Ford Ranger Debut

[Clutch]

Exactly, I live in LA and have no desire to daily drive something the size of a school bus. I don't need the size at all it just adds inconvenience. Hopefully the new Bronco is a refreshed Everest because I'll scoop one up.

These trucks aren't exactly the small anymore, but the fullsizes have gotten much bigger. The original minitrucks were pretty tight, the midsizes might just be the goldilocks size. The parking lot at my work is fairly tight, I'll watch the fullsize truck people struggle and the midsizers zip right into the parking space.

 

[DaveInDenver]

But I'm still trying to figure out what the angle is here. What does the Ranger offer that the F150 doesn't, except for the momentary cachet of being the "next shiny new thing."

I think GM's move was because they recognized that the market wants a small (er "midsize") truck and Toyota has owned the market. Nissan sells a few trucks but it's been Toyota's to lose since Ford dropped the Ranger in 2011.

Ford and GM both see the data. I don't think it's that GM is trying to sway Toyota buyers but rather they want to prevent someone jumping brands or choosing not to buy anything and keep their Silverado longer because there's no GM, or really a so-called domestic option. GM wasn't playing offense but rather just slotting a niche.

One has to wonder, will Ford trim down their SUV lineup to make room for the Ranger? Or will Ford dealers look at every Ranger sold as a lost opportunity to sell an F150?

That's the question. During the heyday of the Ranger era it sold just as well as the Hilux/Truck and later the Tacoma, sometimes selling better. Does Ford want to take a chunk out of Tacoma? GM hasn't really but I don't think they really wanted to do that. However overseas the Ranger *does* compete head-to-head with Hilux and from what I've heard it does a pretty good job of it.

That's the Ranger I hope Ford brings. Can't say I would definitely jump but I'm not nearly the Toyota fanboy I once was now that I've owned a Tacoma for a while. If I could get a Ranger with enough payload to make it useful I'd be interested. I'd be all but sold if it had things like a diesel or locker as stand-alone options. Icing the cake would be a frame that can do real work and not rust through in 10 years.

 

[Tex68w]

I'm over diesel and I drive one every day, I couldn't imagine private ownership of diesel, its not worth it.

Which diesel are you driving for work and what exactly about it makes you "over it?"

 

[Clutch]

That's the Ranger I hope Ford brings. Can't say I would definitely jump but I'm not nearly the Toyota fanboy I once was now that I've owned a Tacoma for a while.

Toyota's shine has worn off for you too?

3rd Gen has been a real let down for me, trying to force myself to like it...just can't bring myself to.

Haven't been too-too excited about much of anything on the current market. The Ranger has peaked my interest, don't even need a locker...have one in my Taco and it rarely gets used. Have been looking at Mid-Roof Transits pretty hard, but getting it converted to 4WD doesn't really appeal to me (cost-wise), that and not sure if I want to daily a van of that size.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Toyota's shine has worn off for you too?

3rd Gen has been a real let down for me, trying to force myself to like it...just can't bring myself to.

Just disappointed in their direction. Can't argue with their sales figures so it's really that I'm out of step.

 

[cdthiker]

I don't know... I sorta like the looks of it, but I just am not sure I can get behind the motor.
Please don't get me wrong, I have no problem with 4 bangers and the echo boost tech is more then proven at this point.
But they are going to have to work some hard core gearing magic to get that motor to do " truck stuff"
It was designed as a budget option for folks that want to look fast and sorta go fast with out throwing big dollars at a big motor in the new stangs
and or designed to haul kids to soccer pratice.


I am sure it is plenty zippy, and I am sure that being in a truck mounted to truck suspension and breaks will up the numbers a bit but as it stands now that motor I think is only rated to two 3,000 pounds when it is attached to the explorer.

Heck, my stock 2012 regular cab tacoma is rated to tow 3500 with the 2.7 for the price point that this is going to be coming in at ( you know it is going to be upper 30's ) they better find a way for it to actually move some weight. If it cant match the towing of the tacoma or the colorado with a V6 then they are behind the game right out of the gate since they are only going to offer one motor to start. I also dont see this thing getting great MPG. The exploder I think is lighter and for sure is more streamlined then the ranger. The numbers seem like a losing battle to me. Heck, for the price, if I was looking for something small I would get a Honda Ridgeline. Sure the ranger can have a locker and low range, and 1 out of 100 people that buy this truck will ever use those beyond screwing around in a dirt parking lot. Perhaps I am just Biased since I bought a truck for doing truck stuff. bench seats, crank windows 4x4 clutch radio, thats sorta it. a 4 banger will trailer more then enough fire wood then I want to cut in one day, help me get dirt for the garden, pull the little boat, snomo, dirtbike around just fine. who knows your miles may differ....

