has anyone done their own gear change?

[slimtwo]

I'm at a point with my Jeep TJ where I am ready to do a gear change, and I am thinking about making it a father son project (not expecting it to take more than a day or two). Is there anyone of you who has done it, that could share with me any "unforseen’s" I might encounter, or "do's and don'ts" that might help me with this project? This is a limited edition "Willy's", with stock 3.73's, and I am going up to 4.56's. The front axle is a D30, with a D35 in the rear. I am also planning to install an Eaton E-Locker in the rear while I'm at it. I would be grateful for any helpful input.

Happy trails!

Bruce

 

[Eric S.]

Don't bother wasting money on the D35. Spend the money on a 8.8 or D44 and upgrade those, otherwise you will be busting shafts. There is an issue with the 2005 having a 5 on 5 both pattern though ( I think) the axles I mentioned have 5 on 4.5 . Maybe hunt for a set of D44 Rubicon axles with lockers and gears installed.
Having a set of set-up bearings helps when setting shims so you don't have to keep pressing on and off the good bearings.

 

[shortbus4x4]

Don't bother wasting money on the D35. Spend the money on a 8.8 or D44 and upgrade those, otherwise you will be busting shafts. There is an issue with the 2005 having a 5 on 5 both pattern though ( I think) the axles I mentioned have 5 on 4.5 . Maybe hunt for a set of D44 Rubicon axles with lockers and gears installed.
Having a set of set-up bearings helps when setting shims so you don't have to keep pressing on and off the good bearings.

What he said about the rear axle.

Set up bearings save so much time and frustration. I have done a few gear changes for my work and am in the middle of doing a gear change from 5.87 to 4.56 on my own Jeep. I made my own set up bearings by getting the old ones off and then using a hone and drill to make the inside diameter bigger. You can buy set up bearings too but I am cheap. Its actually pretty easy to do gear changes if you take your time and keep track of which shims came from where. Quite often I use the old shims for the initial install and don't have to add or subtract any. A pencil, paper and calculator can be handy to have when doing your pinion shims on the new pinion and if you have to change any shims on the carrier.

 

[jeep-N-montero]

Don't bother wasting money on the D35. Spend the money on a 8.8 or D44 and upgrade those, otherwise you will be busting shafts. There is an issue with the 2005 having a 5 on 5 both pattern though ( I think) the axles I mentioned have 5 on 4.5 . Maybe hunt for a set of D44 Rubicon axles with lockers and gears installed.
Having a set of set-up bearings helps when setting shims so you don't have to keep pressing on and off the good bearings.

All TJ's were 5x4.5 lug pattern. And yes, look for a used set of 44's from a Rubicon model, at least for the rear.

 

[GP'd]

What he said about the rear axle.

Set up bearings save so much time and frustration. I have done a few gear changes for my work and am in the middle of doing a gear change from 5.87 to 4.56 on my own Jeep. I made my own set up bearings by getting the old ones off and then using a hone and drill to make the inside diameter bigger. You can buy set up bearings too but I am cheap. Its actually pretty easy to do gear changes if you take your time and keep track of which shims came from where. Quite often I use the old shims for the initial install and don't have to add or subtract any. A pencil, paper and calculator can be handy to have when doing your pinion shims on the new pinion and if you have to change any shims on the carrier.

Agreed. Get the correctly sized bearing separator and make a set up bearing or buy another bearing and honing it out. Trust me, the extra $20 dollars for a bearing will save you in sanity.

I am fairly new to posting on the forum....though I have been on here for a while. I did just start a post for my build where I am installing an 8.8 & 4.56 gears with a Dana 30 front.

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/62651-Refreshing-the-TJ-Build-Thread

All in all it wasn't hard, just having the right tools an patience go a long way!

 

[slimtwo]

OK, so I'm kinda getting the idea that I shouldn't waste my time with the D35 rear axle. It almost sounds like I should just change the gearing and leave it open. Up till now, I have been able to get through some pretty technical sections of various trails i've been on with out the need for a locker, I just figured since I was having to pull everything out anyway, it made sense to make the change.

