Go with all soft shackles?

[Metcalf]

No rust, no frays, wear gloves. Tetanus is not a concern. My cable doesn't snarl or loop and it has no rust. I have a fast winch and no-tension situations aren't that big of an issue.

I keep weight on the cable incase of failure. I have shackles but I don't use them attached to the line or even on a hook. I do have a pulley but it doesn't attach the line so I am not concerned about it flying.

Your steel winch cable must be worth a billion dollars because I have NEVER worked with a steel cable that doesn't have any residual memory in it that caused looping, snarls, or kinking under no tension.
This is doubly so for a winch cable that spends the majority of its life on a small diameter drum.
....not to mention you have steel that doesn't rust....magic....

The scars on my hands that where from injuries going THROUGH leather gloves when working with steel cable disagree with your logic of how it isn't a big deal. In a past life I worked around helicopters a lot and did a lot of long line work. Steel cable is bascially the devil. The happiest day ever was when we got our first synthetic long line.

Winching speed helps sometimes ( and I love a fast winch ) but it isn't a cure all, it is a patch over the issue.

 

[Metcalf]

if you knew how to rig safely,you'ld know you only need 1 dampener.

No child....so sorry....

At a minimum in VERY simplistic terms you should have a dampener on every portion of WORKING line. For example, if you are rigged with a snatch block you should have a dampner on EACH section of the line. One on the line from the winch to the block, and one on the line from the block to the load.

Now. When it comes to safety with the dampner concept, more is generally better. This is especially true when we are talking about failure of the rigging assemblies and not just the line/cable/strap.

This is a really good video about how this concept proves out in testing.

 

[hemifoot]

seeing it on the internet and actually doing it are two different things.i've yet to break any gear or damage any of my trucks so i must be wrong and you are the winching guru.don't call me child,it's petty and makes you look desperate.and don't give me homework either.i already know how to use my gear safely and properly.

 

[Metcalf]

seeing it on the internet and actually doing it are two different things.i've yet to break any gear or damage any of my trucks so i must be wrong and you are the winching guru.don't call me child,it's petty and makes you look desperate.

I appologize. You can call me out and belittle multiple people, but we aren't allowed to retort. My bad.

So you are saying you limited experience and have never had a situation , or been in a one, that went sideways. That clarifies things a lot for me. I'd like to live in a world where everything always goes perfect too.

I'm curious how you think a video of ACTUAL testing of the EXACT concept we where talking about doesn't apply? If you want me to write up a wall of test about the engineering/science behind the concept I can. I thought the 2 minute video was pretty clear. Your one sentence reply was a little lacking in technical depth for me.

 

[MOguy]

Your steel winch cable must be worth a billion dollars because I have NEVER worked with a steel cable that doesn't have any residual memory in it that caused looping, snarls, or kinking under no tension.
This is doubly so for a winch cable that spends the majority of its life on a small diameter drum.
....not to mention you have steel that doesn't rust....magic....

The scars on my hands that where from injuries going THROUGH leather gloves when working with steel cable disagree with your logic of how it isn't a big deal. In a past life I worked around helicopters a lot and did a lot of long line work. Steel cable is bascially the devil. The happiest day ever was when we got our first synthetic long line.

Winching speed helps sometimes ( and I love a fast winch ) but it isn't a cure all, it is a patch over the issue.

It is whatever cable comes on a Warn HS9500i, It is worth a billion but I will sell it to you or 10K. I can pull it out and it just lays there.

I will take some pics when I get home.

 

[Metcalf]

Interesting you mention helicopters.
Best handling wire rope ever is what hoists rescue basket. Its about 7mm dia., RR lay, corrosion resistant. Wonderful handling stuff.
After each time hoist is used, its inspected and scrapped if any sign of pinch, kink, fray, etc.
Alot of money keeps that hoist working...

My hands wish they would have applied the same stringent standards to the long lines I had to handle a lot. At least we finally got some synthetic lines before I left.

 

[Metcalf]

It is whatever cable comes on a Warn HS9500i, It is worth a billion but I will sell it to you or 10K. I can pull it out and it just lays there.

I will take some pics when I get home.

Go ahead. I'll take some pics of the piles of steel cable I have pulled off all my winches all snarled up.

