Information on retrofitting H.I.D. headlamps

Antichrist

Expedition Leader
In 2003 the NHTSA published a notice of draft interpretation for FMVSS 108 which addresses vehicle lighting. That stated (or at least was interpreted) that fitting HID headlights to any vehicle that didn't come from the factory with HID's was illegal.

SEMA pushed for a reinterpretation and in Nov 2005 issued this press release:
http://elitecm.net/forums/index.php?topic=155.0 (Sorry, I can't find it on SEMA's web site)
The actual NHTSA reinterpretation is here:
http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2005/pdf/05-21725.pdf

Unfortunately, I suppose because of "government speak" combined with wishful thinking on the part of some folks, some people, including HID kit sellers, are taking the 2005 reinterpretation as meaning you can buy HID kits and stick them in your halogen housings. A search of car forums will show a lot of people making that claim. However, a careful reading of the above pdf shows this isn't true, despite people's claims otherwise.
But I decided to go to the source anyway, to make sure.

I contacted the local NHTSA office and it took some time, but yesterday I received a call from an attorney in the DC office who works for Steven P. Wood, chief counsel for the NHTSA, the person who wrote the above document.

What he told me was that I was correct, that you cannot buy an HID kit and install it in your existing halogen housing. Howver, if you can find an off-the-shelf DOT compliant HID assembly that you can replace your entire housing with, then you're fine.

As an example, for a Land Rover Discovery 1 you would have to buy HID units that are a direct replacement for STC1237 and STC1238.
D1_headlamp.jpg


Anything else is illegal in all 50 states.

I asked them if they would consider publishing a simplified human speak version and he said he'd pass the request on to his boss.

He also mentioned that they are getting a lot of calls from law enforcement asking for the same clarification, so even if you don't care that all retrofit kits are illegal, don't assume you won't get stopped by the police for it.
 

The BN Guy

Expedition Leader
Wow...that's enlightening. Still going to keep the HID's in my car...truck doesn't have them, though.
 

Hilldweller

SE Expedition Society
I've been trying to tell people this for years; my words fell on deaf ears most of the time.

For Jeeps and Rovers with 7" round headlights, the Valeo/Slyvania XE7 bi-xenon HID works well, is legal, and is terminated with an H4 plug.

The other Sylvania HID product is a piece of hastily cobbled junk; avoid it.

Also of note is the excellent JW Speaker #8700 LED headlight that I've tested and evaluated elsewhere in this forum; they also make the #8900 5x7 and #8800 4x6.

IMHO LED is superior and will become the headlight standard in the civilized world...

But that's just me talkin'. The guy with 3 sets of LEDs up front... :)

TruckLiteDrivingLites010.jpg


Of further note, the very very popular IPF replacement light with the dubious "E" in a circle is not legal on this continent, in Europe, or in most of the world either. It is an offroad only light, has miserable photometry, and really has no place in our community.

The complete law about this can be found HERE.
 

4xdog

Explorer
Useful post, Antichrist. Thanks!

I have the ACA HID headlamp conversion kit for my 2001 Tacoma, which is a DOT compliant system (as I understand it). They're not self leveling, which dates them technologically, but otherwise are designed around the HIDs, not a simple retrofit. Just shoving an HID capsule in a standard housing sounds like an awful approach. Certainly awful for those approaching the vehicle in the oncoming lane!

I haven't installed the ACAs in my Tacoma yet, and I'm not sure I'm going to... Not for lack of love for well-done HIDs, though. I had them on a BMW X5, and have them on my Lexus RX350, and they're superb. 'Course, the Hella 200mm H4 / 500 Fog H3 setup on my 1988 Cherokee are also excellent. The Taco's stock lights are awful, FWIW.
 
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Hilldweller

SE Expedition Society
Yeah, people hear what they want to hear.
I'm glad you stuck to your guns, Tom. Last time we exchanged news you seemed almost worn out by it.
Good job.

You should post the same thing on Candlepower.
Scheinwerfermann will give you some kudos.
 

Antichrist

Expedition Leader
I'm glad you stuck to your guns, Tom. Last time we exchanged news you seemed almost worn out by it.
Good job.
It does get old LOL But more I was tired of people insisting it was legal because some vendor said it is.

You should post the same thing on Candlepower.
Scheinwerfermann will give you some kudos.
I'm not a member there. Feel free to copy and paste if you want. Just do it in its entirety if you do.
 

craig333

Expedition Leader
I highly doubt you'd get pulled over "for" that. However if you're pulled over for something else it could become an issue. Heck, around here the rice rockets run pink, blue orange even green headlights and I've yet to see one pulled over.

