&*!#@* Hunters!

[canucksafari]

I quickly scanned this thread but see it has sure changed subject since the beginning. Personally, I don't see the problems as a hunter issue (or a gun issue). Well, maybe you would be less willing to confront a bunch of drunk yahoos with guns (I wouldn't give them the respect of calling them hunters). Really it is an issue/sympthom of a disposalble society which does not repect people or the environment (private or government). We have the same problem here in certain areas where the younger crowd likes to go and have a blow out in their 4Bs. Problem is that there is a smaller segment of this group that are a bunch of no minds who probably never had to clean up after themselves. They give all wheelers a bad rap because they leave their mark (trash, damaged property, etc.). The good wheelers and the good hunters rarely are recognized, unless they form a group to clean up the other mess and are featured on the news. Bottom line, its not the gun or truck but the person. The more society accepts that type of behaviour in other areas of life the more you will see it in your back yard.

 

[Christophe Noel]

I don't have anything against hunting in general. I can't do it. I shot a deer when I was 17 and I've felt guilty ever since....poor little fella. Many were raised hunting and I can appreciate their enjoyment of it as a sport and a means of putting chops on the table.

There is something disturbing about some hunters. I can't put my finger on it. When I lived in Alaska I met a guy who just beemed with joy when he told me he shot the bear my wife and I spent a few years watching in our nearby meadow. That bear was like a member of our community. We called him Vern. Dead at the amusement of a hunter. What ever. No judgement, just a sad event. It's not like he poached Vern. Someone okay'd Vern's death sentence.

Another guy I know here in Prescott is extremely "well to do." He and his family often take high zoot hunting trips to Africa where he gets to enjoy shooting as many baboons as he can shoot. His accounts of shooting the males defending the females and young are nothing short of horrific. For him it's the killing that gets his jib hoisted. I knew a kid in school that liked to kick dogs for sport.

Hunting is a weird one. You can't distill it down to the act itself as all hunters pull the trigger for different reasons. My buddies in Scotland hunt as a part of the ceremony of it all, and as far as I know haven't shot anything but a hill side in 10 years.

Anyway....those are my unsolicited two cents.

 

[Scott Brady]

Everyone has different experiences and feeling about it. Some are built to be warriors, killers, whatever (and they usually end up fighting the wars), others want nothing to do with killing. For me, if I had a big bull elk in my scope, I would not pull the trigger. A small cow, which would provide a healthy abundance of game meat, I would. I am not a trophy hunter.

I do love wingshooting though, and absolute joy for me personally, the whole experience of canvas, dogs, fine shotguns owned by my grandfather, etc. accessing a remote field with my overland machine and spending time with friends. The perfect reflection of what I am about.

My uncle Dave once told me:

"When I was a young man, I killed anything that moved. When I was a little older and more successful, I wanted to kill the biggest thing that moved. Now that I am older, I don't want to kill anything at all"

I don't think it would be fair for a non-hunter to judge a conservationist hunter. Hunting is something that is buried deep into some peoples DNA, it is their nature. Nearly everyone eats meat, some just actually do the killing. Killing of food is just part of the human puzzle, being an omnivore.

 

[big sky trapper]

Everyone has different experiences and feeling about it. Some are built to be warriors, killers, whatever (and they usually end up fighting the wars), others want nothing to do with killing.


I don't think it would be fair for a non-hunter to judge a conservationist hunter. Hunting is something that is buried deep into some peoples DNA, it is their nature. Nearly everyone eats meat, some just actually do the killing. Killing of food is just part of the human puzzle, being an omnivore.

One of the best from this thread ...well said

BST

 

[mmtoy]

I've never been a "hunter." I played at it when I was young, hunting jackrabbits and aluminum cans with small rifles. While I was a rather unsuccessful hunter, I did grow up slaughtering cows, pigs, chickens, etc. for food. Not for sale, just for the family (mmm... hand salted, home smoked beef...). At some age, I just didn't want to do it any more (hunting or slaughtering). I still eat meat, but I have no interest in being at the first-stage butcher block again.

That out of the way (it seems there's a little bit of a need to explain one's "side" in this discussion, which is too bad...):

I believe the first post has little to do with hunters. It has to do with inconsiderate people who believe they deserve to go wherever they want and do whatever they want, and to hell with the rest of the world. These people are pervasive and end up in every activity I've been involved in (camping, climbing, biking, whatever). Because these particular ones carry a gun and a have this belief, confrontation (whether it's done calmly or not) is dangerous.

How to deal with them is the question, and I don't think it's been well answered here. Perhaps because the question is lost in the pro- and anti-hunter discussion...

 

[Photog]

I've never been a "hunter." I played at it when I was young, hunting jackrabbits and aluminum cans with small rifles. While I was a rather unsuccessful hunter, I did grow up slaughtering cows, pigs, chickens, etc. for food. Not for sale, just for the family (mmm... hand salted, home smoked beef...). At some age, I just didn't want to do it any more (hunting or slaughtering). I still eat meat, but I have no interest in being at the first-stage butcher block again.

