Help me choose an off road and expedition vehicle

[Nullifier]

The xterra is so tall because of the stadium seating in the rear. Plus it's the high roof that allows you to place the bikes in the back with out messing with your bikes seat hieght. You will not be able to put bikes in the rear with people sitting in the back. They only fit the rear seat folded down.

The rack is useless. You will need to add either thule or yakima set up to it and that makes it even taller. Oh and you can ditch the factory cargo basket if you need it it only holds 35lbs.

One last thing the factory wind fairing on ours made a ton of racket. It wasn't strong enough and would vibrate something fierce at highway speed. after the dealer replaced it twice we decided to just take it off.

 

[jeffryscott]

vehicle choice

Thanks guys,

Jeff,
I have no preference in driving position between the Toyota and Nissa, both were fine. I do, however, have some concerns about the crash protection of the Trooper reported in Consumer Reports, especially compared with the Toyota and Nissan.

:wavey:

Frankly, I wouldn't give much credence to Consumer Reports when it comes to anything more than reliability. I've had two vehicles they deemed "unsafe," a Samurai and the Trooper. Neither were difficult or dangerous to drive. Isuzu won the case against CR for the "rollover" risk associated with the Trooper, but it killed Trooper sales (one reason prices are so low.)

I'm certainly not trying to sway you into the Trooper, just want to give experience from a former owner. A clear advantage with the Trooper is the price. You really do get a lot of vehicle, and it comes with reliability on par with the Toyota. (The only reason I don't have the Trooper is I traded it straight across for a Land Rover Discovery. I sold the Discovery after 3 years because gas was killing me).

With a slight Old Man Emu lift, you can fit 285-75-16 tires, get an ARB winch bumper and winch, sliders and ARB lockers and for less than 15K you would have a truly remarkable and setup. Throw in a rooftop tent and an ARB or Engel fridge and take the rest of the money for a nice trip.

Bottom line, if the Trooper is of interest, don't worry about what CR says. They are great vehicles and truly capable. And while there isn't a whole lot of aftermarket support, there is enough to make it a great expedition vehicle.

If you drive it, you'll notice the stock suspension (shocks) is soft and cushy. I replaced mine with Old Man Emu as the second mod (tires first) and wasboard roads I bounced all over at 25 in stock form I could cruise at 45 and track straight.

Sorry for rambling ...

Jeff

(BTW, I'm also a photographer)

 

[chet]

Is there a problem getting parts for Isuzus now that the company is gone? I like the trooper as well but parts availability would scare me.

 

[BlueTrooper]

The company isn't gone...they just stopped making the Trooper a couple of years back (unfortunately).

There are still a LOT of them on the road, though, and enough aftermarket providers of parts.

 

[datrupr]

I have not had any trouble getting parts for mine. Most of the auto parts stores in my area carry them, or at least can get them the next day. Price is not out of line for them either. I did have to pay $350 for a new starter last year though, but the most expensive repair to date with my Trooper.

 

[bigreen505]

I drove the Trooper today. It looked nearly showroom fresh -- very clean. Judging by the looks of the owner, I suspect this may have been the dirtiest the car had ever been! The size seems perfect -- roughly the same physical dimensions as an Xterra, but all useful space. I didn't love the driving position, but pretty much left things as the owner had them, so it probably could get better. Okay power. However, at 31,000 mi, this truck had more shakes and rattles than my Pathfinder at 322,000! Is this normal? The owner thought it was just the discs in the in-dash changer rattling around, but whatever it was it did not inspire confidence. It just didn't seem very well screwed together. I'm not convinced this particular Trooper will be a high-mileage, high reliability vehicle. (Scott, Kevin, Aaron, comments?).

On the plus side, I could see why this would be a good rig off road and the sunroof is to die for. If my math is correct this would be about $16k built up -- $10k less than an Xterra! However, there is a reason a Toyota or Nissan costs twice as much, at least for this rig.

Earlier in the day, I brought a load to the Nissan dealer to try in an Xterra. It included:
- 1 baby car seat (with baby attached)
- 1 jogging stroller, folded as much as they fold
- 1 road bike (XL compact frame with 110 stem)
- 1 "bike box," aka small laundry basket with bike clothes
- 1 pair of 188 cm skis
- 1 small backpack

All this fit in my Pathfinder with a little creativity and head scratching. It also fit in the Xterra, only with room to spare! It just goes to show there is more to life than numbers, or as the photography community calls it, measurebating. If you want to see if your gear fits, try it out. As a bonus my wife like driving it, which is important on long trips.

