Has anybody done a TRANS Cooler Upgrade on their 7.3 ambulance?

[VOODOO7.3]

Cool. Just my preference, I'm sure Dorman makes some nice stuff but I try to stick to OEM on most engine parts. I didn't consider the 26 or 31 row tranny cooler from the F series with a 6.0 psd as it won't fit in the E series. You suggest it does, at least on an older, pre-2003 van with the 7.3? I believe the 26 row came out later so maybe it was the 31 row that initially didn't fit.

Just my opinion but the stock cooler on the vans with a 6.0 is not a strong point. It's not up to the task and is ~5 times smaller than the F series cooler. At least not on a camper van that weighs upwards of 10,000 lb. Many of us also have aftermarket bumpers which also block air flow. I was routinely above 200F and much higher at times when rock crawling. Max was 275F going over 12,000' Imogene Pass in the San Juan Mountains.

I only posted to suggest an alternative that worked for me that has 3/8" fittings; whereas the 26 row is 1/2". It's pretty much a direct bolt-in replacement especially for vans with the 7.3. But if the 26 row OEM cooler will fit that is good news as well and can be found for less than $300. http://parts.autonationfordwhitebea...ransmission-cooler/5c3z-7a095-ca/?parent=1064


stock E series cooler with a 6.0
View attachment 356480


Tru-Max 40k cooler installed as a replacement.
View attachment 356481

Storm, I have a 7.3/4R100 and that original cooler on your 6.0 looks exactly like the original cooler on mine! I can't believe they put that one in there and put huge ones on the trucks! Worth replacing that tiny cooler! The 26 row cooler fits. The temp numbers I posted earlier are not opinions. They came straight from a Ford Automatic Trans Engineer who both helped develop the 4R100, and tested them to failure repeatedly. He is active and very helpful on other forums. The common mistake that lots of people make is thinking if one cooler is good, two is better. Counterproductive most times due to restriction and the inability to pump fluid through 2 effectively. So if anyone is considering a cooler, they need to know one big one is best! Cheers!

 

[stormlover]

Storm, I have a 7.3/4R100 and that original cooler on your 6.0 looks exactly like the original cooler on mine! I can't believe they put that one in there and put huge ones on the trucks! Worth replacing that tiny cooler! The 26 row cooler fits. The temp numbers I posted earlier are not opinions. They came straight from a Ford Automatic Trans Engineer who both helped develop the 4R100, and tested them to failure repeatedly. He is active and very helpful on other forums. The common mistake that lots of people make is thinking if one cooler is good, two is better. Counterproductive most times due to restriction and the inability to pump fluid through 2 effectively. So if anyone is considering a cooler, they need to know one big one is best! Cheers!

Agreed. The OP should get the largest cooler that will fit in his ambo. A bigger pan will do nothing and it's not a good idea to add another cooler like the Derale with a fan in series. That could restrict the return flow. I've also seen the same engineer Mark Kovalsky post that there is no difference in cooling efficiency between the 26 row and 31 row cooler. I also did a flow test on mine since there was a potential restriction by going from 1/2" to 3/8" fittings but all was within spec. I'm pretty happy now that I never get above 200F but I still haven't seen any published info on what is the normal range. The same engineer had this to say,

"There is nothing magical about 200°F. You can run all day at 220°F all day long with no problem

."

I had these threads bookmarked when doing research on the swap. Good reading: http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1133650-whats-the-normal-trans-temp-4r100.html

And I found this: http://www.digi-panel.com/trannyoil.htm

150° F= The minimum operating temperature. Note: It is possible in low ambient temperatures to overcool the transmission with auxiliary oil to air coolers. Oil to water coolers in standard factory radiators will normally not overcool a transmission.

175-200° F= Normal pan oil temperature operating range.

275° F= Maximum allowable oil pan temperature for short durations during long hill climbs.

300° F=Damage occurs to internal transmission parts, including warpage of metal parts, degradation of clutches, and melting of seals. Transmission oil oxidizes, (forming varnish-like substances causing further clutch slippage and compounding heat build up) and transmission oil life is extremely short.

 

[Buddha.]

