D.O.A - 89 Chevy Ambo Build
- Thread starter zuke
- Start date
zuke
Adventurer
I still have one seat in the back with a seat belt, (Opposite the Crew bench) for the occasional emergency passenger, But most of the time my wife is driving her Jeep separate from the one on the trailer, so we actually have 5 empty seats in the convoy anyway... I do have to add two harness anchors in the back for the pooches who travel with us too though!
zuke
Adventurer
Cabinet work today, Added Shelves to the "pantry"
Made a rack in the "Propane" cabinet;
The top bottle feeds into the module to feed the Big Buddy heater I just installed brackets for;
The old oxygen control reach thru door lets me turn the heater bottle on and off from inside;
The bottom bottle is for the outside kitchen.The bottles take up a lot more of the space in that cabinet than I would like, But I'll still have the room in there for all the extra hoses and adapters, and to put all my camp chairs.
Also the most important mod, I put the Vanity plates on it;
Made a rack in the "Propane" cabinet;
The top bottle feeds into the module to feed the Big Buddy heater I just installed brackets for;
The old oxygen control reach thru door lets me turn the heater bottle on and off from inside;
The bottom bottle is for the outside kitchen.The bottles take up a lot more of the space in that cabinet than I would like, But I'll still have the room in there for all the extra hoses and adapters, and to put all my camp chairs.
Also the most important mod, I put the Vanity plates on it;
patoz
Expedition Leader
While your messing with that Plexiglas door, you might want to consider this. Propane storage is supposed to be completely isolated from the cabin area in case there is a leak or the pressure relief valve vents. And, it's just common sense you can't have any electrical equipment mounted in the same compartment as the tanks either.
As per NFPA 1192 Standard on Recreational Vehicles 2005 Edition (I checked the current version which is 2015, and they are the same, but I can't copy and paste from that one.
5.2.3 Location of Propane Containers.
5.2.3.1 Propane containers that do not meet the provisions of 5.2.3.2 shall not be installed nor shall provisions be made for installing or storing any propane containers, even temporarily, inside any recreational vehicle.
5.2.3.3 Propane containers with their control valves shall be installed in compliance with one of the following:
(1) Mounted in a recess or compartment other than on the roof that is vapor resistant to the inside of the recreational vehicle.
5.2.3.4 Containers shall not be mounted on the exterior of the rear wall or the rear bumper of the vehicle.
5.2.4 Securing of Propane Containers.
5.2.4.1 Containers shall be secured in place so they do not become dislodged when a load equal to eight times the container's filled weight is applied to the filled container's center of gravity in any direction.
5.2.6 Ventilation of Compartments Containing Propane Containers.
5.2.6.1 Compartments shall be ventilated at or near the top and at the extreme bottom to facilitate diffusion of vapors.
5.2.6.2 The compartment shall be ventilated with at least two vents, each having an aggregate free area equal to at least 0.5 in.2 for each 7 lb (3.23 cm 2 per 500 g) of the total propane fuel capacity of the maximum number of the largest cylinders the compartment can hold.
5.2.6.3 If the lower vent is located in the access door or wall, the bottom edge of the vent shall be flush with the floor level of the compartment.
5.2.6.4 The top vent shall be located in the access door or wall, with the bottom of the vent within 12 in. (305 mm) of the ceiling of the compartment.
5.2.6.5 Vents shall have an unrestricted discharge to the outside atmosphere.
5.2.6.6 Doors or panels providing access to valves shall not be equipped with locks or require special tools to open.
Here is the full instruction: http://hamyarenergy.com/static/fckimages/files/NFPA/Hamyar Energy NFPA 1192 - 2005.pdf
I realize we are not building these things to be sold on the open market, and they will not be inspected or required to meet any particular building codes, however my philosophy is to follow the existing codes as closely as possible, especially the safety codes. People much wiser that we have put many thousands of hours of research and testing into writing these codes, so it's probably worth following them as closely as possible.
As per NFPA 1192 Standard on Recreational Vehicles 2005 Edition (I checked the current version which is 2015, and they are the same, but I can't copy and paste from that one.
5.2.3 Location of Propane Containers.
5.2.3.1 Propane containers that do not meet the provisions of 5.2.3.2 shall not be installed nor shall provisions be made for installing or storing any propane containers, even temporarily, inside any recreational vehicle.
5.2.3.3 Propane containers with their control valves shall be installed in compliance with one of the following:
(1) Mounted in a recess or compartment other than on the roof that is vapor resistant to the inside of the recreational vehicle.