 

[DaveInDenver]

The F150 with the EcoBoost seems to work fine. I don't have a problem with the gasoline engine choice here, I just question the reliability and longevity of it. Getting lots of power and torque from a small displacement engine isn't black magic. Toyota's philosophy seems to be not to tax an engine too hard relative to output so that it lasts a long time. This is the exact opposite of an EcoBoost, which takes two turbos and lots of boost to achieve. This usually doesn't equate to just oil changes for 250K miles.

 

[cdthiker]

The F150 with the EcoBoost seems to work fine. I don't have a problem with the gasoline engine choice here, I just question the reliability and longevity of it. Getting lots of power and torque from a small displacement engine isn't black magic. Toyota's philosophy seems to be not to tax an engine too hard relative to output so that it lasts a long time. This is the exact opposite of an EcoBoost, which takes two turbos and lots of boost to achieve. This usually doesn't equate to just oil changes for 250K miles.

Sure makes sense. My understanding is the 150 had the 2.7 eboost and the ranger would be getting the 2.3... I guess I dont mind going a bit slow if it means as mentioned. Oil changes for 250k miles.

And at the same time, sure a Subaru WRK STI can throw some impressive numbers but its what the power is being used for and the gearing of course. The oppsite end of the spectrum would be the ole ford diesels like the 7.3 before it got a turbo. Thing would pull a red wood out of a swamp going up hill because it was useable power. who knows. I guess time will tell. Knock on wood but im about to roll 120 k on the yota and the only thing that got fixed was the serpentine belt at 100 k. Other then that its just fluids tires. Im not surprised because as you said, thats how toyota rolls.... will be interasting to see how long the little ranger ends up lasting. You know if it dosent sell like gang busters ford will just yank it again

 

[DaveInDenver]

will be interasting to see how long the little ranger ends up lasting. You know if it dosent sell like gang busters ford will just yank it again

That's something I thought, too. Ford has demonstrated they aren't committed to a North American Ranger once. Will a buyer end up left in the cold with a one-and-done model? Nothing I've read says it's *exactly* the same truck they sell overseas, in which case would mean you at least have the support of companies like ARB who make accessories for it.

OTOH there does seem to be support for the Colorado/Canyon so perhaps just as long as there's money to be made they will come. But when the "overland" craze passes what will happen then? Despite being North American only the Tacoma sells in big numbers and does have some universal parts with the 4Runner and Hilux so it can't truly be an orphan.

 

[Dalko43]

What were you wanting in an engine? I thought the 2.7 ecoboost would have been nice, but Ford doesn't want anything to compete with the F150. A diesel? I'm over diesel and I drive one every day, I couldn't imagine private ownership of diesel, its not worth it.

I think people are jumping to premature conclusions on the engine options. Ford has already announced a diesel option for the F-150. There were very strong indicators that they are planning on introducing a diesel variant for the Ranger as well. The vehicle hasn't even hit showroom floors yet; people need to let things settle down before they get all worked up over which engine options are and are not offered.

But I'm still trying to figure out what the angle is here. What does the Ranger offer that the F150 doesn't, except for the momentary cachet of being the "next shiny new thing." Once the shiny and the new has worn off, what is it? A truck that carries less than an F150 and uses the same amount of gas as an F150? Where is the benefit there?
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Unless the price point is significantly lower than an F150, what can the new Ranger do that the F150 can't?

No offense to any F-150 owners here, but that thing, while it's earned a solid reputation, is a bit big and overdone for many prospective pickup buyers. The Raptor version is actually wider than most 3/4 ton's. It isn't exactly the nimble pickup that it was in previous years.

The Ranger is a true mid-sized pickup with a solid offroad pedigree based on its reviews from overseas. If the Tacoma and Colorado/Canyon are any indication, Ford should have no problem selling the Ranger probably to F-150 owners and to people who never wanted a F-150 to begin with.

 

[Clutch]

Just disappointed in their direction. Can't argue with their sales figures so it's really that I'm out of step.

I think for the most part the 3rd gen buyer is different than the old Toyota retro grouches...they seem to be more about portraying an image than anything. The butt hurt runs deep in the 3rd Gen section on TW if you say anything bad about it.


As for the turbo 4 banger...might be a touch leary about, but the Ecoboost in general seems to be proving itself. While all hearsay, have dirt bike bud that is a fleet service manager, that has a lot of ecoboost in the fleet...said they have been solid.

Hasn't most of the Honda line-up gone 4 CYL-Turbo?

I wouldn't push the truck too hard as it would be mainly used as a daily and hauling trail toys for the weekends. Probably be better served with a Honda Ridgeline, unsure how well the uni-body would hold up from years and years of going down washboard roads. BOF vehicles I think are little more forgiving in that respect because they flex more.

 

[Tex68w]

That leaked spec sheet for Ford motor line-up in 2020 MY shows four diesels if I recall correctly. We already know that one will be offered in the F-150, it's safe to assume that one of those motors will be offered in the new Ranger and one will be offered in the new Bronco, and I'd be willing to wager that the Explorer and Expedition will be optioned as well.