I have found several adds in the past, for Rubicon axles for sale, front and rear with the lockers and comressor for like $1,500.00 bucks. Course, I probably won't find a deal like that now that I have the money.

 

[slimtwo]

What he said about the rear axle.

Set up bearings save so much time and frustration. I have done a few gear changes for my work and am in the middle of doing a gear change from 5.87 to 4.56 on my own Jeep. I made my own set up bearings by getting the old ones off and then using a hone and drill to make the inside diameter bigger. You can buy set up bearings too but I am cheap. Its actually pretty easy to do gear changes if you take your time and keep track of which shims came from where. Quite often I use the old shims for the initial install and don't have to add or subtract any. A pencil, paper and calculator can be handy to have when doing your pinion shims on the new pinion and if you have to change any shims on the carrier.

Why do you need to hone the inside of the bearings?

Oh wait a minute. You're talking about a set of bearings that slide on and off to use for figuring out the number of shims needed and so on, then pressing the new bearings on after you figure it out?

 

[Dr. Jones]

Why do you need to hone the inside of the bearings?

Oh wait a minute. You're talking about a set of bearings that slide on and off to use for figuring out the number of shims needed and so on, then pressing the new bearings on after you figure it out?

Exactly right. Setup bearings are the only way to go. Pressing the good bearings on and off a whole bunch of times is not only intensly annoying, it can also damage them. Press the new ones on one time, right at the end of the job.

 

[Eric S.]

Press the new ones on one time, right at the end of the job.

Hopefully
Measure the thickness of the set-up bearings and the new ones. If there is any difference adjust the final shim pack accordingly. Then once the new bearings are in and everything is installed check the final installation just to make sure nothing moved.

OK, so I'm kinda getting the idea that I shouldn't waste my time with the D35 rear axle. It almost sounds like I should just change the gearing and leave it open.

I don't think it would be worth wasting the money to even re-gear a D35. What size tires do you plan on running? Locking the front might be a good option as well.

 

[GP'd]

OK, so I'm kinda getting the idea that I shouldn't waste my time with the D35 rear axle. It almost sounds like I should just change the gearing and leave it open. Up till now, I have been able to get through some pretty technical sections of various trails i've been on with out the need for a locker, I just figured since I was having to pull everything out anyway, it made sense to make the change.

I have found several adds in the past, for Rubicon axles for sale, front and rear with the lockers and comressor for like $1,500.00 bucks. Course, I probably won't find a deal like that now that I have the money.

Like you I've run my D35 through some very hairy situations with only the factory LSD and no front locker. My confidence in it was high given that I'm not heavy on the pedal and at the time only running 31" tires.

However, this changed. Last year, April-ish before the 2010 overland expo, I was installing disc brakes on the rear of my jeep and pulled the axle shafts out. When I did that my entire carrier fell from the car and shards of LSD discs flew in all directions. I had been driving on that axle for who knows how long with shattered discs only held together by the axle shafts. I ordered new spider gears and LSD clutch packs and I have been good since.

The problem is that I no longer trust that rear axle, and like you, when it came to re-gearing and changing my suspension I decided it was time to beef things up, hence the 8.8.

I spent a year looking for TJ D44 Housings and when they do appear they cost a pretty penny. All in for the 8.8 I've spent around $800 and I probably have another $800-900 in the future when I decide to upgrade the factory LSD to an ARB.

I apologize for the long winded response.....I've spent more than a few hours thinking about this.

 

[slimtwo]

Hopefully
Measure the thickness of the set-up bearings and the new ones. If there is any difference adjust the final shim pack accordingly. Then once the new bearings are in and everything is installed check the final installation just to make sure nothing moved.



I don't think it would be worth wasting the money to even re-gear a D35. What size tires do you plan on running? Locking the front might be a good option as well.

I am running 33" tires with a Rubicon Express 4.5" superflex lift, and I don't plan to go any taller.

So the deal with the D35 is the size axles? Is that why I shouldn't waste the money to re-gear?