Fluid was clean and didn't smell burned. But that event prompted the replacement with the Tru-Cool 4739 unit and the reduction in temp is impressive ~30F at normal operating temp. It's hard to find definitive information on how hot is too hot. Just lots of opinions. Ford does not publish a number and the idiot light doesn't even come on at 250F. I've read that you can hit 300F before really cooking things and 250F is actually ok for short periods. It also depends on where the temp probe is located. My pan reading is 10 to 15F cooler than what the PCM is reading.

I'm after reliability and peace of mind. I'll take quality over price but don't know whether there is much difference between the Dorman and OEM.

 

[4x4pair]

Great chart!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk

 

[IdaSHO]

And exactly why I noted 220F as my target MAX

Anything above that and you are simply asking for problems.


That said, a good synthetic helps as it can tolerate higher temps than dino

 

[Buddha.]

I know the newer synthetic fluids can handle more heat but I wonder if the rest of the transmission can.

 

[VOODOO7.3]

Agreed. The OP should get the largest cooler that will fit in his ambo. A bigger pan will do nothing and it's not a good idea to add another cooler like the Derale with a fan in series. That could restrict the return flow. I've also seen the same engineer Mark Kovalsky post that there is no difference in cooling efficiency between the 26 row and 31 row cooler. I also did a flow test on mine since there was a potential restriction by going from 1/2" to 3/8" fittings but all was within spec. I'm pretty happy now that I never get above 200F but I still haven't seen any published info on what is the normal range. The same engineer had this to say, ."

I had these threads bookmarked when doing research on the swap. Good reading: http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1133650-whats-the-normal-trans-temp-4r100.html

And I found this: http://www.digi-panel.com/trannyoil.htm

Storm, great info posted, and Mark is also the one who said the 4R100 transmission must reach 170 for optimal efficiency. I grew up up North and now live in TX where it is much hotter. Another thing to consider would be for those running in mostly hot desert like conditions to bypass the radiator connections. Up north, that section obviously helps warm the fluid faster. Mark also said that he wouldn't run anything but Mobil 1 fluid, and you are correct, even if the 31 row cooler did fit, Mark said there is no added benefit. Also important for all to note is that you don't need to turn overdrive off unless the transmission is "hunting" for gears. I think Woodnthings 6.0 install, that I posted the link to, makes sense. It pays to run 1/2" hose all the way from transmission with as few bends as possible. The stock 7.3 van engines are de-tuned by about 80 HP compared to the 7.3 trucks, due to the lack of an inter cooler, so transmission temps really become a bigger factor after making performance upgrades or towing/hauling heavy loads. For extreme conditions, it is possible to do a modification where you can manually lock up your torque converter when necessary. I personally keep mine below 220 degrees (AutoMeter fluid/pan temp) at all times. I'm never in such a rush that I'm willing to ruin my transmission to get somewhere a few minutes sooner! Cheers!

 

[FDM2012]

Ok, let me throw some more spaghetti on the wall to see what sticks....

What if, I were to get a 6.0 31 row cooler, bypass the cooling through the radiator, AND still run my 1/2'' Derale w/fan?

I have done some significant power mods to the motor, and would like to buy and drop 10 degrees on my thermostat to help with
the underhood temps. With the transcooler not in the circuit, I would think the radiator would be able to do that....Maybe??

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know I am coming off the rails here, but these vans have heat issues and I want to seriously address it somehow.
So far, I have made a poor mans ram air cold intake (Posts #5, #13, and #50 in my build thread), added 4'' exhaust, cutting in
hood vents in the coming days, but I am just trying to think of any other ways I can cool things down a bit.

Are you laughing yet?

Build thread: http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/159270-New-Member-New-Rig?p=2102869#post2102869

 

[VOODOO7.3]

Ok, let me throw some more spaghetti on the wall to see what sticks....

What if, I were to get a 6.0 31 row cooler, bypass the cooling through the radiator, AND still run my 1/2'' Derale w/fan?

I have done some significant power mods to the motor, and would like to buy and drop 10 degrees on my thermostat to help with
the underhood temps. With the transcooler not in the circuit, I would think the radiator would be able to do that....Maybe??

