daily driver suggestion?

[killahaas@gmail.com]

hey guys i have a few questions. i use my 84 90 as a daily drivers right now it has a 2.5 NA diesel in it.
i want to not have to worry about it if i want to take it on a 300 mile trip. i have put alot of money into it already the truck almost has 220,000 miles on it. and i understand it is a 26 year old truck and it might always have problems but i want to know some ideas on what to do to make this thing ready to roll. i was thinking about buying a 200 tdi and rebuilding the turbo and upper end and what not and throwing it in there. because i want to be able to keep up at high speeds and have a little more power. also this is my only truck right now so doing a whole resto is out of the question my frame and body and brakes and running gear are alllll great. so it is a matter of engine/tranny reliability, and little creature comforts any suggestions please?

 

[proper4wd]

The 200tdi is a great powerplant. It is a little less "refined" than the 300 but just as capable. It will have a little more top end noise. In my opinion, I don't think it gets any more reliable than what you already have but if you are after a little more power to do 70+ on the highway the 200 would be a great option.

Creature comforts... Dynamat the hell out of that thing. The insides of the door skins make an especially big difference as well as the undersides of the floor and inside the seatbox. Put in some decent floormats, even just heavy rubber ones will make a big difference.

Not knowing the condition of everything on the truck, things like new door weatherstripping, rebuilding the door tops with new tracks and felts, and even just spending some time adjusting all the door hinges and latches properly will make a huge difference in the day-to-day use of the truck.

Too often, especially with Land Rovers, people can't see the forest for all the trees. The best Land Rovers out there are the ones that have been cared for on this detail-oriented level... not the ones with fancy turbos, suspensions, etc.

 

[Roverx]

I agree with Adam. Keep it simple. Dynamat, doors, bulkhead etc, If you can swing it Line-x the inside of the tub and setbox. It will make a big difference. GM headliner on the roof will really help and it's cheap Seat heaters are a nice easy upgrade also for daily drivers. 200tdi is a nice upgrade with power but what you have is as bullet proof as it comes. If I recall the 200 tdi is a direct swap for a 2.5 NA. best of luck

Remember Land Rovers don't accelerate they gather speed. hahaha

 

[proper4wd]

Hey Scott

I forgot to mention that the only failure I have seen on a 2.5NA is a bad lift pump. In that case the truck was still drivable on flat ground, but would starve for fuel on an incline. Really solid engine. If you learn how to do simple maintenance on it (bleeding the fuel system and changing glow plugs basically) you should feel comfortable taking it on a 30,000 mile trip let alone 300.

But maybe that is just the cynical side of my mechanical training showing through I appreciate simple machines!

 

[killahaas@gmail.com]

thanks guys i am looking into dynamat, heated seats, and replacing all the door seals and what not. i know the NA is a very nice engine. but i want something that with "gather" more than 55mph haha i am also looking for more power. i am not worried about the top end noise. thanks again guys.

 

[Series1Rangie]

It would probably be easier to add an overdrive to your set-up than doing and engine swap. We have an 109 with the 2.5 NA and with an OD I could keep up with DC traffic when I used to live out there. It was very happy at 65. All of that being said a diesel rover is not a speed demon no matter what.

I strongly second what others have said. Making it quiet and comfortable will help you be happy at 55/60. Its amazing how the noise and rattles will wear on you over a long trip.

Mike and Myles

 

[killahaas@gmail.com]

where would i get a overdrive? that isnt a bad idea. but it all comes down to reliability, my 2.5 NA has almost 220,000 miles on it. and it comes out to about i dont know if my engine will last another 100k miles or it might last only 100 more miles i dont know. so i would feel wayyyyy more comfortable if i have a some what newer 200 tdi where i knew it has a rebuilt upper and turbo and what not than i would be ok with it. thank you.

 

[Roverx]

Not knowing what the budget is? If you are set on upgrading the motor I would suggest putting the 300tdi. Several threads on the forum will give you the ups and downs and you can read up but here is a lead on getting a complete drivetrain. Jim at http://www.redhawkrovers.com/index.html Best to give him a call.

I just got a complete 300tdi drivetrain for my D1 in the spring. I know he get Defenders units as well

Kit Included: Used 300 tdi drivetrain w/ 78K. R380/LT230 5 speed gearbox and transfer case. Radiator/intercooler,alternator,down pipe, engine mounts and transmission crossmember from donor truck.

Also included Parts and Service work: new installed Dayco timing belt kit, Resufaces flywheel and new Britpart Clutch kit. Rear main seal, Front and Rear Crank seal. New glow plugs, Fuel sedimentor, and shipping to my door for $5800.

He also stocks parts and I added about $600 for new hoses belts etc.

This is a lot of money but you will spend 1/2 that on a 200tdi. Honestly the 2.5 will run forever. Granted it's slow but I love the simple life.

Best of luck!

 

[timmy!!!!!!!]

Scott, you are making me want to seek out a clean 95 D1 to swap in a diesel now...