 

[slimtwo]

Like you I've run my D35 through some very hairy situations with only the factory LSD and no front locker. My confidence in it was high given that I'm not heavy on the pedal and at the time only running 31" tires.

However, this changed. Last year, April-ish before the 2010 overland expo, I was installing disc brakes on the rear of my jeep and pulled the axle shafts out. When I did that my entire carrier fell from the car and shards of LSD discs flew in all directions. I had been driving on that axle for who knows how long with shattered discs only held together by the axle shafts. I ordered new spider gears and LSD clutch packs and I have been good since.

The problem is that I no longer trust that rear axle, and like you, when it came to re-gearing and changing my suspension I decided it was time to beef things up, hence the 8.8.

I spent a year looking for TJ D44 Housings and when they do appear they cost a pretty penny. All in for the 8.8 I've spent around $800 and I probably have another $800-900 in the future when I decide to upgrade the factory LSD to an ARB.

I apologize for the long winded response.....I've spent more than a few hours thinking about this.

Not to wory about the long wind. I find when dealing with this technical stuff, you can never expel to much wind!

Sorry to hear about your axle, maybe I will start looking for D44's. If I found a pair (or even just the rear), they come with 4.10 gears from the factory with the air lockers. I would probably run those for a while and see how they do. Like I said, I don't plan on going any larger in tire diameter, I have never had to turn around on any trail I've been on due to clearance issues.

 

[Stumpalump]

I regeared a few times and built a few rigs. This is what I learned: After regearing a few I've decided that it's not worth the the tools and time to do it yourself. It's a PITA and if you have the axle out a shop will do it for about 100 bucks. Money well spent if you pull the axles out. Check their work before you install with gear paint and a backlash check because many just slap in the gears. If it's not really loose or binding then they call it good. The next thing I learned was beefing weak axles. A beefed up weak axle is still a weak axle. You are better off leaving a strong axle stock then beefing a weak axle. Think Dana 60's. You know you want them and this is the time before you put a ton of cash into small axles that will be worthless in a couple of years. A good set of used locked 60's are still worth a lot of money. If not then take the others advise on the 8.8 at least. Use genuine Ford Motorcraft gears from Jegs because they almost drop in and are strong. Best gears for a Dana are built by Dana Spicer. The rest are not as strong and require so much more set up time that it's not worth saving any money on aftermarket gear sets. Actually the 8.8 was the easiest gear swap I've done. It also comes with disk breaks and an e-brake making it one of the best bangs for the buck. C-clip eliminator cr-mo axles are available with the wheel bolt pattern you need. My current rig has that and it's been bulletproof for 4 years. So you see you will be spending money no matter how you do it so I still say go with 60's once and have the best for a little more weight penalty and money.

 

[jeffy]

Hopefully
Measure the thickness of the set-up bearings and the new ones. If there is any difference adjust the final shim pack accordingly. Then once the new bearings are in and everything is installed check the final installation just to make sure nothing moved.

+1
Saves you the headaches of trying to figure out why the pattern isn't right. .
Gears require a bunch of specialized tools though. Bearing puller is always nice. Hydraulic press, inch-lbs dial (or beam) torque wrench, dial indicator, micrometer/caliper, etc... If you're really self-motivated and are willing to take the time to do it to spec. it's not that bad. Otherwise, it's not worth it if you can find someone to install them for $75-200. The setup bearings really help though. A case splitter is also very handy. Most shops will pull and press bearings for you if you don't have a press. It's just time consuming to have to pull then drive the carrier to the shop and then drive back then drive to get them pressed.

If it's your first time then I'd estimate a day for each axle.

 

[Eric S.]

I am running 33" tires with a Rubicon Express 4.5" superflex lift, and I don't plan to go any taller.

So the deal with the D35 is the size axles? Is that why I shouldn't waste the money to re-gear?

With 33" tires and a D35 it is only a mater of time until you bust an axle shaft...so at least pack a spare. The problem with Dana 35 axles are their weak axle shafts but they also have smaller gears as well. I think they were marginal for use with stock sized tires even.