5.2.3.4 Containers shall not be mounted on the exterior of the rear wall or the rear bumper of the vehicle.
5.2.4 Securing of Propane Containers.
5.2.4.1 Containers shall be secured in place so they do not become dislodged when a load equal to eight times the container's filled weight is applied to the filled container's center of gravity in any direction.
5.2.6 Ventilation of Compartments Containing Propane Containers.
5.2.6.1 Compartments shall be ventilated at or near the top and at the extreme bottom to facilitate diffusion of vapors.
5.2.6.2 The compartment shall be ventilated with at least two vents, each having an aggregate free area equal to at least 0.5 in.2 for each 7 lb (3.23 cm 2 per 500 g) of the total propane fuel capacity of the maximum number of the largest cylinders the compartment can hold.
5.2.6.3 If the lower vent is located in the access door or wall, the bottom edge of the vent shall be flush with the floor level of the compartment.
5.2.6.4 The top vent shall be located in the access door or wall, with the bottom of the vent within 12 in. (305 mm) of the ceiling of the compartment.
5.2.6.5 Vents shall have an unrestricted discharge to the outside atmosphere.
5.2.6.6 Doors or panels providing access to valves shall not be equipped with locks or require special tools to open.
Here is the full instruction: http://hamyarenergy.com/static/fckimages/files/NFPA/Hamyar Energy NFPA 1192 - 2005.pdf
I realize we are not building these things to be sold on the open market, and they will not be inspected or required to meet any particular building codes, however my philosophy is to follow the existing codes as closely as possible, especially the safety codes. People much wiser that we have put many thousands of hours of research and testing into writing these codes, so it's probably worth following them as closely as possible.
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zuke
Adventurer
Thanks for that Link, Pat, I was unaware of this regulation...
I actually have met most of these regs though, the cabinet had a vent at the top already (Maybe a requirement for Oxygen storage?), and I already added one at the bottom on the advice of a friend who designs outdoor kitchens, The bottles are secured so that l believe they'd hold in place at 8 times a full bottle weight...
But some of them I haven't met, notably, The plexiglass door isn't much of a seal between the compartment and living area, so I think I'll add a seal to it...
There is a compartment light in the cabinet, that is the only electricity in the cabinet, I don't think I'm going to remove it though I might add a defeat switch to it so that it doesn't come on when the cabinet door is open.
The cabinet has a lock on it, Gonna have to think on that one, There is no access into the rest of the vehicle from there anyway, so taking the lock off that one might not be a bad idea.
Also makes me wonder, is there any kind of standard marking on RVs that have bottles inside to show where they are? I don't remember ever seeing them, but it would seem to make sense to have them.
Meeting the regs is also important if you ever want to re-title your rig to an RV, In Virginia at least, you have to go through an actual state police inspection/certification to do the re-title, and I was hoping to do that someday... (Insurance is a lot cheaper for an RV than a commercial truck, which is what this thing is considered right now...)
I actually have met most of these regs though, the cabinet had a vent at the top already (Maybe a requirement for Oxygen storage?), and I already added one at the bottom on the advice of a friend who designs outdoor kitchens, The bottles are secured so that l believe they'd hold in place at 8 times a full bottle weight...
But some of them I haven't met, notably, The plexiglass door isn't much of a seal between the compartment and living area, so I think I'll add a seal to it...
There is a compartment light in the cabinet, that is the only electricity in the cabinet, I don't think I'm going to remove it though I might add a defeat switch to it so that it doesn't come on when the cabinet door is open.
The cabinet has a lock on it, Gonna have to think on that one, There is no access into the rest of the vehicle from there anyway, so taking the lock off that one might not be a bad idea.
Also makes me wonder, is there any kind of standard marking on RVs that have bottles inside to show where they are? I don't remember ever seeing them, but it would seem to make sense to have them.
Meeting the regs is also important if you ever want to re-title your rig to an RV, In Virginia at least, you have to go through an actual state police inspection/certification to do the re-title, and I was hoping to do that someday... (Insurance is a lot cheaper for an RV than a commercial truck, which is what this thing is considered right now...)
patoz
Expedition Leader
Since Propane is heaver than air, it will seek the lowest point in the compartment, which is why the lower vent must be even with the bottom of the compartment. Think of the vapor as water and you want it to drain out completely without a lip to hinder that process. The upper vent is for the introduction of fresh air to replace what goes out the bottom.