That out of the way (it seems there's a little bit of a need to explain one's "side" in this discussion, which is too bad...):

I believe the first post has little to do with hunters. It has to do with inconsiderate people who believe they deserve to go wherever they want and do whatever they want, and to hell with the rest of the world. These people are pervasive and end up in every activity I've been involved in (camping, climbing, biking, whatever). Because these particular ones carry a gun and a have this belief, confrontation (whether it's done calmly or not) is dangerous.

How to deal with them is the question, and I don't think it's been well answered here. Perhaps because the question is lost in the pro- and anti-hunter discussion...

Excellent point. Too much off-topic discussion on peripheral topics.

THere have been a few posts on the topic, and a few suggested solutions; but they are tough to find now. It does come down to the lack of respect, and how to deal with it.

How would any of you deal with it, outside of hunting season? Trespassing, ATV activity, littering, etc...?

 

[Streakerfreak]

Excellent point. Too much off-topic discussion on peripheral topics.

THere have been a few posts on the topic, and a few suggested solutions; but they are tough to find now. It does come down to the lack of respect, and how to deal with it.

How would any of you deal with it, outside of hunting season? Trespassing, ATV activity, littering, etc...?

Unfortunately, there is not much you can do with the jerks of the world. There are just too many of them. We just need to keep on moving ahead. Post signs, group cleanups, notify authorities, education, etc. Even if they do not work, that is about all you can do aside from vigilante justice. This leads to other problems. People like this make what would be wonderful clubs like the Sierra club into something that actually does harm. For every reaction there is an equal and opposite reaction. In this case, it is one group taking an extreme counteractive response to the other destructive extreme. Educate as much as you can, but there are too many people who think they are god on earth and they can do whatever the hell they want. I always felt it is just a big man thing. People who feel inadequate in some part of there life so they act in such a way to make themselves look like a macho man. When in reality they are just idiots:REOutShootinghunter . If that makes any sense to anyone.

 

[Clutch]

Excellent point. Too much off-topic discussion on peripheral topics.

THere have been a few posts on the topic, and a few suggested solutions; but they are tough to find now. It does come down to the lack of respect, and how to deal with it.

How would any of you deal with it, outside of hunting season? Trespassing, ATV activity, littering, etc...?

Besides putting up a huge fence, I don't see how you get around it.

The guy on the ATV, probably doesn't see any harm done. Everything is so checker board out here, unless there is a sign it is hard to tell, what land belongs to whom. I have many routes I like to ride on, even if there is a sign you might miss it. Usually the private is stated clearly, I try to give much respect as I can, ride slow, make little dust and noise.


Then there is education, the dealers don't want to do it, it may scare off their customers. I know there were some dealers here in AZ who hired a lobbyist to fight against the Copper Sticker Program, because of fear of loosing money. The Copper Sticker was going to be a good thing, all of the Arizona dirt bike clubs were for it. What do you do when the people (the dealers) who are supposed to on your side, aren't really?

So what do you do? You can try talking to the guys individually, but that usually doesn't go too well...trust me I have tried. People just don't care, they think they have the right, and nothing short of shooting back is going to stop it. Might be able to get through to a few. As a whole, I think it is futile. You can keep telling yourself "If only everybody did so and so..."...or you can tell yourself not sweat the small things.

I have people who love to use my driveway as a turn around, it really drove me nuts, I almost put up a fence or a chain to keep them from doin it. Which would be an expense and a hassel every time I wanted to come and go...so I try not to sweat it.

Just because these guys use ATV's doesn't make them *******s or idiots, sounds to me there are judgements being made. Until you actually sit down and talk with them, how do you know what type of person they are? Just because they don't hunt like a purist, doesn't mean they are in the wrong. Maybe the guy has a heart condition and can't walk like he used to, you never know. My dad liked to hunt, he used to be a damn good bow hunter. But, sometimes life gives you a raw deal, he came down with MS, before he got real bad, he hunted from an ATV, I would go with him, and help him with the carcus, needed a winch to hoist it up in the bed of the ATV. We didn't hunt for sport, we were "purist" used every part of the animal. Just used an ATV to make life a little easier.

As for me, hunting bores the hell out of me. Just so you know...


We had one of these...great for hauling a dead deer.

 

[Scenic WonderRunner]

I have a lot of relatives in Minn. So sometimes I check the local news.

Tonight I ran across this story of a hunters bullet going into a home and into a girls pillow in her bedroom!

http://www.kare11.com/video/player.aspx?aid=58268&sid=270374&bw=hi&cat=2 <~turn on your volume


I don't know how long this link to the video will work....but here ya go.


.

 

[fjcruzn]

Very interesting thread! Unfortunately, those of us who prescribe to "tread lightly" and other environmentally sound policies and practices are the minority... Yes, I support our collective efforts to "educate" folks, but...

Before I retired I was a NPS Ranger. The political pressure on land management agencies by lobbyist groups, manufactures and large organizations to allow expanded/unrestricted use of public lands is enormous.

This goes hand in hand with the hunters who make "sound shots" at noise in the brush or tresspass on private property. We live in interesting times where respect for others is overshadowed by the "me first" mentality.

cheers,

dale