JK Wrangler 3.8l vs 3.6l Pentastar

JIMBO

Expedition Leader
:sombrero: You have a 2009/w 22k miles and the life time warranty !

Paid for comfy/good driver-the only thing better about the 2012/2015 jeeps is the 5 spd auto/gearing--the 3.6/3.8 are so close in NORMAL driving, except for that tranny--

If you regear/aux cooler and minor mods to your liking, your jeep Rubi will still be unbeatable--except in a drag/w a new one, if that's what you want !

Mine is very responsive/peppy/unstoppable and gets 17.2mpg at 70mph-

I have do desire for a NEW Pentastar, no argument that they are better and more responsive if your pre-2012 is stock, but you have to decide if the costs are worth the difference !

Good luck

:costumed-smiley-007:wings: JIMBO
 

en480c4

Observer
I sold my 2012 JKU Sport last year and earlier this year bought a 2011 JK Rubicon with only 6k miles. For my driving, which is mostly a 6 mile commute, the 3.8 is fine, and if I'm honest, I prefer it around town. While it definitely pales in comparison on the highway, it feels torquey and more responsive off the line, but with no top-end power... Basically much more like the straight six of old. That said, both were manual transmissions. Having driven autos with both motors, the new combo is much better. And for the record, I hated the I6 with an auto, too.
 
ive had both.

3.6 is amazing. manual is even better. the new transmission in auto is an improvement over the old one but you couldnt give me any auto in a jeep.
 

MtnBubba

Observer
gallery_2_46_206669.jpg


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Is this chart for highway acceleration/performance, or fuel efficiency, or both?

Or with improvement in one is the other sacrificed?

My 2009 JKU Rubicon Auto has 4.10 gears to the best of my knowledge. So it seems that a re-rearing is required just to get on the chart. I'm running 31.5" tires and would like to go larger.

Would you say that with gearing to put each engine at the same point on the chart, either engine should yield the same performance, experience?
 
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ignore those charts. they are asinine. grimmjeeper.com/gears is the way to go. those charts are to get you to a factory reduction ratio which isnt always best. and its dependent on transmission and added weight
 

JIMBO

Expedition Leader
:sombrero: The charts give you a physical gear ratio analyzed to approximate driver satisfaction based on GENERAL drivers impression-

The numerical values are based on physical/mechanical specs that are not influenced by people !

However as ACCURATE as the ratios are--they are only a STARTING POINT and must be judged by the individuals driving habits/wants/hobbies/towing--etc-

The actual tach reading numbers are accurate, remember to differentiate between the manual/auto !

Just another graph and MOST new jeep drivers want the impression from other drivers with the same jeep !

Whatever

:costumed-smiley-007:wings: JIMBO
 

MTSN

Explorer
I've seen this question/debate come up many times in the past, and until 6 months ago I couldn't chime in with a fully educated opinion. Now that I've lived with my 2012 JKUR for 6+ months and have spent considerable time with a 2011, I can speak from an experienced position. There is a VAST, immense difference between the two, and I would never suggest keeping the old motor in favor of the two as long as $$ isn't your limiting factor. It sounds like you're in a position where the money isn't the constraint, and you probably have great resale on your 3.8 so sell it and upgrade for probably not a huge load of cash.

I think where a lot of people are coming from when they say the 3.8 "isn't that bad" are because (1) that's what they own already and don't want to or can't afford to upgrade to the newer one or (2) are on smaller or factory size tires which makes the difference not as exaggerated or (3) they live in a flat area without super steep and long mountains to drive up and down regularly.

I live in Colorado, so weekend drives are almost always up and down steep mountain passes. The 2011 I've driven has a 2" spacer lift with 285/70/17 Duratracs and is stock otherwise, and mine has a 3.5" lift with 315/70/17 Duratracs. The 2011 is CONSTANTLY shifting and looking for power and is tiring to drive. The 2012 kicks down to 4th pretty regularly and on the really steep hills down to 3rd, but it feels like it does so willingly and has plenty of power generally. It is also much much less work to drive, and gets substantially better mpg. The 2011 usually gets around 14 mpg city and up to 17 mpg highway, however I never get below 15 mpg in the city regardless of how I drive the 2012 and the highway mpg ranges from 19 to 23 mpg. Yes I said 23 mpg. With 35s. In the mountains. I'm shocked that no one has debated that point with me in a couple of other threads where I've posted it, but one trip with the windows up, AC on, cruise set at 59mph from Buena Vista to Denver (pretty significant elevation) I was able to get over 23 fully loaded coming back from camping.