 

[hemifoot]

I appologize. You can call me out and belittle multiple people, but we aren't allowed to retort. My bad.

So you are saying you limited experience and have never had a situation , or been in a one, that went sideways. That clarifies things a lot for me. I'd like to live in a world where everything always goes perfect too.

I'm curious how you think a video of ACTUAL testing of the EXACT concept we where talking about doesn't apply? If you want me to write up a wall of test about the engineering/science behind the concept I can. I thought the 2 minute video was pretty clear. Your one sentence reply was a little lacking in technical depth for me.

no,thats not what i said. what i am saying is i gather my own firewood and have been doing it for 30 years,and guess what,logs don't have tires.i winch them out to the road every single time,so yes,i know how to rig up a winch line.i didn't call any one any childish names.don't imply that i did.i will call you a pigeon though. why? because it's like trying to play chess with one.eventually it'll ******** all over the board then strut around like it won the game no matter what.

 

[Metcalf]

no,thats not what i said. what i am saying is i gather my own firewood and have been doing it for 30 years,and guess what,logs don't have tires.i winch them out to the road every single time,so yes,i know how to rig up a winch line.i didn't call any one any childish names.don't imply that i did.i will call you a pigeon though. why? because it's like trying to play chess with one.eventually it'll ******** all over the board then strut around like it won the game no matter what.

Oh please. Now it's all about everything but the actual topic. You came into the thread with one sentence replies about how everybody was wrong with no actual explanation of why. Please. You got called out on it and now you don't have any tech to back up what you said.

 

[MOguy]

Go ahead. I'll take some pics of the piles of steel cable I have pulled off all my winches all snarled up.

18 year old cable. I showed you mine now you show me yours.

No rust


Four year old strap

 

[old .45]

this post was painful to follow.......yes I do think that there some childish people here on EXPO, didn't seem so years ago

 

[Metcalf]

18 year old cable. I showed you mine now you show me yours.
No rust
Four year old strap

I will admit, that is one of the better winch cables I have seen in a while, especially one 18 years old. Good job on taking such good care of it

I do still see the memory factor with it stretched out on the ground, it only gets worse on the tighter layers on the drum in my experience. I also see lots of small broken strands...I wouldn't be going anywhere near it without gloves for handling it, sorry. I've been bitten to many times.



This is more typical of what I see for steel cable and was pulled off the used 8274 that was rebuilt on my LX45 ( which also has synthetic now ). If you look close there are a few flat spots, kinks, loops, and broken strands. This cable was about the same vintage as yours I believe, but I don't know all the history. It has been sitting on the old trailer for a few years now. I am surprised it doesn't show more signs of surface rust. I wonder if it is galvanized?



This is what it looks like with all the rope off the drum on the good ol' flatty. These upright winches hold a lot, and I usually under-fill them a bit for better performance and off-angle pulling. Note: It lays down FLAT tip to tail with zero memory under zero tension. This is one of the things that sold me on synthetic lines all those years ago. You can spool it off in a big clump at your feet and throw it up to the anchor location.



This is the worst spot I could find on the entire winch line. It was somewhere in the middle. Nothing to worry about with the rope being rated at a hair over 20K MBS in 10mm SK-75 Dyneema. I find most steel cable rated pretty low in comparison, 5/16 is only rated for an MBS of about 9900lbs. I do find that larger diameter synthetic lines are more durable in the long term. I've never broken one of my 10mm lines yet. I have been around a few 5/16" synthetic lines that have popped, and on inspection where found to have heat damage ( from a dragging in drum brake) . No...you can't pull synthetic lines over razor blades on fire, but in general I find most of the internet rumors about how fragile synthetic lines are to be hogwash in my experience. In my experience once the line develops the 'fuzz' texture it stops changing. Talking with our Sampson Rope guys at the office, that is normal and expected. The 'fuzz' generally functions as both a UV guard and an abrasion guard to protect the majority of the inner fibers which carry the load.



This section still looks new some 7+ years later. This rope has been flat out abused. I actually care for it less than I know I should because I want to see what the limits really are. It has never been washed once other than in the rain or snow when being used. It has been used in dirt, sand, rock, mud, and snow almost from coast to coast.