 

[killahaas@gmail.com]

i would rather a 200 tdi because it is more simple, cheaper,and is a direct swap for the 2.5,my budget would be around 4000$ on just the motor. than i would throw it on a stand and slowly rebuild the turbo and upper end and what not. but does the guy at redhawk sell 200's aswell?

 

[Roverx]

He may, but you will need to give him a call. He works with a few UK breakers.


FYI, You can do everything he does on your own and maybe save a few bucks. I have done it both ways. IMHO the money you save is not worth the time you will spend hunting it down and dealing with the breaker, shipping and customs. I don't know about you but I'm busy! I have a business, wife and two kids and it was worth every penny for me about $600. not to have to deal with any issues at all. He even offered a 3 month warranty. Which is more that you get from a UK breaker.

Just remember good 200tdi's are getting harder to find. Between a short build run and Land Rovers decision to reuse the original tooling for the 300tdi among other issues. You tend not to see a lot of good ones floating around, not that they are not out there and a really nice motor.

Honestly, swapping a 300tdi into a defender is as easy as it comes. You will probably get $2k for your 2.5 drivetrain and you are right about $4K. I understand your reasoning and it's sound. I'm personally very thrifty but always look at long term value.

My only suggestion would be to drive both before you make the decision. IMHO the 300 tdi is a better motor, easier to get parts ( in the US), add AC and overall a better long term solution in the US than the 200tdi. If you are going to keep it for a few years and sell. Go 200tdi. If like me, you are in it for the rest of your life, the 300tdi is an easy decision.

Feel free to give me a shout off list if you want. roverx@comcast.net or 615 681 8441
I have driven both and have had a 300tdi as my daily driver for the last 8 years and just over 125K

All the best

 

[killahaas@gmail.com]

great info! thanks!!but the only reason i might be hasty about the 300 tdi. is that dont the frame engine mounts need to be different? like it isn't a direct swap. and i heard from many people the 200 tdi is almost identical to the 300 with the acceptation of a few things. and is perfectly fine and i will be coming close to rebuilding the whole engine.

 

[Roverx]

Yes the 200 tdi will fit on the 2.5 mounts and will bolt up to an LT77.

Yes you would need to cut out the 2.5 engine mounts and weld in new front mounts but the gearbox cross member just bolts in.

It is really not a big deal to weld in new engine mounts and they come with the kit.


First the 200 and 300 tdi's are both good motors and I really can't say anything bad about either. They are both very simply to work on. Here is my only issue with the 200tdi. Parts! specifically in the US

RN,AB and several others carry 90 plus % or more of wear and service parts for the 300tdi. This can not be said for the 200tdi. Being in NY, RN is next day UPS standard. If you are telling me that this is a toy and only goes off roading and occasional trip and if it dies you have a Honda in the driveway then the 200tdi is perfect! If it's going to be a daily driver in the US then spend your money wisely and put in a 300. You will not be sorry.

Honestly this is just advice. I'm sure I will have a Canadian all over me for my negative 200 tdi comments hahaha. Do what ever you are comfortable with but I would suggest you drive both before making a decision.

Best of luck!

 

[killahaas@gmail.com]

thank you! i really appreciate all your help! only problem is i dont know anyone with a 200 and 300 TDI. which is a kick in the teeth. but i will look into both of them.

 

[Snagger]

I have a 109 with a retro-fitted 200Tdi and overdrive, and a RRC with a 300Tdi. The engines are very similar, with identical performance and economy and a lot of common parts (head gasket, for example). There are differences between the engines, and each has some advantages.

The 200 has a stronger head, simpler ancillary belt system and is an easier fit into your vehicle. The 300 is markedly smoother and quieter and has a much better oil pump (crank driven rather than cam skew gear driven - in fact, the 200tdi shares the same crank, cam shaft and oil pump as your 12J, and also the same cam followers and rocker push rods; the Defender version even uses the 12J timing case and sprockets, alternator mounting, engine mounts, dipstick, water pump, thermostat housing and clutch). But while 300 heads are still available new (just as well because of their susceptibility to warping), 200 heads and manifolds have been unavailable for some time.

An overdrive is of benefit, but I don't think it'll be that useful behind a 90's transmission and a 12J - on my 109, the overdrive was a godsend with the 12J, but the 109 has lower gearing than a 90, and I doubt the 12J will have the torque to pull the taller gearing with an overdrive too. Of course, an overdrive's main point is that it is selectable, so you would be able to get upto 60mph with the main gears and just use the od as a cruise gear, or use it as a gear splitter on hills to keep as much speed as possible by dropping down a gear and engaging the overdrive. Behind the Tdi, though, the overdrive is essential. Roverdrive make the only unit available for the Defender - the GKN unit has been long since discontinued as was a piece of crap from the start, burning out its ATF, solenoid and bearings very frequently. The Roverdrive is very tough, though the price may be stretch for some buyers. At least you can remove and keep it if you sell the vehicle on, fitting it to any Defender replacement you buy in the future, and I suspect the units hold a lot of their value second hand anyway.