On the down side of it all, I remembered that a sunroof is high on the priority list. I ran the Alpine Loop in the Colorado San Juans last year for the first time with the sun roof removed in the Pathfinder and it was a completely different experience than previous trips. That was what led me to want a Jeep and begin the search for a new vehicle. Sometimes the best view is straight up. I'm not sure where this leaves me. Somewhere in the course of measurebating and carefully considering and pricing each potential vehicle, I forgot that the journey is the destination and, aside from getting home safely, enjoying the beauty of the scenery is the most important part of the trip for me. I'm not quite sure where this all leaves me, but I need to re-asses my priorities.

The one remaining option I have not yet driven is a UJZ100. I'll report back when I do.

-Bill

 

[BlueTrooper]

The Trooper IS very nice when equipped with a sunroof. It's the biggest sunroof I've seen. Very handy for desert driving when a lot of dust is being kicked up, and you don't want to shut ALL the windows. It's also nice when you're driving at night in a remote area and want to see a starry sky. Try opening it and reclining the front seats (when you're stopped, of course!!).

One of the drawbacks I've found, in my Trooper, at least, is the rattle/squeak factor. As for the CD changer, it seems like unloading the CD's would be a good way to see if that was the culprit. Another thing that can rattle a bit is the equipment in the jack compartment (removable panel on the left side of the rear storage area) if it's not properly stowed.

There's also a "secret" tool/storage comparment (at least on my model year) located beneath the 60/40 split rear seats. You have to flip the seats down and then up to reveal it. I found that the previous owner had forgotten all about the tools he left in there....as well as the leaking can of fix-a-flat. What a mess!

Another source of shakes and squeaks is one of my favorite features on the Trooper: The wide-opening, EZ-load "ambulance doors." I've got a major squeaking problem on mine now that I recently hung a heavier spare tire on the outside. They sure do make loading/unloading easy, though!

"Measurebating..." Now that's an interesting word...rngartis

 

[calamaridog]

Bill,

If safety is a major factor in your purchase decision, the 2000 and later UZJ100's have TRAC (traction control) instead of the rear locker. They also have VSC (vehicle stability control) which works by modulating the abs system to help avoid losing control of the vehicle at high speeds.

The VSC really works, I've experienced it first hand. While traveling about 75mph on the fwy, a sedan came to almost a complete stop right in front of me. I was so surprised that I lost precious seconds to slow down. The only way to avoid rear ending this car was to swerve into the fast lane. I changed lanes, the VSC kicked in, and saved me from possibly losing control of the vehicle. It was very subtle and needless to say, I was impressed.

I've done a good amount of "threshold" and "pursuit" driving training. I should not have been able to control the vehicle at that speed and would not have corrected the swerve without additional actions if the VSC was not equipped.

If you do decide to get the UZJ100, then consider a 2000 or later model instead of the 98-99. You can always add an ARB locker later on.

As far as room goes, they have a bunch of useable space, especially when you remove the rear jump seats.

Also remember, the LX470 is the Lexus version but has a few more fancy features.

 

[datrupr]

Bill, As far as the Trooper is concerned, the only squeeks and rattles I have ar from the rear doors, and that is only really audible on rough roads. If it is the Cd Changer that is causing the rattling then consider that a good thing, the factory in dash Cd changers are known for crapping out and trapping your CD's. I just experienced this with mine, and now where the CD changer was is my new CB radio, with a factory look fit. I have the same storage compartment that Roy mentioned under the rear seats, and I have a few tools, batteries, and what not in there and I can't hear any noise from that either on everyday streets. There is probably something the owner has in either the center console, ashtry, or somewhere else that is causing the rattle. Or, there may have been some work done around the dash area and it was not put back together properly. I do not have the sun roof on my Trooper, I wish I did though, those things are huge and very cool. I wonder now if that could be the cause of the rattle? I don't know, 107K on mine and still leak and rattle free for the most part. You may want to check out a couple of them and see if you are hearing the same rattle. I have not experienced it though. And, IMO still a great purchase, leaving you with extrra $$ for mods and Toyota like quality. I personally like the high up seating position on my Trooper, but it take me a bit to find the right settings between the seats and mirrors, but when I did I find very few drawbacks to the truck. Do get blind sopot mirrors though, that was the first "mod" I did on my Trooper. Good luck with your search. Here is a pic of my new center stack, with out the CD changer.

