Comparison shopping: Colorado, Gladiator, Tacoma

Todd780

OverCamper
But yes at its heart its still a pedestrian Chevy Colorado and thats what makes it soulless.

I don't know... A brand new in it's day 2005 Corolla to me wouldn't have had soul. But put 600,000 miles and some bumps and bruises on that same car....

I think that little thing would have some soul...
I'm not convinced of this yet...
Agreed for the reason mentioned above.
 

GB_Willys_2014

Well-known member
Could you unpack that? I looked him up, but I'm afraid I'm not familiar with his work beyond having heard the name of the book.
I am pressed for time, but basically your thoughts mimic, at least to me, the theme in "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance".

The main character rides an older BMW, and talks about the "quality" attributes of his old ride, especially compared to his friends' newer "fancier" rides.

The older motorcycle with all it's demands, ofc, as metaphor for living life.
 

spectre6000

Observer
I don't know... A brand new in it's day 2005 Corolla to me wouldn't have had soul. But put 600,000 miles and some bumps and bruises on that same car....

I think that little thing would have some soul...
There's a difference between THAT Corolla, and Corollas at large. 90s vintage VW Jettas don't have much to recommend them in the way of character, but those few with all the factory mismatched body panels could be said to have character. Same could be said of any "art car". An art car being a particular make and model doesn't imbue the rest of the run with the same character. All Jeeps, Beetles, and Buses have that character, regardless their unique history.
 

spectre6000

Observer
I am pressed for time, but basically your thoughts mimic, at least to me, the theme in "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance".

The main character rides an older BMW, and talks about the "quality" attributes of his old ride, especially compared to his friends' newer "fancier" rides.

The older motorcycle with all it's demands, ofc, as metaphor for living life.
It's been recommended to me in the past. I should probably pick up a copy. I googled him, and clicked the link to his Wikipedia page, but I am also pressed for time. This forum is my "smoke break" activity for the time being; I refresh when I get stuck hoping for a mental restart when I come back to it... Next time I need a "hit", I'll read up on him.
 

85_Ranger4x4

Well-known member
What is there keeping the Colorado from being just an old truck? Will the leather hold out? Will the engine? What about the electronic gewgaws? All modern cars built since the early 2000s, I feel, will be harder to justify long term as the screens and such will age horribly... Anything mission critical tied into those screens is a major long term liability, whereas, if they're totally standalone, they can be replaced and upgraded over time to keep up with standards of the day....

This x1000

IMO for long term end user maintenance vehicles peaked in the early 00's. Multiport fuel injection, pretty good automatics, starting to care about safety (ABS and airbags), OBDII for diagnostics, decent mpg.

Original Colorado actually had the front axle running thru the oil pan. Why? I dunno.

Problem with going 500k around me is they rust apart around you around 200k.
 

AbleGuy

Officious Intermeddler
Soul.
Some cars have it and some don't. I can't explain why or which ones. I think that falls into the 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' category.

This is a very apt and interesting comment about our collective psyches. I’m not criticizing that in any way.

The Cars we own and drive often can become a too big part of our lives and thus we perceive, our identities.

But perhaps we sometimes wind up placing too high of a focus and importance on that role of who we are being filled by the vehicle we are seen in? If so, we’ve truly drunk too much of the tasty koolaid sold us by slick media advertising.

To some, a vehicle is simply a utilitarian tool and if it functions well enough for its main intended purposes, they are happily satisfied with what they own. Appearances don’t matter. Their sense of who they are isn’t tied to what they drive. You probably have seen that driver, cheerfully meandering down the road in an dusty, unwashed, dented old truck.

For others, few things will light them up like the huge oxytocin boost they get from having the keys in their hand for that sexy new ride they just went so heavily in to debt to obtain.

It’s good to know which camp you fall in to before shopping for that replacement vehicle.

Expellam ergo sum, “I drive, therefore I am”
... as Voltaire perhaps might say (especially if he really didn’t speak Latin that well).
 
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Todd780

OverCamper
This is a very interesting comment about our collective psyches. I’m not criticizing that in any way.

The Cars we own and drive often can become a too big part of our lives and thus we perceive, our identities.

But perhaps we sometimes wind up placing too high of a focus and importance on that role of who we are being filled by the vehicle we are seen in? If so, we’ve truly drunk too much of the tasty koolaid sold us by slick media advertising.

To some, a vehicle is simply a utilitarian tool and if it functions well enough for its main intended purposes, they are happily satisfied with what they own. Appearances don’t matter. Their sense of who they are isn’t tied to what they drive. You probably have seen that driver, cheerfully meandering down the road in an dusty, unwashed, dented old truck.