It's your money to decide what you want to do with, but I would imagine that the 3.8s will depreciate a bit more once the diesel is offered in the JK and with the new redesign in a year. I doubt the 3.6 will take as big a hit because it's already a modern powertrain and performs very, very well. Also the interior on the older JKs looked dated when they were new, but they are looking far older now compared with the 2011+ interiors. The NVH has been decreased with the newer interiors, and it's a very functional comfortable vehicle considering what it is. My vote is to sell yours while you can get the best return on it, upgrade to a much more modern and efficient platform and start modifying it to suit your needs. What's going to be easier to sell in 5 years? A 5 year old JK or an 11 year old JK??
 

MtnBubba

Observer
MTSN,
That's exactly the kind of comparison I'm looking for. Both objective and subjective. I still love the 2009, but trying to look 5 yrs down the road when it's 2 models behind and 11 yrs old when I could be in a 3.6l for a not much more.

I've had a manual transmission in a Mustang and Chevy Blazer. They are fun to drive. I don't plan on rock crawling, but do plan on fire roads and some jeep trails in the mountains and out in the foothills. Is there an advantage of a manual over an automatic transmission once you get past the personal preference/driving style part, from a capability and performance standpoint?
 
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MTSN

Explorer
MTSN,
That's exactly the kind of comparison I'm looking for. Both objective and subjective. I still love the 2009, but trying to look 5 yrs down the road when it's 2 models behind and 11 yrs old when I could be in a 3.6l for a not much more.

I've had a manual transmission in a Mustang and Chevy Blazer. They are fun to drive. I don't plan on rock crawling, but do plan on fire roads and some jeep trails in the mountains and out in the foothills. Is there an advantage of a manual over an automatic transition once you get past the personal preference/driving style part, from a capability and performance standpoint?

Glad I could help. To be honest I would look for someone with direct experience with the manual transmissions to chime in, but from what I can tell from feedback I've read the manual transmissions are more flexible gearing wise because they have a wider spread than the auto. I personally love the automatic for offroading (I prefer very slow rocky trails where a manual gets exhausting), but I think the manual would be a lot of fun in day to day driving and non-rock crawling off road. It seems that the automatics hold their value a bit better because not everyone can or wants to drive a stick, so that's a consideration as well. I try to consider the residual value of my vehicles as much as possible when I'm ready to move on, so choosing the right options, right mods and right vehicle from the get go really helps to that end.
 

JIMBO

Expedition Leader
:sombrero: You didn't help !

You modified your 2011---what diff.regearing did you do ??

To many "EXPERTS" modify there 07/11 and don't regear, then complain about the lack of power/shifting/bogging and lousy mileage--

As I've said/w auto--3.8l/gearing/aux cooling--A WIN !

:costumed-smiley-007:wings: JIMBO
 

MtnBubba

Observer
Jimbo,
What gearing in your observation would make the 3.8l auto a win with say 31" tires, 33" tires and 35" tires?

Would you say that's a win over the 3.6l with similar regearing, or just an acceptable overall threshold regardless of engine model?
 

JIMBO

Expedition Leader
:sombrero: Pretty broad a question--


Jimbo,
What gearing in your observation would make the 3.8l auto a win with say 31" tires, 33" tires and 35" tires?

Would you say that's a win over the 3.6l with similar regearing, or just an acceptable overall threshold regardless of engine model?

No regearing to the 3.8, will "WIN" over the 3.6, because the 3.6 has the STUPENDOUS 5spd auto/w correct gearing and the 3.8 has the old"POOR" 4spd auto/w lousy gearing, but

The main criteria for regearing a jeep is the intended use--off-road only/DD/Maller-

For the 3.8/auto, the best gears for 31/32" tires is 4.56/33" tires is 4.88 and that's for DD/weekend play-

For 33"/35" the best is 5.13 gears, unless it's a Rubi--the 5.38s are the limit because of the Dana 44's

My only defense of the 3.8 vs 3.6 is the comparison that the 3.8 was a dog/bog/no power and not that the 3.6 isn't superior--it is--no doubt, but the main reason to getta new jeep should be that you WANT a new jeep, not because you have a 3.8 and it's a dog--it ain't-

You can't argue with the new technology, but lets have some valid comparisons for your purchase reason-

Some 3.8s have oil use problems, some 3.6s have head problems-

Your finances/social and off-road use have to decide -there's no advantage with the 3.6vs3.8, for JUST OFF_ROAD, but there is ON-ROAD_