 

[kcowyo]

On the down side of it all, I remembered that a sunroof is high on the priority list. I ran the Alpine Loop in the Colorado San Juans last year for the first time with the sun roof removed in the Pathfinder and it was a completely different experience than previous trips. That was what led me to want a Jeep and begin the search for a new vehicle. Sometimes the best view is straight up. I'm not sure where this leaves me. Somewhere in the course of measurebating and carefully considering and pricing each potential vehicle, I forgot that the journey is the destination and, aside from getting home safely, enjoying the beauty of the scenery is the most important part of the trip for me. I'm not quite sure where this all leaves me, but I need to re-asses my priorities.
-Bill

I haven't chimed in because I'm one who will agonize and over analyze every purchase. There never seems to be a clear answer when you're predicting the usefulness and reliability of a large purchase. But I will back you up on the perks of having a 4x4 with a removable top. It's one reason I'm not all keyed up on the new FJ Cruiser.

I lived in Lake City for several years and spent a lot of time on the Loop Road. I thought you brought up an excellent point about how much more scenic the road is without a top. At the time I had an '84 CJ-7, and the runs I made without the top on, were always more enjoyable. Indeed, the view straight up sometimes is best. At the beginning and end of the summer season when I would run with the top on, it seemed I made quicker time but noticed less of the scenery, smells, etc. When my Jeep met its demise near Hurricane Pass, I opted not to replace it as having a convertible 4WD in Colorado (and now Wyoming) is only practical from mid-June through August.

However, I don't believe that the benefits of having an open air 4x4, when traversing mind boggling scenic trails can be overstated. It just puts you that much closer to your surroundings and immerses you in the moment.

 

[bigreen505]

Thanks to Aaron and Roy, those were very thoughtful posts.

The rattles were coming from two places, the ambulance doors were one, but the worst was in the dash -- centrally and near the firewall I'm guessing. Whenever the rpm whas high, particularly after a downshift, the rattle/resonation was almost too loud to talk over.

I feel bad that this post has gone on so long, but hopefully there is enough info here to almost make an FAQ for newbies in a similar situation -- either looking for a new vehicle or looking to replace an existing one.

-Bill

 

[jeffryscott]

So Big Green,

Any decisions on vehicles?

Just curious,

Jeff

 

[upcruiser]

Hey big green, you say your family is into ski racing, nice! I work in the business myself. Good luck with the vehicle hunting, looks like you are heading in the right direction. I'll be curious to see what you end up with. FYI, I use my FJ80 for alot of the same things that it sounds like you use your rigs for. I know how much the interior space thing matters. I've loved the 80. I've done 2 month trips in it with my bikes inside, a bed to sleep on, my kayak, and everything I need for a home away from home. When you pick wisely and set them up right, it definately pays off huge. Have fun and keep us posted!

 

[bigreen505]

Thanks guys, unfortunately funds had to be diverted elsewhere for the time being due to an unexpected situation, hopefully I should be back on track by the spring or early summer. In any case, for now I'll be sticking with the Pathfinder.

Lot's of options, we'll see what wins out. As Bajataco rightly pointed out it is a battle of compromises and I'm not sure what I'm willing to give up. I have received a couple recommendations for a long-bed 4-door Taco and just deal with the limitations of the long wheelbase.

Upcruiser, I definitely know what you mean about space. Your post may have been the best endorsement for an FJ80 I've received. A couple years ago I had the (dis)pleasure of loading a whole hill worth of B-net into the back of Crawford's Suburban after a Noram at Loveland. That was really an eye-opener. If I could fit one 20M roll into the Pathfinder I would be floored.

 

[calamaridog]

bigG,

Stuff comes up and the good thing is that the trucks will still be there when all is said and done. The free advice isn't going anywhere either:xxrotflma