While the Tacoma has been limping along on the same old platform for years, it's parts crossover with the 4Runner and FJC have made it nearly impossible to kill post production with an almost seemingly endless supply of parts and aftermarket accessories. My two major complaints with the current Tacoma are the abysmal back seat space and the rear drive shaft design when lifted, obviously this can be overcome with upgrades. I would have purchased a TRD Pro Tacoma instead of the 4Runner if anyone other than a 5 year old could sit in the back seat without their knees in the back of the seat in front of them.

As usual with the Toyota products, you get a boringly reliable vehicle with a low cost of ownership and an exceptionally high resale value, those two factors allow a lot of people to look beyond the aging design and lackluster engine performance and technology packages.

 

[Martinjmpr]

That's something I thought, too. Ford has demonstrated they aren't committed to a North American Ranger once. Will a buyer end up left in the cold with a one-and-done model? Nothing I've read says it's *exactly* the same truck they sell overseas, in which case would mean you at least have the support of companies like ARB who make accessories for it.

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Highlighted the key point, I think. There was a time, not that long ago (mid 90's) when the Ranger was the top selling compact truck in the US. You couldn't swing a dead cat without hitting 15 of them.
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What happened? Well the F-150 had been pretty much the same model from 1981 to 1996, then all of a sudden there was a new F-150 and it seemed like right about then, Ford lost all interest in updating the Ranger. The Ranger got one final update in 1998 and after that - nothing. No new engines or cab configurations, just the same old same old, year after year, maybe with a different paint scheme or a catchy name. Meanwhile, Toyota started to skyrocket in popularity and Ford basically just ... quit trying.
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Ford went through, what, at least 2 or 3 complete "model refreshes" for the F-150 in the years of 1998 - 2011 while the Ranger got zero. It basically seemed as if Ford just stopped caring about the Ranger or its buyers and willingly ceded that market to Toyota.
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So the million dollar question is: Has Ford now determined that the mid-sized market is worth chasing? Because that means sinking money into updating the platform and making it competitive with the likes of the Colorado and Tacoma. Are they really "all in" on compacts? Or will stable gas prices mean that they will commit more to their (more profitable) full sized trucks?
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EDITED TO ADD: I can't help but wonder if Ford could not have rescued the Ranger nameplate back in the early 2000's by simply making the 4 door Ranger available in North American markets the way it had been available for years in Latin American ones. I seriously think this could have been a Tacoma killer, or if not a Tacoma killer, at least a worthy opponent, had Ford brought it over in 2002 or 2003 or so:
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Instead we got the half-assed Explorer Sport Trac.

 

[DaveInDenver]

.Ford lost all interest in updating the Ranger. The Ranger got one final update in 1998 and after that - nothing. No new engines or cab configurations, just the same old same old, year after year, maybe with a different paint scheme or a catchy name. Meanwhile, Toyota started to skyrocket in popularity and Ford basically just ... quit trying.
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Ford went through, what, at least 2 or 3 complete "model refreshes" for the F-150 in the years of 1998 - 2011 while the Ranger got zero. It basically seemed as if Ford just stopped caring about the Ranger or its buyers and willingly ceded that market to Toyota.

Ford in Detroit lost interest because it appeared the compact market in N.A. was declining as gas remained cheap and they made money in the domestic 1/2 ton market, which was highly competitive. It was the same reason the Dakota and S10 were punted. None of them saw the market as worth it.

However globally Ford never sold the Ranger we got, their Courier was a re-badged Mazda starting in 1971 and they didn't even introduce the Ranger name globally until 1998. With the 3rd generation in 2011 the Ranger sold in Australia was the first fully designed and built by Ford Australia.

So you could surmise that after 1998 Ford itself didn't care and was just coasting until the platform was fully tapped. It was the blokes down under that remained committed to the concept of a small truck and it seems it's a pretty good truck, stacks up well against Toyota. Ford seems to recognize there's demand and potential in using a global platform here in other models, so maybe they won't screw it up.

 

[Dalko43]

That leaked spec sheet for Ford motor line-up in 2020 MY shows four diesels if I recall correctly. We already know that one will be offered in the F-150, it's safe to assume that one of those motors will be offered in the new Ranger and one will be offered in the new Bronco, and I'd be willing to wager that the Explorer and Expedition will be optioned as well.

Do you have a link to the leaked spec sheet?

While the Tacoma has been limping along on the same old platform for years, it's parts crossover with the 4Runner and FJC have made it nearly impossible to kill post production with an almost seemingly endless supply of parts and aftermarket accessories.

I don't think there is a whole lot of parts crossover between the 4runner/FJ and the Tacoma. The former is built off of a completely different platform (the LC Prado) from the latter.

As usual with the Toyota products, you get a boringly reliable vehicle with a low cost of ownership and an exceptionally high resale value, those two factors allow a lot of people to look beyond the aging design and lackluster engine performance and technology packages.

Agree. Toyota's 4x4's are damn reliable and do well on the used market. But the newer models, even the newer Tacoma, are looking quite dated in comparison to the other vehicles on the market.