Diesel News: POST HERE

[Octamog]

This Fall, the BMW X5 will receive its own version of the 3.0L diesel used in the 330d. Since the X5 is 1300 lbs heavier than the 3 series cars, the diesel's torque should make a larger improvement in fuel economy.

Chip, has this been announced in the U.S.? I was just looking for such an announcement last weekend and came up blank.

I'd be all over one of those... :jumping: ....but then it appears that new X5's are getting way over MSRP on the EBay already, so maybe in a year or two when the newness wears off a little!

 

[Octamog]

Chip, has this been announced in the U.S.? I was just looking for such an announcement last weekend and came up blank.

I'd be all over one of those... :jumping: ....but then it appears that new X5's are getting way over MSRP on the EBay already, so maybe in a year or two when the newness wears off a little!

Oops... I meant the new X6 .... I'd love to have one of those with the turbo diesel!

 

[haven]

CAR Magazine tested the European version of Audi's small SUV, the Q5 (about the same size as the VW Tiguan). Powered by a 2.0L turbodiesel, the result was 35 miles per US gallon in combined driving.

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/Search-Results/First-drives/Audi-Q5-20-TDI-CAR-review

Audi plans to release a hybrid version of the Q5 before a diesel. We could see similar mpg results when VW starts selling Tiguan with the 2.0L 4 cylinder diesel.

VW dealers are hoping the diesel comes sooner rather than later because the gas-powered Tiguan is a lackluster seller. At the same time, orders are coming in fast for the diesel Jetta, which is due to start delivery in August.

 

[Ryanmb21]

BMW Diesel 3-Series

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Features/articleId=129250?tid=edmunds.il.home.photopanel..2.*

335d

 

[haven]

Edmunds inside Line is reporting that the 4.4L V8 diesel that Ford plans to offer in the F150 and Expedition will offer 15% more torque than the 5.4L gas engine, and provide a 20% improvement in fuel economy.

In 2008, the 5.4L is rated at 365 ft-lbs, so the diesel could produce 420 ft-lbs.

The 5.4L gas engine in the 2008 F150 4x4 is rated by the EPA at 13 city, 17 highway. With a 20% improvement, the diesel would score 16 city, 20 highway.

Last week, diesel fuel cost about 16% more than regular gas, according to the government agency that tracks fuel prices. So if the diesel got 20% better mileage, it would have a slight advantage over the 5.4L gas engine in dollars spent per mile.

Now we need to learn how much extra Ford plans to charge for the 4.4L diesel.

I think it's interesting that Ford already sells a vehicle with a 4.5L diesel engine, producing 440 ft-lbs of torque. It's a V6 diesel from International, installed in the Ford LCF (low cab forward) delivery truck. The V6 is a little harsh for duty in an SUV, however!

Chip Haven

 

[TeriAnn]

Edmunds inside Line is reporting that the 4.4L V8 diesel that Ford plans to offer in the F150 and Expedition will offer 15% more torque than the 5.4L gas engine, and provide a 20% improvement in fuel economy.

Ford's new 4.4L diesel V8 is supposed to be a bigger version of the V8 diesel originally developed for Jaguar and Land Rover a few years back (3.6L TDV8, rated 19 MPG city, 31 MPG highway in Australian Spec Range Rover). They retained use of the engine family when they sold the UK marques. There are versions in the UK with dual turbos.

What I find interesting is that there is a V6 version of that engine with some very respectable specs on some production Land Rover's since about 2004.
2.7L TDV6, 190 hp @ 4000 RPM, 325 lbft @2000-2500 RPM (flat torque curve) 25 MPG city, 35 MPG highway (US gallons) in Australian Spec Discovery 3. Both engines are used with 6 speed gearboxes which is what LR is currently offering.

I keep wondering if that V6 is narrow enough to fit in a Series LR. There as to be wrecked Disco 3's hitting Australian junk yards.

 

[haven]

The Toyota Auris is a hatchback version of the Corolla sold in Europe and Asia. Toyota already offers the Auris with a 2.0L four cylinder diesel. Recently Toyota released a 1.4L diesel, producing 140 lb-ft, for the Auris. The official fuel mileage number for the 1.4L diesel is 46 mpg in combined city/highway driving (calculated using US gallons).

This 1.4L diesel is also offered in the smaller Yaris, where it is rated at over 50 mpg.

For comparison, in USA the 2009 Corolla with 1.8L gas engine with 128 ft-lb of torque is rated at 30 mpg combined.

If Toyota can make the 1.4L and 2.0L diesels legal under European emissions rules, they should be able to meet USA standards, too. I guess that Toyota will wait to see what sort of success diesels from VW, Honda, Nissan, and Subaru achieve before offering diesels in Toyota small cars.

Chip Haven

 

[haven]

Autobloggreen recently drove a Euro-spec MINI with 1.6L diesel engine. Result: 47 mpg in mostly city driving. The diesel offers 177 ft-lbs of torque, making it easy to drive in city traffic. MINI USA says it would like to offer the diesel engine here, but they want to make it 50 states legal first.

