Four Door Jeep Wrangler Question

[Colorado David]

Hello, I'm new to the forum. My first post was on the Isuzu No Love topic. I own two Honda Passports from the mid 90's (relabeled Isuzu Rodeo's.) Years ago I owned a full-size Jeep 3/4 ton 4 wheel drive pickup. I should never have let it go. The Passports were both bought new. One is mine and the other is my wife's. Her's is a year newer than mine but with almost another 100,000 miles. I am really pretty pleased with mine and could keep it for a long time yet. I have fitted it with larger than stock BFG AT's. We are thinking of replacing the other and are thinking of the four door Jeep Wrangler. They have probably been discussed before, but does anyone here own one and care to give me a testimonial? I asked on another forum and only got one reply from someone who was very unhappy with a late 90's Wrangler. Thanks in advance for your help.

Off topic, I subscribed to the Overland Journal in the fall. After my first two issues, I needed more and bought all the back issues. Now I can't wait for the 2009 Gear issue.

 

[WFTW]

I'm on my 4th Jeep ('95, '98, '01, and '08...all Wranglers). The suspension in the Wranglers has improved over the years, so the ride isn't as bad as what it use to be...although it's still not a car-type ride. This can be helped by putting in better shocks, seats, etc. A Jeep isn't exactly known for its comfort, so if that's what you're looking for, look elsewhere.

As for capability, I don't think you're going to find a better 4x4 right off the showroom floor. I took my Jeep to Tellico a few months back and walked right over obstacles that my Hummer H2 with a 6" lift had problems with.

The 4-door's advantage over the 2-door (for me) is the storage space. Compared to what I use to have in my old TJ and YJ, I couldn't be happier. There's a massive improvement. Seeing as how I'll be taking a 6-month road trip beginning in April, space is very important.

It's going to come down to what you're looking to do with your vehicle. Mine was bought and then built for rock crawling and expedition travel. While it's very capable off-road, I can still take it out to the middle of nowhere and live comfortably for days on end.

Without knowing what you want to do with it, it's hard to answer your question accurately.

Here's my 4-door Rubicon...

Here's a link to the build thread in case you'd like to see what can be done with this type of vehicle: http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13636

Here's a link to the build thread of my trailer in case you'd like to see how to make it into a better expedition combination: http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23581

 

[phxtoad]

What are your goals? What are your requirements? Are you going to tow with it?

Did you test drive one? Sometimes the 'I really like it' factor governs...

At least with the JK you will have a ton of aftermarket support.

TL

 

[Colorado David]

Thanks gentlemen.

The vehicle needs to be able to do double duty. I will need a daily driver, although I office nearby and don't have a big daily commute. In addition it needs to be able to support my business needs. I do video production and still photography for the outdoor industry as well as corporate communications. I need a vehicle that can support my work in the outdoor industry without drawing too much attention from corporate clients. I need to be able to tow although that is not a regular occurence. I do put various canoes and boats on top and can spend 10 days to two weeks at a time camping at times. I also need to have enough room for a large dog kennel in the back. On my current 94 Passport, I've had the rear leaf springs re-arched and added additional leaves to support the normal load of equipment I carry. I don't set out to run serious trails for sport, but do need to be able to get where I need to for my work. The other vehicle I am seriously considering is the 2004 Disco. Thanks for your help.

 

[ox4mag]

First off, welcome to the board David. It's always good to see fellow enthusiasts join ExPo as it's an excellent resource.

Given your needs, I don't know that I would spend the big money for a 4-door Rubicon as it may have more bells/whistles than you need. However, a lower model 4-door Wrangler (the Sahara in particular) could be an excellent choice if outfitted with larger tires (maybe 33") and a roof rack to carry your canoes et al. The Rubicon is nice because of the electronic disconnects, front/rear lockers, etc all of which is very handy if tackling more difficult terrain.

If you need more input, post it on up. I'm sure a number of folks here can give further insight as needed. Good luck and welcome again!