Here is the best picture I could come up with to show the most line at once. This is just about all the line top to bottom spooled off the drum. I'm actually surprised it looks this uniform in wear. I can't say that I always done a full pull or a short pull. I know I haven't throught about it much over the years. It has always worked well for me.

 

[MOguy]

I will admit, that is one of the better winch cables I have seen in a while, especially one 18 years old. Good job on taking such good care of it

I do still see the memory factor with it stretched out on the ground, it only gets worse on the tighter layers on the drum in my experience. I also see lots of small broken strands...I wouldn't be going anywhere near it without gloves for handling it, sorry. I've been bitten to many times.



This is more typical of what I see for steel cable and was pulled off the used 8274 that was rebuilt on my LX45 ( which also has synthetic now ). If you look close there are a few flat spots, kinks, loops, and broken strands. This cable was about the same vintage as yours I believe, but I don't know all the history. It has been sitting on the old trailer for a few years now. I am surprised it doesn't show more signs of surface rust. I wonder if it is galvanized?



This is what it looks like with all the rope off the drum on the good ol' flatty. These upright winches hold a lot, and I usually under-fill them a bit for better performance and off-angle pulling. Note: It lays down FLAT tip to tail with zero memory under zero tension. This is one of the things that sold me on synthetic lines all those years ago. You can spool it off in a big clump at your feet and throw it up to the anchor location.



This is the worst spot I could find on the entire winch line. It was somewhere in the middle. Nothing to worry about with the rope being rated at a hair over 20K MBS in 10mm SK-75 Dyneema. I find most steel cable rated pretty low in comparison, 5/16 is only rated for an MBS of about 9900lbs. I do find that larger diameter synthetic lines are more durable in the long term. I've never broken one of my 10mm lines yet. I have been around a few 5/16" synthetic lines that have popped, and on inspection where found to have heat damage ( from a dragging in drum brake) . No...you can't pull synthetic lines over razor blades on fire, but in general I find most of the internet rumors about how fragile synthetic lines are to be hogwash in my experience. In my experience once the line develops the 'fuzz' texture it stops changing. Talking with our Sampson Rope guys at the office, that is normal and expected. The 'fuzz' generally functions as both a UV guard and an abrasion guard to protect the majority of the inner fibers which carry the load.



This section still looks new some 7+ years later. This rope has been flat out abused. I actually care for it less than I know I should because I want to see what the limits really are. It has never been washed once other than in the rain or snow when being used. It has been used in dirt, sand, rock, mud, and snow almost from coast to coast.



Here is the best picture I could come up with to show the most line at once. This is just about all the line top to bottom spooled off the drum. I'm actually surprised it looks this uniform in wear. I can't say that I always done a full pull or a short pull. I know I haven't throught about it much over the years. It has always worked well for me.

I have done nothing other than painting the center just for the hell of it. I sent the one side of to Warn to fix the lock and free spool lever and the gear set on that side. I had no receipt, they asked no question and they fixed it for free. I paid for the shipping there they paid for shipping back and I got it the same week.

It came on a Warn winch it is a good cable. I am careful when I use it and roll the cable back on.

 

[MOguy]

So the answer to the OPs question is if you get quality items and take care of them as needed they will serve you well. Some items will have a longer life span, some are easier to work with, some take more maintainace. Just like about every other decision in life you will have to look at the pro and cons.

I like less maintainance and longevity and I will trade that for more comporsome cable and heavier shackles. Others like the flexibility and light weight rope.

 

[Metcalf]

So the answer to the OPs question is if you get quality items and take care of them as needed they will serve you well. Some items will have a longer life span, some are easier to work with, some take more maintainace. Just like about every other decision in life you will have to look at the pro and cons.

I like less maintainance and longevity and I will trade that for more comporsome cable and heavier shackles. Others like the flexibility and light weight rope.

Synthetic rigging products are about safety generally, the light weight is WHY they are safe. You have less stored energy if something where to fail.

All the other bonuses are just cherries on top.
-No worry about handling injuries
-Very few issues with spooling damage
-Easy to repair in the field
-Ease of handling off the drum
-Floats on water
-The light weight means you can carry more options for the same weight....more length, more shackles, etc

Cons-
-It might cost a little more
-You shouldn't use synthetic products if you need to pull over razor blades on fire. ( sharp and heat sensitive )