A compartment light should be OK mounted at the top of the compartment, provided it is a sealed LED which is soldered in place, with no chance of producing a spark. This mean no mechanical connections of any type, such as sockets, connectors, wires secured by screws, etc. The LED should be approved for combustible locations and labeled intrinsically safe. Items like batteries, inverters/chargers, relays, electric fans, etc. should not be mounted in the same compartment.
This specifies what the exterior labels should be made out of, but nothing else.
Section 5.9.2 Required Markings discuses various warning labels pertaining to Propane cylinders and appliances, but not the one indicating where the cylinder is stored.
Amazon does have these two, which may not meet the code but would be better than nothing.
https://www.amazon.com/Propane-Dang...-fkmr1&keywords=Propane+Warning+labels+for+RV
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00QU710J2/ref=s9_acsd_hps_bw_c_x_2_w
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zuke
Adventurer
Hmm, Both those labels don't really say the propane is in the particular marked compartment, Though you are right that they'd be better than nothing. I think I'll check with a local trophy shop about getting one made that actually meets the regs, and indicates the cabinet that contains the bottles, the shop I deal with sells me whole engraved trophies for less than thirty bucks, so don't imagine a spec'd placard will be too much.
Played around with a variety of fan and shield arrangements today, and came up with this one that keeps the bottom of the cabinet pretty near ambient, and circulates the heat around the module nicely as well.
Played around with a variety of fan and shield arrangements today, and came up with this one that keeps the bottom of the cabinet pretty near ambient, and circulates the heat around the module nicely as well.
patoz
Expedition Leader
Like I said, those Codes are written for manufacturers, so the placards are not really required, but IMO it would still be good to indicate where the Propane shut-off was in case of a fire.
Is your heater the standard Big Buddy heater? Every one I've seen has a red trim piece on the front, but your's and one other member's on here has a yellow front. What is the difference? Is your an older model perhaps, and they changed the color of the trim piece?
Also, don't you have the build in fan? I know it runs on 6VDC, but an adapter is an easy thing to get.
Is your heater the standard Big Buddy heater? Every one I've seen has a red trim piece on the front, but your's and one other member's on here has a yellow front. What is the difference? Is your an older model perhaps, and they changed the color of the trim piece?
Also, don't you have the build in fan? I know it runs on 6VDC, but an adapter is an easy thing to get.
zuke
Adventurer
Yeah, I really think having something that says where the propane and shut off are is worthwhile, Regardless of regulation.
It is old, I've had it since I was camping in the E350, so at least four years, probably more, I think they were all yellow then, other than that, all the specs are the same as the current ones....
It does have a built in fan, and I tested with that too, It was better than the computer fan you can see in the picture, but not much. It kept the cabinet a little cooler but it didn't do crap for circulating air
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patoz
Expedition Leader
It does have a built in fan, and I tested with that too, It was better than the computer fan you can see in the picture, but not much. It kept the cabinet a little cooler but it didn't do crap for circulating air
It's my understanding, the fan is to help push the hot air out from the burner, but your setup will probably work much better though.
zuke
Adventurer
Put in flooring over the weekend.
First challenge was removing the pedestal from the action station seat, the bolts weren't bad, but the twenty eight years of dirt, and the fluids I don't want to think about that get on the floor of an ambulance had it pretty well stuck to the floor... Beating it with a 5 lb mini sledge and all attempts to simply pry it off the floor proved ineffective. Finally, I used a trolly jack and a peice of C-Channel to rip it off the floor.
Next up was getting the gurny plates out of the floor and filling in the holes. This required a combination of Impact wrenching from the top and bottom, cutting bolts, and beating on them with the sledge, as many of the nuts on the bottom were hidden underneath the exhaust/heat shields/module mounts and of course I had the twenty eight years of gunk again.
Once they were all out, I used pieces of dowel rod to plug the bolt holes, and cut some 3/4 plywood to fit in the holes in the floor where the plates had been. I then covered each hole with a some vinyl tile and used duct tape on the edges to bring it all level with the original floor.
I then layed down vinyl plank flooring, This stuff works just like a hardwood floating floor, but is waterproof. I've heard of some problems with lifting/curling in temperature extremes, so we'll see how it holds up this summer.
Next I put vinyl tile on the bed platform, and put 1/16"x1" angle aluminum on all the edges with stainless steel screws (so hopefully they won't rust the way the steel ones the ambulance manufacturer used did). The tile worked fine, but on the vertical surfaces when I put the screws in the aluminum, some of the tiles would move and leave small gaps, so that's something to be aware of if you try it.