 

[4Rescue]

Welcome to the board mate. Don't have any first hand experience with the 4DR JK, but they sure seem to be a hit. Personal;y I think that the 3.8V6 needs to be scrapped for something a little more torquey and with more HP, but alot of folks seem to not mind it at all. I drive a 22RE powered truck so ANYTHING has more power than my truck does .

If you're allright with your Passports, the JK will more than likely be suitable although It will ride rougher with the SFA and would be noisier with the soft-top (and the HT isn't as insulated or quiet as your current "full bodyied" Passports are either). I guess the real question is what do you want to do with the JK that you can't do with the Passport, and what is making you want a new rig???

All in all, I think that Chrysler did a good job with these new trucks. Personaly I like the 2dr LWB LJ alot better than teh 4DR JK both astheticly and from an OR performance standpoint, but the JK Rubi is nothing to scoff at.

Cheers

Dave

Edit: Well, I can see something awry with a few of your needs. Towing will NOT be a strong suit of these trucks. And, while overall they have a higher load capacity, they're far from voluminous inside. Honeastly there are some better options out there. a V8 4Runner seems like it'd be a good fit. Towing would be the least of it's worries adn overall I belive they're slightly larger inside in terms of overall capacity as well. Just throwing it out there.

 

[Renegade]

Owning both a 2004 Disco and a new JK, I would recomend the JK. It seems to me that the adverage 4wd could get you to the places you would like to go. The Disco does have more towing capatibility, however I had nothing but problems with it. It leaked water through all the door seals and this is a "known problem" to LandRover as I use to work for Land Rover, their only fix was to go to Home Depot and get some extra weather stripping to put around the door seam. This worked well for about a year and then started peeling off. it was so bad that from the inside of the Disco I could see day light comming through where the door seals on the A-pillar. Again tipical to Land Rover is a horriable, consitant wobble of the steering wheel. No matter what it would wear out all 4 tires extreamly fast and very choppy. This BIGGEST compalint is the traction control/ ABS system. It would work only when it wanted to. I could be driving around normaly and all of a sudden the traction control light/ABS and hill decent control light would illuminate thus leaving me without the function of any of those systems. The dealers only fix is to flash the computer and that only a temp. fix. Off-Road the trac. control worked GREAT....untill it would quit and you end up with what was practicly a front wheel drive. Parts are expensive, your normal maintance cost WILL go up. I only had 75k when I got rid of mine and I think I would have been lucky to get 110k miles out of it. Not to mention the resale value sucks on them. It was the first and LAST Land Rover I will ever own.

With all that said, I have had Jeeps all my life and never had nearly as many problems as I did with my Land Rover. My current Jeep is a 2dr JK, not much different than the 4dr other than the size. I love it. Its the best Jeep I have ever owned. The V6 could use more torque, and diesel or V8 would much be better, however I am very happy with it.

Buy yourself a 4dr Rubicon. Im sure it will more than satisfy your needs on and off road.

 

[Ruffin' It]