Its such a shame the vehicle manufacturers can't just give us decent headlights to start with then no one would be tempted with illegal/dangerous "upgrades".
 

Hilldweller

SE Expedition Society
I highly doubt you'd get pulled over "for" that. However if you're pulled over for something else it could become an issue. Heck, around here the rice rockets run pink, blue orange even green headlights and I've yet to see one pulled over.

Its such a shame the vehicle manufacturers can't just give us decent headlights to start with then no one would be tempted with illegal/dangerous "upgrades".
There are certainly jurisdictions right now that will pull you over "for" that. VA and MD are becoming notorious for it in some areas.
There are very stiff fines if they choose to pursue it all the way too.
And consider the liability issue as well, both for the operator and the vendor ---- say, if you blinded another driver and they crashed as a result. The motorist tells the investigator that they were blinded, the illegal HID kit is found in your vehicle, you go to jail, your vendor get sued...

Bad headlights are weapons.
 

ytmonty

Observer
The powers that be should really sticky this topic. I work for a lite company and get to test all sorts of "new and improved" lights( love my job)Hmmm where to start... READ Daniel sterns articles!!!!!!! Any Dot approved headlite will have markings on it regarding which bulb is approved. ie; ...h4... it does not say...h4hid...!Stock housing are NOT designed for Hid bulbs. Yes the lite output is phenomenal, but HUGE glare. It seems the BEST way to utilize hid's excellent output is through projectors. Even the new led's are using this technology save trucklites glare monster led headlights.(shameless plug here) check out STARRHID. You'll find they have everything. Hid, led,stock style. if you have questions P.M me on here or use my email( not sure if I'm allowed to do this)ytzuzu@hotmail.com.
 
I'm not concerned with the law as much as I am about what works (both in terms of effective light, and not blinding other drivers). I've seen a number of HID conversions that work well. Good lighting, and no glare. I recently had my first experience with a really bad HID conversion in a truck. He was blinding me from behind! I had to move all my mirrors it was so bad.
 

PNWDad

Dad in the streets, Daddy in the sheets
I swapped in Acura TSX HID projectors into my 93 Dodge 6x4" headlights 3 or 4 years ago now. Retrospectively, I should of used BMW E46 or Porsche Projectors for the high/low ability, but at the time I had 2 100w spots and 2 50w HID spots on the front bumper for high beams.

I will never own a vehicle without HID headlights again. I have been converted! On my old Willys, I tried all diffrent kinds of lights, but never was satisfied even after the 100w bulbs. Then on the search for the best lights, I found HID projectors. With only 35 watt draw, no filliment to burn, their long life, and amazing lumen output per watt I was sold.

The ONLY drawback I have ever had with my lights is they dont heat up enough. The heavy, thick PNW snow builds up on the headlights while driving, and usually the heat from the halogen headlight bulbs will melt the snow and allow it to slide off. With the HIDs they dont produce enough heat to melt the snow and allow it to slide off. When I make the drive between sub-32 degree snow to 32 degree snow zones, I have to pull over and wipe off my headlights ever few miles sometimes. I have tried all kinds of Rain-X type products, and the only solution I can see at this time are the headlight wipers off old Volvos that use square headlights :ylsmoke:. Someday Ill have time to swap them in.

I also have LED lights for my ATV headlights(VisionX Solos), and soon on my truck for aux lights(VisionX bar), and I do see them as the future of lighting. HIDs are great for distance and punch, LEDs are great for low amp draw and shallow beams. I reccomend trying both, and then buying both:sombrero:

Pictures buried at www.flikr.com/liftedlimo. Ill post some more on here later this week when I get home and have fast internet again:snorkel:

4998503980_c63f6c58a0_b.jpg


Stolen beam pictures:
_TAP2481-Version2.jpg
 
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Caoboy

Adventurer
Are you sure about the 'whole housing' argument? HIDplanet forums had it going around that as long as you are taking the actual reflector/projector that met DOT specs and retrofitted into your housing, you were good to go.
 

Buffalo

New member
Hey guys I'm new here and I think this maybe my first post!

Any way as for as lighting is concerned (from a law enforcement point of view) if the bulb doesn't match the what's stamped on the front of the housing it isn't going to fly.

For example my truck uses a H13 bulbs that means only H(alogen)13 bulbs can be used. Just because a HID fits in there, doesn't mean it should be there.

Also vehicle regs are pretty much standardized across Canada, US and Mexico due to the fact we have open borders between the three. The only time a state/province is different is when they have decided to get tougher than the standard.
 

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