Finally, I used pvc tapered cove molding and an aluminum toe plate to finish off the floor;
And there it is.
First challenge was removing the pedestal from the action station seat, the bolts weren't bad, but the twenty eight years of dirt, and the fluids I don't want to think about that get on the floor of an ambulance had it pretty well stuck to the floor... Beating it with a 5 lb mini sledge and all attempts to simply pry it off the floor proved ineffective. Finally, I used a trolly jack and a peice of C-Channel to rip it off the floor.
Next up was getting the gurny plates out of the floor and filling in the holes. This required a combination of Impact wrenching from the top and bottom, cutting bolts, and beating on them with the sledge, as many of the nuts on the bottom were hidden underneath the exhaust/heat shields/module mounts and of course I had the twenty eight years of gunk again.
Once they were all out, I used pieces of dowel rod to plug the bolt holes, and cut some 3/4 plywood to fit in the holes in the floor where the plates had been. I then covered each hole with a some vinyl tile and used duct tape on the edges to bring it all level with the original floor.
I then layed down vinyl plank flooring, This stuff works just like a hardwood floating floor, but is waterproof. I've heard of some problems with lifting/curling in temperature extremes, so we'll see how it holds up this summer.
Next I put vinyl tile on the bed platform, and put 1/16"x1" angle aluminum on all the edges with stainless steel screws (so hopefully they won't rust the way the steel ones the ambulance manufacturer used did). The tile worked fine, but on the vertical surfaces when I put the screws in the aluminum, some of the tiles would move and leave small gaps, so that's something to be aware of if you try it.
Finally, I used pvc tapered cove molding and an aluminum toe plate to finish off the floor;
And there it is.
patoz
Expedition Leader
Wow, that looks beautiful! I didn't even know the vinyl Hardwood Flooring product existed until now.
What is your plan for the horrible maroon vinyl trim that the ambulance manufacturers insisted on using back then? Are you going to replace it, dye it, or just leave it as is?
I don't know what their thoughts were when they decided to use that stuff, but I know if I was an unconscious patient and saw all of that blood red when I came to, I would probably freak out. At least they have wised up with modern builds, and gone to light grays or other neutral colors.
What is your plan for the horrible maroon vinyl trim that the ambulance manufacturers insisted on using back then? Are you going to replace it, dye it, or just leave it as is?
I don't know what their thoughts were when they decided to use that stuff, but I know if I was an unconscious patient and saw all of that blood red when I came to, I would probably freak out. At least they have wised up with modern builds, and gone to light grays or other neutral colors.
zuke
Adventurer
I didn't know about it either until my Sister In Law did her whole house with it (In varying shades), She used it because they have dogs and kids, and it is much more liquid resistant than any wood floor, so I'm hoping it stands up well to the dogs, and general mud/rain that gets tracked in from wheeling. It does actually cost more than a lot of wood flooring does though...
The stuff I used is one of the less costly vinyl ones, at 1.98 Sqft;
http://www.lowes.com/pd/Shaw-14-Piece-5-9-in-x-48-in-Matrix-Resort-Teak-Locking-Luxury-Residential-Vinyl-Plank/50043188
Haha! I hear you, but I'm going to suffer through it, and expand on it actually, I've got a blood red turkish throw to go over couch, and I'm going to throw an oreintal rug runner down on the floor, as soon as I can find one skinny enough to not hide the entire floor, but still wide enough to be useful (figure 16 to 18")
patoz
Expedition Leader
I guess that's like..."If you can't beat 'em, join 'em"! If you can make it work out for you, then that's probably the simplest and most economical solution.
Since mine is going to be used for evacuation & disaster situations (hurricanes), bug-out situations, as well as camping, I'm staying more with the utilitarian design and will go with a two tone gray theme to match the interior of my white F250 tow vehicle.
I've thought about trying a vinyl dye, but I may just recover it with whatever the couch/bed ends up being covered in. Since mine is a trailer, there will never be anyone in it when it's moving so a lot of that heavy padding is going away, to gain as much additional headroom as possible.
Since mine is going to be used for evacuation & disaster situations (hurricanes), bug-out situations, as well as camping, I'm staying more with the utilitarian design and will go with a two tone gray theme to match the interior of my white F250 tow vehicle.
I've thought about trying a vinyl dye, but I may just recover it with whatever the couch/bed ends up being covered in. Since mine is a trailer, there will never be anyone in it when it's moving so a lot of that heavy padding is going away, to gain as much additional headroom as possible.