on the dempster hwy 500 miles in and going into limp for some temporary error code.

and this is more frequent than you might think, at least in extreme weather conditions. i drove cross country this last jan and hit the polar weather system that hit the midwest. i can tell you that my fuso fg will not run in -10 thru -20 degree weather period. it started with doing a regeneration every 15 mins to completely stop running at all. after a couple days and some warmer weather i got it started and had to get the error codes erased to get out of limp. when i first got the truck i had a fuel filter problem, easily taking care of in a normal vehical but also had to see a dealer to get the error codes erased.

im just bitching here as im very disappointed i wont be able to bring my truck to the expo as this very dpf issue is haunting me.

the bottom line is latest emissions and lack of reliablilty and lack of options to get you back on the road if some error code does happen makes for a poor choice of vehicle with these systems for expedition traveling. as least what im used to as expedition travel.

i certainly had trouble with my old unimog, but it never left me stranded with something i couldnt fix myself or at any garage i could find. in this case relying completely on finding a fuso dealer has been problematic even here in the lower 48.

i am happy to report all efforts are being made to find a solution to the ecu problem and i hope to be on the road within a couple of weeks with hopefully all these problems put behind me.

hope to see many of you at the expo cheers lehel

 

[Flys Lo]

the inability to get out of a limp mode is unacceptable for an expedition rig. i just cant imagine being up in canada on the dempster hwy 500 miles in and going into limp for some temporary error code.

and this is more frequent than you might think, at least in extreme weather conditions. i drove cross country this last jan and hit the polar weather system that hit the midwest. i can tell you that my fuso fg will not run in -10 thru -20 degree weather period. it started with doing a regeneration every 15 mins to completely stop running at all. after a couple days and some warmer weather i got it started and had to get the error codes erased to get out of limp. when i first got the truck i had a fuel filter problem, easily taking care of in a normal vehical but also had to see a dealer to get the error codes erased.

im just bitching here as im very disappointed i wont be able to bring my truck to the expo as this very dpf issue is haunting me.

the bottom line is latest emissions and lack of reliablilty and lack of options to get you back on the road if some error code does happen makes for a poor choice of vehicle with these systems for expedition traveling. as least what im used to as expedition travel.

Its a very reasonable problem to complain about, and sadly something that all modern diesels are plagued with. It sounds like the DPF failure mode (going into limp home mode) is more graceful than that of my Ford. If a sensor (there are 4 EGT, 2 O2 and I believe a NOX sensor) gives an erroneous reading, a message comes up on your dash to shut the vehicle down immediately, and you have about 15seconds to pull to the side of the road and get a tow truck. This would probably be ok if the sensors were reliable, sadly they aren't (particularly the EGT ones), so owners have gotten to carrying a spare EGT sensor, and 17mm wrench and a set of gloves to change it on the side of the road if need be. I feel sorry for the person having to do that around a hot exhaust when its -30 outside.

The lack of reliability, inability to use lower quality fuel and the higher fuel consumption where all big catalysts in me deleting my vehicle.

 

[pelican]

Isuzu manual

Hi Mr Rehab,

I have recently bought an 8/2009 NPS 300 DC. A manual would be very handy if that's doable. Cheers Pelican.

 

[DzlToy]

The lack of reliability, inability to use lower quality fuel and the higher fuel consumption where all big catalysts in me deleting my vehicle.

Just be careful who you say that to. A friend of a friend was recently stopped for speeding and the trooper "chatted him up" about his truck, mods, etc. He reveals the deletes and tells him about power, MPG, etc.. Trooper goes to car and calls DOT, who impounds his truck, fines him 15,000 dollars for removing the emissions equipment and sends it to an approved garage to have it all put back on. He obviously had to pay the bill before it was released to him. May be the world's most expensive speeding ticket.

 

[Jfet]

Just be careful who you say that to. A friend of a friend was recently stopped for speeding and the trooper "chatted him up" about his truck, mods, etc. He reveals the deletes and tells him about power, MPG, etc.. Trooper goes to car and calls DOT, who impounds his truck, fines him 15,000 dollars for removing the emissions equipment and sends it to an approved garage to have it all put back on. He obviously had to pay the bill before it was released to him. May be the world's most expensive speeding ticket.

Ack! The more I read about DPF the more I am going to baby my 2006 Isuzu NRR such that I never have to go through this hell.