Disco vs. Jeep

I've owned a 2004 Disco since new and always rent a 4 door Wrangler when the Disco is in the shop, so I thought I'd chime in. I love my Disco, a lot. It is a GREAT truck, but Land Rover has it's reputation for a reason. The truck has never left me stranded, but I wouldn't want to buy one that didn't have a warranty at least for the first few thousand miles to make sure everything is A-OK. I also wouldn't buy one that didn't have ALL its service records and wasn't thoroughly checked out first (head gasket and front drive shaft u-joints specifically. The front U-joint is non-serviceable, goes out around 70K and costs $1,500 to replace - assuming you replace it before it explodes on you on the highway and launches itself through the transfer case.). I feel, stock-to-stock, the Disco is better off-road than the 4 door Jeep simply for the break-over angle and water crossing (I've had a steady, low-speed bow wave over my hood for significant crossings without even so much as a hiccup), but isn't as good when it comes to approach and departure angle. I have rarely had a problem with approach, but have drug the tow bar several times. The '04 Disco is as capable as a jeep Rubicon in all but the most extreme trails. I am still finding the limits of what mine can do. The Disco can carry more weight and actually tow well (I used to tow my race car with it), not to mention it feels much more solid and enjoyable to drive. The Jeep just feels cheap to me and the interior is not as well thought out. The jeep's ride is much better than I had expected, but is a bit loud (not too much to have a normal conversation on the highway, though) and feels a bit like the body is connected to the frame via Jell-O. I have cruised, fully-loaded for a week-long off-road trip in Colorado at 85 mph for long periods and never felt like the truck couldn't easily handle it, I don't think that I would be able to do that comfortably in a Jeep There is more room with the seats folded down in the Jeep, but that is mostly because there is almost no insulation Which has left me feeling cold even with the heat on. I regularly pull the rear seats out of my Disco and sleep in the back while camping. I'm 5'11" and just fit back there with my 5'6" girlfriend. It is actually really nice and cozy. I don't think I'd want to try that in the Jeep.
I know Jeep doesn't have the best track record with reliability, but I don't know enough to say anything other than I doubt it is worse than Rover. The Rover is extremely stoutly built though. The frame and suspension components are built like a train. The only other normal vehicle I know of that can match the strength of the underlying components on the Disco would be a Land Cruiser (80 and up).
Over all, if I were in a position to buy a new Jeep with the life-time drive train warranty, I would. Otherwise I'd probably buy a well-maintained used 04 Disco with low-miles and and put the rest of the money aside for repairs.

 

[haven]

I understand the attraction of the 2004 Land Rover Discovery. Autotrader.com lists plenty with low miles for less than $15K.

Here's an example 2004 Land Rover Discovery S 53K miles, $9,744
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=256757284

The "S" model is the least expensive trim level, which means no
sunroofs to leak. I think all 2004 Discos had leather interior and
automatic transmission.

There are plenty of people who say the Land Rover is unreliable, but the
2004 model, last of the Series II body style, has a very good record of
reliability.

edit: except for the previous two posts!

Chip Haven

 

[durango_60]

I've got a 4 door Rubicon and I really enjoy it, but with your description I think you may be better suited to a 4runner or Xterra. If you are satisfied with the off road ability of the Honda, then either of those vehicles would surely keep you happy and more comfortable than the Jeep would. I, for some strange reason, still feel the need to go play in the rocks in my daily driver and am willing to accept the lower level of comfort for the increased off road performance.

 

[WFTW]

Thanks gentlemen.

The vehicle needs to be able to do double duty. I will need a daily driver, although I office nearby and don't have a big daily commute. In addition it needs to be able to support my business needs. I do video production and still photography for the outdoor industry as well as corporate communications. I need a vehicle that can support my work in the outdoor industry without drawing too much attention from corporate clients. I need to be able to tow although that is not a regular occurence. I do put various canoes and boats on top and can spend 10 days to two weeks at a time camping at times. I also need to have enough room for a large dog kennel in the back. On my current 94 Passport, I've had the rear leaf springs re-arched and added additional leaves to support the normal load of equipment I carry. I don't set out to run serious trails for sport, but do need to be able to get where I need to for my work. The other vehicle I am seriously considering is the 2004 Disco. Thanks for your help.

For what you're describing, you certainly won't need to get a JK Rubicon. Actually, you could probably get by with the "X" model if you don't think you'll be lifting it and putting on larger tires (which could in turn hurt the Dana 30's underneath).

I'd actually suggest getting something else more suitable for your needs than a JK. There are plenty of 4x4 SUVs to choose from. A Wrangler is a different animal.