:costumed-smiley-007:wings: JIMBO
 

kojackJKU

Autism Family Travellers!
I've seen this question/debate come up many times in the past, and until 6 months ago I couldn't chime in with a fully educated opinion. Now that I've lived with my 2012 JKUR for 6+ months and have spent considerable time with a 2011, I can speak from an experienced position. There is a VAST, immense difference between the two, and I would never suggest keeping the old motor in favor of the two as long as $$ isn't your limiting factor. It sounds like you're in a position where the money isn't the constraint, and you probably have great resale on your 3.8 so sell it and upgrade for probably not a huge load of cash.

I think where a lot of people are coming from when they say the 3.8 "isn't that bad" are because (1) that's what they own already and don't want to or can't afford to upgrade to the newer one or (2) are on smaller or factory size tires which makes the difference not as exaggerated or (3) they live in a flat area without super steep and long mountains to drive up and down regularly.

I live in Colorado, so weekend drives are almost always up and down steep mountain passes. The 2011 I've driven has a 2" spacer lift with 285/70/17 Duratracs and is stock otherwise, and mine has a 3.5" lift with 315/70/17 Duratracs. The 2011 is CONSTANTLY shifting and looking for power and is tiring to drive. The 2012 kicks down to 4th pretty regularly and on the really steep hills down to 3rd, but it feels like it does so willingly and has plenty of power generally. It is also much much less work to drive, and gets substantially better mpg. The 2011 usually gets around 14 mpg city and up to 17 mpg highway, however I never get below 15 mpg in the city regardless of how I drive the 2012 and the highway mpg ranges from 19 to 23 mpg. Yes I said 23 mpg. With 35s. In the mountains. I'm shocked that no one has debated that point with me in a couple of other threads where I've posted it, but one trip with the windows up, AC on, cruise set at 59mph from Buena Vista to Denver (pretty significant elevation) I was able to get over 23 fully loaded coming back from camping.

It's your money to decide what you want to do with, but I would imagine that the 3.8s will depreciate a bit more once the diesel is offered in the JK and with the new redesign in a year. I doubt the 3.6 will take as big a hit because it's already a modern powertrain and performs very, very well. Also the interior on the older JKs looked dated when they were new, but they are looking far older now compared with the 2011+ interiors. The NVH has been decreased with the newer interiors, and it's a very functional comfortable vehicle considering what it is. My vote is to sell yours while you can get the best return on it, upgrade to a much more modern and efficient platform and start modifying it to suit your needs. What's going to be easier to sell in 5 years? A 5 year old JK or an 11 year old JK??

money is not an issue for me. I just don't see a huge difference in the new and old. Maybe in passing power, but just normal driving, MEH. never saw the OMG pentajesus difference that everyone else seems to feel. gas milage is not even that different.
 

dstock

Explorer
money is not an issue for me. I just don't see a huge difference in the new and old. Maybe in passing power, but just normal driving, MEH. never saw the OMG pentajesus difference that everyone else seems to feel. gas milage is not even that different.

And those of us that have had both, and have driven both for a significant amount of time, i.e. a couple-few years of each, will say it is a OMG pentajesus difference. It's also a given that this argument will continue forever despite the fact those of us with actual experience between the two say its a huge difference. I didn't want to spend the money to trade up but I don't regret a single penny, it was more than worth it.
 

MTSN

Explorer
money is not an issue for me. I just don't see a huge difference in the new and old. Maybe in passing power, but just normal driving, MEH. never saw the OMG pentajesus difference that everyone else seems to feel. gas milage is not even that different.

Weren't you trying to buy a new JK250 AEV not too long ago? You definitely seemed stoked on the newer model then. I get it that some people will never see the perspective of others which is fine, but there is a subjective and objective difference between the two and in virtually all ways the newer one is superior to the old one. It's a lot like how Jeep guys were up in arms when their beloved inline 4.0 (I owned several Jeeps with the 4.0 and it was a decent mill) was replaced in the JK, and for years everyone is comparing the 4.0 with the 3.8. Now people are comparing the 3.8 with the 3.6 and will be comparing the 3.6 with whatever is next. If you're happy with the 3.8 that's great, but to say the 3.6 isn't much better is flat out wrong. My 3.6 with 4.10 gears, auto, and 315/70/17 Duratracs drives better than all the stock 3.8s I've ever driven and gets better mpg.
 

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