 

[pugslyyy]

Just be careful who you say that to. A friend of a friend was recently stopped for speeding and the trooper "chatted him up" about his truck, mods, etc. He reveals the deletes and tells him about power, MPG, etc.. Trooper goes to car and calls DOT, who impounds his truck, fines him 15,000 dollars for removing the emissions equipment and sends it to an approved garage to have it all put back on. He obviously had to pay the bill before it was released to him. May be the world's most expensive speeding ticket.

While this story strikes me as apocryphal the point is certainly valid - don't confess crimes to strangers, especially sworn officers.

 

[DzlToy]

Will be happy to confirm details or move you up the ladder one rung and get the story from the horse's mouth when he returns from Europe in a week or so. I was not there, so I cannot speak with 100% authority, but I have no reason to doubt what I was told, especially when two egotistical ***** hole cops were involved.

The simple solution is to keep you mouth shut about it and if the officer questions you, your reply is, "I do not consent" plain and simple.

 

[SkiFreak]

...and if the officer questions you, your reply is, "I do not consent" plain and simple.

Does that go for speeding tickets too?

 

[pugslyyy]

Does that go for speeding tickets too?

Depends on the nature of the offense.

Were you going 100mph whilst popping wheelies in a school zone? If so then there's probably nothing you can say to make that better so best to just shut up.

65 in a 55? There's a good chance that showing remorse and having your act together will result in a caution rather than a ticket.

 

[Flys Lo]

Just be careful who you say that to. A friend of a friend was recently stopped for speeding and the trooper "chatted him up" about his truck, mods, etc. He reveals the deletes and tells him about power, MPG, etc.. Trooper goes to car and calls DOT, who impounds his truck, fines him 15,000 dollars for removing the emissions equipment and sends it to an approved garage to have it all put back on. He obviously had to pay the bill before it was released to him. May be the world's most expensive speeding ticket.

I don't question the story, I know what the fine is in the US - and the Edge tuning company "famously" had to pay half a million dollars for building tuners that enable deletion.

I live in Australia. While removing emissions equipment is technically against EPA guidelines here, its not something you ever get tested for, anyone really cares about, nor the average police officer would ever be able to comprehend (I'm pretty sure for most of them, its the first F250 of this model year they would have ever seen). Even if they do know everything that's going on, here it is a "canary", which is return your vehicle to stock, get it independently inspected and you are back on the road.

 

[riptilyaflip]

The whole diesel emissions thing has got me planning a complete new drivetrain build, starting out with a salvaged Isuzu NQR as the platform.
I can put all new, built components, that will have more HP & TQ, better MPG, way better axles, tranny, and transfer case for close to the same as buying a new truck. The warranty would not be near as good, but if it's built right, who cares. The warranty doesn't mean anything in the middle of Baja anyway!
If your buying a new truck that's one of the big 3, then there are several options for dpf delete and tuner, but with any of these cabovers, it's just not an option.
For us, we travel Baja a lot and they don't use the ulsd, so a new truck is not an option, plus simple is GOOD.

 

[SkiFreak]

plus simple is GOOD.

All true, but simple is not always easy...

 

[riptilyaflip]

Definitely NOT EASY!.
I've been researching and building different scenarios on paper for the past 6 months. I'm finally getting really close to knowing what the build will be, who will do what work, what parts will come from where, and what work I will do (which will be a lot).
It's been a ton of time evaluating many different vehicles, but in the end, I'm now comfortable with the undertaking and looking forward to the process, which will probably take a couple of years.
If you're not in a hurry and enjoy the building process, and either have the skills and/or knowledge to make it happen, or the money to hire the right people, I think it's the best approach.
For me; I can't afford a $250k rig and don't want a new truck with all it's BS, so my only options are to buy used (hard to find the right one), or build.

 

[Mr Rehab]

Hi Lehel

You posted this advice a while back re your problems trying to delete your DPF and experience with Chiptuning here in Australia. A friend and I are still trying to delete the DPF from our Isuzu trucks and I was hoping to get a little more info on the process you went through with Chiptuning to try and avoid the same problems?

There are now several companies here in Oz, including one local and including 'Chiptuning', claiming to be successful in DPF deletes on these trucks. They appear legit and probably are successful where the truck is available to work with but unfortunately my truck is sitting in Europe and will be for a while. A couple of these companies state that if I remove the ECU and freight to them in Oz they will do a workbench reflash and send back for fit up to the truck. There's also advice that there may be some resetting of parameters required to the ECU after refitting - which could get a bit tricky if I don't have the truck in a workshop with the required Isuzu software.

This sounds somewhat ominously like the problems you experienced? So, any chance you could post an outline of the process you went through and where it went wrong? Or email me if more appropriate (pm sent)?