 

[mwigant]

Wranglers are not about being practical. They are rougher, slower, and more expensive (accesories) than other vehicles. They are also more versatile, better supported by the aftermarket and users, and more capable than the others. You just need to decide if you want an apple or an orange because they really can't be compared. I do think the JK is the first Wrangler that is good enough on road to be a daily driver/family type vehicle. That's why I bought one.

 

[Colorado David]

Thanks everyone. Durango 60, I really love your neck of the woods. I've had a lot of fun in the San Juans.

Frankly if money were not a concern I would buy a Defender 90 in a heartbeat just because I like them. But money is a factor. A colleague of mine told me that when I buy a new/different vehicle, I should be sure I could sleep in the back. I am right at 6 feet tall and cannot sleep in the back of the Passport. I could if I'd unbolt the rear seats and take them completely out, but I can't with them just folded down. I do like that they fold flat. Some vehicles I've looked at don't fold flat. I fill up the back when I go on a trip carrying both still and video gear in addition to camping equipment. I've never seriously considered the 4Runner because just looking at them, they don't appear to have as much cargo area as the Passport/Rodeo. The 04 Disco appeals to me for several reasons; solid front axle instead of CV's, factory lockers, cargo area height, and rain gutters for ease of mounting a roof rack. What I would like to get is a vehicle I can keep for a long time and not feel funny about putting money into mods. So many SUV's seem a bit temporary to me. I want one for the long haul.

Another photographer friend has an assistant that drives a Disco Series I. She has had it for a long time and never complains about its reliablity. When the price of gas goes up, she thinks about selling it, but she never does.

Towing is something I do on occasion, not regularly. I need to plan for it, but this vehicle wouldn't primarily be used to tow.

 

[Ruffin' It]

X2 on the S model (if you go LR at all). You will get the 16" wheels (which are preferable) and the "Dura-Grain" psuedo leather interior is supposed to be at least as durable, if not more so, than the real leather. I wish I would have gone that route.

I understand the attraction of the 2004 Land Rover Discovery. Autotrader.com lists plenty with low miles for less than $15K.

Here's an example 2004 Land Rover Discovery S 53K miles, $9,744
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=256757284

The "S" model is the least expensive trim level, which means no
sunroofs to leak. I think all 2004 Discos had leather interior and
automatic transmission.

There are plenty of people who say the Land Rover is unreliable, but the
2004 model, last of the Series II body style, has a very good record of
reliability.

edit: except for the previous two posts!

Chip Haven

 

[Ruffin' It]

Just an aside; the 04 Disco has a factory center locker, but the axles don't lock. They do have a really great traction control system, but no real lock. The trick is with the LR traction control is to just hold the engine at about 1,700 RPMs and let the Rover sort the rest out.

Thanks everyone. Durango 60, I really love your neck of the woods. I've had a lot of fun in the San Juans.

Frankly if money were not a concern I would buy a Defender 90 in a heartbeat just because I like them. But money is a factor. A colleague of mine told me that when I buy a new/different vehicle, I should be sure I could sleep in the back. I am right at 6 feet tall and cannot sleep in the back of the Passport. I could if I'd unbolt the rear seats and take them completely out, but I can't with them just folded down. I do like that they fold flat. Some vehicles I've looked at don't fold flat. I fill up the back when I go on a trip carrying both still and video gear in addition to camping equipment. I've never seriously considered the 4Runner because just looking at them, they don't appear to have as much cargo area as the Passport/Rodeo. The 04 Disco appeals to me for several reasons; solid front axle instead of CV's, factory lockers, cargo area height, and rain gutters for ease of mounting a roof rack. What I would like to get is a vehicle I can keep for a long time and not feel funny about putting money into mods. So many SUV's seem a bit temporary to me. I want one for the long haul.

Another photographer friend has an assistant that drives a Disco Series I. She has had it for a long time and never complains about its reliablity. When the price of gas goes up, she thinks about selling it, but she never does.

Towing is something I do on occasion, not regularly. I need to plan for it, but this vehicle wouldn't primarily be used to tow.