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/07/22/in-the-autobloggreen-garage-2008-mini-cooper-d-w-video/

 

[mauricio_28]

For me, the tastiest small diesel engine made by Toyota is the 2.2L plant that powers the RAV4, putting out 310Nm (228 ftlbs)at 2,000rpm and the 134HP.

 

[haven]

The USA Internal Revenue Service has decided that the 2009 Jetta TDI qualifies for the "Advanced Lean Burn Technology Motor Vehicle" income tax credit of $1300. That means that the diesel's price premium over a similarly equipped gasoline-powered Jetta is reduced to only $700.

Using the EPA's numbers, a diesel Jetta should average about 34 mpg in combined city/highway driving. The 2.5L gasoline Jetta averages 24 mpg on regular unleaded. That means the diesel is 42% more fuel efficient.

The most recent government fuel price figures put the national average price of unleaded regular at $4.06, and #2 diesel at $4.72. That makes a gallon of diesel 16% more expensive than unleaded regular.

So the diesel Jetta will cost less per mile to drive.

Here's an example.

Assume you drive 15,000 miles a year. In the diesel, you'd use (15,000 / 34)= 441 gallons, which would cost (441 * $4.72) = $2082.

The 2.5L gasoline Jetta would use (15,000 / 24) = 625 gallons of fuel, which would cost (625 * 4.06) = $2,538.

So in this example, the Jetta diesel fuel cost wold be $456 less per year. That means it would take less than two years, driving 15,000 miles a year, to make up the $700 price premium.

Let's look at this another way. The diesel's fuel cost per mile driven is ($2082 / 15,000) = 13.8 cents per mile. The 2.5L gas engine's fuel cost per mile driven is ($2538/15,000) = 16.9 cents per mile at today's prices.

And then there's VW's assertion that the EPA got it wrong, that the Jetta diesel will return 44 mpg on the highway, and 38 mpg in city driving . So maybe the above cost per mile numbers could be understated.

Using past history as a guide, the resale value of the diesel Jetta will be considerably higher than the resale value of the gasoline model, too.

The diesel Jetta Sportwagen is looking like a good substitute for SUVs and vans, so long as you don't need to transport more than four adults.

Chip Haven

 

[mauricio_28]

Yes, yes, yes...but what, if any, of these diesel engines are likely to be coupled with a proper 4WD transfer case in an "expedition"-worthy vehicle? News of a diesel engine in a sports coupe or a fancy, schmanzy BMW SUV doesn't hold much interest for me. Let's talk about which of these engines could be offered soon in the US in, say, the FJ, Xterra or a JK?

 

[ChuckB]

Yes, yes, yes...but what, if any of these diesel engines are likely to be coupled with a proper 4WD transfer case in an "expedition"-worthy vehicle? In other words, which of these engines could be offered soon in the US by Toyota or Nissan in, say, the FJ or the Frontier?

I'm holding out for the diesel 200-series Land Cruiser, not that I can afford one...but I'm still hoping it will make it over here:drool:

 

[haven]

The big increase in diesel fuel prices is stimulating research into engines that use cheaper fuel, but still provide the torque and economy that a diesel does.

PickupTrucks.com has an interesting article that describes one such project, a new injection technology using gasoline and ethanol fuel. The new engine has high compression and high turbo boost. To keep detonation under control, ethanol is injected directly into the cylinder to raise octane.

http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/st...-ethanol-boost-engines-replace-diesels-1.html

The team developing the engine thinks a 5.0L ethanol injection engine would produce 700 lb-ft of torque, and cost about $1500 more than a conventional gasoline engine. A diesel with the same torque has a $6000 to $7000 premium, and burns more expensive fuel. The ethanol injection engine is projected to have the same fuel economy as a diesel.

This engine design is estimated to use less than 1 gallon of ethanol for every 10 gallons of gasoline.

One issue with this approach is that diesels provide lots of torque at low engine RPM. The turbo gas engine would probably need to run at higher RPM to provide the same torque.

Let's see. Scaling the engine downwards, a 2.5L four cylinder turbo ethanol injection engine would produce around 350 lb-ft of torque, and get 25% better fuel mileage than a conventional gasoline engine. This sounds like a winning combination in a light pickup or SUV.

Chip Haven

 

[haven]

Edmunds Inside Line is reporting that Mercedes plans to introduce their new 2.2L four cylinder turbodiesel to USA, probably in 2010 models. Here's the report
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=130066

The 2.2L diesel will first appear in the C-class small sedan and the GLK small SUV. The engine produces about 300 ft-lbs of torque, which should be plenty when mated with a 6 or 7 speed transmission. The Bluetec-equipped engine can deliver mileage in the high 30 mpg range.

So it appears that there should be four small SUVs with diesel engines available for sale in 2010: the Mercedes Benz GLK, the BMW X3, the VW Tiguan, and the Subaru Forester. It's also possible that Audi will sell a diesel version of the Q5, probably with a 3.0L V6 diesel.

 

[Redline]

I'm looking forward to and happy about Mercedes' diesel introductions, but I'm skeptical about their quality. If they could get their SUVs where their cars used to be I would buy one of their diesel offerings today. I think a Japanese crossover SUV will get my dollars if/when they are offered if we decide to replace our Golf TDI.