For others, few things will light them up like the huge oxytocin boost they get from having the keys in their hand for that sexy new ride they just went so heavily in to debt to obtain.

I guess it’s good to know which camp you fall in to before shopping for that replacement vehicle.

Proveho ergo sum, “I drive, therefore I am”
... as Voltaire perhaps might say (especially if he really didn’t speak Latin that well).
Hmm... For me a car can have 'soul' regardless if I own it or not. To me a car having 'soul' has nothing to do with ownership.
 

spectre6000

Observer
Problem with going 500k around me is they rust apart around you around 200k.

In some places, yes. Not all though. Here in the high desert, there's not much to take them out. Hail is probably the worst thing going around here, but that won't actually take anything off the road, just make it ugly.

But perhaps we sometimes wind up placing too high of a focus and importance on that role of who we are being filled by the vehicle we are seen in? If so, we’ve truly drunk too much of the tasty koolaid sold us by slick media advertising.
I think you're mixing automotive ideologies here. In some instances, I agree completely. In others, not so much. If you base your identity on your car and being seen in it, that's not great. That externalization of one's identity with a material thing that is ultimately fleeting and temporary (more fleeting and temporary than the individual at least) can't be healthy. At some point it will rust, be wrecked, or you'll just grow tired of it. I feel similarly toward tattoos.

On the other hand, if it's approached as a hobby that one enjoys, and has a secondary utilitarian purpose (transportation), it can be a healthy thing. I like cars. I like interesting cars. I DD my interesting cars. Then I sell them to pay for the next interesting car. I don't latch on to any particular one, but learn something from each one. If it can be said to be a part of my identity... I suppose that could be said to some degree, or at least could have been in the past, just not in the way I think you intended it. That said, buying this new car represents a shift in that overall strategy that I outlined a page or two back. I've had enough interesting cars with "soul" and "character" that I have a good feel for what's going to achieve that same quality in a new car, and I can use the skills and tools gained from my past automotive exploits to keep on the road long term.

To your point, the "identity" that comes with owning a particular make/model of vehicle is generally a pretty strong turn off for me. I hesitated to buy my BMW because I don't generally care for the people that think of themselves as BMW people; too douchey. Same with Jeep; too bro-y. Chevy; too blue collar. Yet, as with most things, I ultimately said, "who cares what other people think?" and owned them for at least a short period of time. I genuinely enjoyed each one for what it was, and made it out without any BMW/Jeep/or Chevy/VW/Mazda/Dodge/AM General/Toyota/etc. hats or keychains or anything of the like. Though I do have some Blipshift t-shirts... hmmm....
 

GB_Willys_2014

Well-known member
It's been recommended to me in the past. I should probably pick up a copy. I googled him, and clicked the link to his Wikipedia page, but I am also pressed for time. This forum is my "smoke break" activity for the time being; I refresh when I get stuck hoping for a mental restart when I come back to it... Next time I need a "hit", I'll read up on him.

Recommended, I think you will like it.


This is a very apt and interesting comment about our collective psyches. I’m not criticizing that in any way.

The Cars we own and drive often can become a too big part of our lives and thus we perceive, our identities.

But perhaps we sometimes wind up placing too high of a focus and importance on that role of who we are being filled by the vehicle we are seen in? If so, we’ve truly drunk too much of the tasty koolaid sold us by slick media advertising.

To some, a vehicle is simply a utilitarian tool and if it functions well enough for its main intended purposes, they are happily satisfied with what they own. Appearances don’t matter. Their sense of who they are isn’t tied to what they drive. You probably have seen that driver, cheerfully meandering down the road in an dusty, unwashed, dented old truck.

For others, few things will light them up like the huge oxytocin boost they get from having the keys in their hand for that sexy new ride they just went so heavily in to debt to obtain.

It’s good to know which camp you fall in to before shopping for that replacement vehicle.

Expellam ergo sum, “I drive, therefore I am”
... as Voltaire perhaps might say (especially if he really didn’t speak Latin that well).

Since this thread has morphed into a philosophical treatise of the soul and vehicle, I just want to point out that Descartes, not Voltaire, is your inspiration.
 

AbleGuy

Officious Intermeddler
Since this thread has morphed into a philosophical treatise of the soul and vehicle, I just want to point out that Descartes, not Voltaire, is your inspiration.

Awww ********, you got me there!
Next time I see Voltaire, I’m gonna give him hell for stealing that quote from Descartes.

(From Wikipedia)
François-Marie Arouet, known by his nom de plume Voltaire, was a French Enlightenment writer, historian, and philosopher famous for his wit, as well as his advocacy of freedom of speech and freedom of religion, and was also well known for frequently trying to take credit for quotes from another famous French writer, Rene Descartes....”
 

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