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know I am coming off the rails here, but these vans have heat issues and I want to seriously address it somehow.
So far, I have made a poor mans ram air cold intake (Posts #5, #13, and #50 in my build thread), added 4'' exhaust, cutting in
hood vents in the coming days, but I am just trying to think of any other ways I can cool things down a bit.

Are you laughing yet?

Build thread: http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/159270-New-Member-New-Rig?p=2102869#post2102869

FDM, is this a joke? You can't run 2 trans coolers unless you want hotter fluid that doesn't circulate due to too much resistance. There is no significant benefit to the 31 row over the 26 row. International designed and built your 444 cubic inch diesel, not Ford, and they designed it to run with a 203* thermostat! If you want cooler under hood temps, it's a whole other thread. I have lots of performance mods and LESS under hood heat. Probably the biggest under hood heat source is your turbo! I have increased air intake, WW2 compressor wheel, double wrapped bellowed up pipes, turbo blanket, EBPV delete pedestal, free flow turbo outlet, double wrapped down pipe, straight through muffler, etc. The turbo spools up faster and the heat goes out the tailpipe where it is supposed to! I also flushed all the gold coolant out of the system, installed a new radiator and switched over to Delo ELC. Hood louvers may reduce heat when idling, but do nothing while driving. The highest point under the hood is actually a 4" wide X about 3" high channel below the wiper cowl. If you wanted to make a snorkel style outlet there, it could be done towards the passenger side, where there are no wiper arms. That would reduce temps while idling, which I don't do. Hope that helps.

 

[FDM2012]

ALL great tips. Thx Voodoo!!

 

[djbonsu]

Some really good info in here! So if I understand this correctly, I can install a 26 row 6.0 transmission cooler and i should also utlize the 1/2" lines & fittings and ditch the 3/8" lines that come stock on the 7.3 van?

 

[stormlover]

Ok, let me throw some more spaghetti on the wall to see what sticks....

What if, I were to get a 6.0 31 row cooler, bypass the cooling through the radiator, AND still run my 1/2'' Derale w/fan?

I have done some significant power mods to the motor, and would like to buy and drop 10 degrees on my thermostat to help with
the underhood temps. With the transcooler not in the circuit, I would think the radiator would be able to do that....Maybe??

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know I am coming off the rails here, but these vans have heat issues and I want to seriously address it somehow.
So far, I have made a poor mans ram air cold intake (Posts #5, #13, and #50 in my build thread), added 4'' exhaust, cutting in
hood vents in the coming days, but I am just trying to think of any other ways I can cool things down a bit.

Are you laughing yet?

Build thread: http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/159270-New-Member-New-Rig?p=2102869#post2102869

I'm not sure of the efficacy of hood louvers at speed but they definitely help dissipate the under-hood heat when stopped. At least on vans with the 6.0, underhood temps cook the wiring harness and are hard on electrical components like the FICM. By far the biggest difference was made by ceramic coating and wrapping the turbo Y-pipe and downpipe. Now, I can actually keep a beverage cold in the cup-holder on the dag haus.

Some really good info in here! So if I understand this correctly, I can install a 26 row 6.0 transmission cooler and i should also utlize the 1/2" lines & fittings and ditch the 3/8" lines that come stock on the 7.3 van?

A really good question. The tranny can only pump so much fluid and was designed around a return flow utilizing 3/8" lines. Does replacing the lines with a bigger diameter actually help? I have no idea but either way, the return flow will face a restriction somewhere. There are published specs for the flow so it can all be tested.

This is a good source for the fittings. https://www.plumbingsupply.com/barb.html

 

[FDM2012]

I'm onboard with that Stormlover. I have a turbo blanket on the way, and this weekend, I am doing hood vents.

I will put the updates on all of that in my build thread:

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/159270-Another-AMBO-Rig

As far as the transcooler, I am all over the place. I have this $164 1/2'' Derale cooler w/fan sitting in
my living room that I am still considering putting on, BUT, I really do value the strong points that Voodoo and
other have been making about over restricting and pressure loss, and whatnot. And, my dang Magnefine is also 3/8''.
If I do put this cooler in, I will do the 1/2'' hose all the way (including a new 1/2'' Magnefine), for sure.

Decisions, decisions....