Ideas For Freezing Water Line

[JSKepler]

I've got a 2017 Lance 825. It's been working great and I've been using it in freezing temperatures. However, when it gets into the low 20's and below, which happened quite late this year, I have a water line that freezes in the 'basement.' It affects the toilet and the shower. This is a known issue with this camper. This is also my first camper, I'm handy and I'm researching the problem but, I have no real experience in this area. Incidentally, the OEM propane heating system keeps the interior warm enough so that I get no freezing in the water tank and water pump or lines under the sink. Can't say I know for sure about the black and gray tanks but I've not heard that this is a problem. The water in the toilet does not freeze and the water in the shower line isn't freezing. It is the supply line before it gets to the shower.

What kind of things should I look in to? I've come across heat tapes, improving the flow of warm air from the heater, and adding insulation.

I have insulated the little access door though the insulation inside the compartment isn't very good so it won't have helped much.

I've run across heat tape but there are an abundance of tapes for both 12V and 120V use. I'd like one that runs off my 12V when I'm boondocking - which is about all I do, and runs off 120V when I'm parked at my house or the occasional spot with hookups or if I get a generator some day. This would mean that it always runs off of 12V. Any advice in this area would be helpful including respected brands, 12V vs 120V, and attaching the tape to the pipe are welcome.

Ultimately I think that the best solution would be getting both more warm air to the basement and improving the insulation. I know all campers are different but I get ideas from things that experienced folks have performed on similar or even very different platforms.

Thanks for much for considering my issue. I've seen a lot of great comments and advice on this site.

 

[Pacific Northwest yetti]

Do you have easy access to the lines? You may be able to just slide pipe insulation over them. Possibly the hot and cold in the same "pool noodle".

 

[simple]

I like the pipe insulation idea because it's "simple".
If that doesn't work, maybe a duct with really small fan might push enough heat into the area.

 

[86scotty]

Do you have access to AC power when this is happening? I added one of these coming off my water tank on my RV and it solved my problem.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DGQTMSRP?ref_=ppx_hzsearch_conn_dt_b_fed_asin_title_2&th=1

 

[Pacific Northwest yetti]

I like the pipe insulation idea because it's "simple".
If that doesn't work, maybe a duct with really small fan might push enough heat into the area.

Sounds like a solid plan, let us know what you do, and if it works.

 

[JSKepler]

@Pacific Northwest yetti , I don't have great access. I can get to them and see them but they are in a small compartment with a tiny access door. I have small hands and have squeezed them into all kinds of tiny machines in the past so I know I can improve this!

@simple I like simple. One of my dad's favorite mottos was KISS - keep it simple stupid.

@86scotty depends on where it is parked. Sometimes in front of the house so, yes, 120V available. But I'm more interested in the boondocking scenario.

Right now I think I'm going to improve my access to the compartment and replace the current joke-insulation with some styrofoam sheet material I got out of a packing crate for a desk I bought last week. Once I've done that I'm going to run a 12V wire to the compartment and hook up a simple 12V incandescent light bulb, maybe 3W. That's only a quarter amp. With improved insulation and a small space that might be enough to keep it above freezing. If it isn't I may have to go with a higher wattage or maybe go with a simple resistor that will put all of the current into heat. The setting might be simple enough to do some thermal calculations and actually design the system instead of just guessing.

If I can get that to work I'll look for a thermostatic switch. Maybe have it come on at 40 degrees and go off at 45 degrees. I had an unheated shed once and just put a 40W lightbulb under the sink with an anti-freeze switch. It had about 50X the volume of this tiny space so with some insulation a light bulb may very well do the trick!

 

[GR8ADV]

With stagnant water in a pipe over a period of time insulation is not much help as it will only slow the process of freezing. It will eventually all be the same temperature. And of course, it will slow the process of thawing when it does warm up.

You need to get a small amount of heat in there. With heat tape, wire, parallel hot water line, running your water slowly through the line , air etc.

 

[simple]

Sounds like you've a strategy worked out.

I'm not sure of the area in question but on boats when there is an area that is hard to get to, it's common to cut an access hole and install a hatch cover. Hatch covers come in all shapes and sizes.

 

[ponderosa1]

Long time ago I had a camper with plumbing and full scale water system, had the same kind of issue, I just run heat cable as I realized water systems need to go and no interest in permanent solution, glad I got rid of water systems except basic sink, they don't play well with boondocking, which I do full time, and only extra headache. If you heat that small area I'd use high temp rated non-flammable insulation, which would be fiberglass, and may be even put extra smoke detector in there if there is space.