New Defender Rage/Hate Thread

[Highlander]

Victory_Overland

hortly after I passed them I had a narrow road excursion with a dude in a newer Subaru Forester with a mountain bike strapped to the roof; dude just pulled into the treelike and let me pass, gave a wave and cruised on like no biggie.

I came across something similar situation. Me and my gf were hiking close to Missouri Beaks in MT. It is a very remote area and the roads are very rough. When it rains there it turns into a quite dirt.
There we saw a couple driving a Honda Ridgeline with roof tent on the top and bikes attached. He drove places where I would only risk to go with a normal 4X4 truck/suv. The dude told me that him and her were exploring the public lands in the west and drove everywhere they wanted to go with no issues at all. Even in mud the truck did remarkably good. A day before there was huge prairie rain in the area and roads were f-ed up, but he got there with no problem at all.
He also mentioned how comfortable the ride was and how good it did on gas too. and don't forget the Ridgeline, like the Forester, does not have a low gear.

For a long time, I had always been skeptical about the unibody and independents suspension, but I guess the time is changing. The engineering is becoming better and better.

Last week I went to test drive, a Ranger, Tacoma and Ridgeline in the same day. In every measurable way the Ridgeline was the best. It has better space, better sits, better visibility, and amazing ride. Sure it looks wired.
My point is that the unibody and independents suspension are not as bad as some people want us to believe.

 

[soflorovers]

I very well could be misinformed. I’m not a LR hater, however, I absolutely love the old Defenders. Went to Tanzania last year and saw noting but old LRs on our safaris. Meet me in Moab, the last Monday in October, and we’ll drive Poison Spyder or Top of the world. Your choice. If you can drive your unmodified defender up any one if these trails, without getting stuck, I will purchase a defender in 2021. I’ll be in the market for a new 4x4 by then. I assume you may be a LR dealer.

Best call your bank now. There are tons of videos on Youtube of older LR products with air suspension (RRS, LR3, L322, etc...) driving Poison Spider and Hell's Gate. This new Defender with dual lockers, Duratracs and next-generation air suspension will easily tackle those trails.

 

[Carson G]

I should add that the local LR dealer, previously a NAPA store and now a used car lot, was Land Rover only. Jaguar was not offered in C. Springs. C. Springs population was less than 200,000. 'Motor City' and the population has grown much over the last 30/40 years. Perspective is important.

I’m pretty sure Colorado Springs hasn’t had a population less than 200,000 in over 50 years.

 

[Corgi_express]

If you can drive your unmodified defender up any one if these trails, without getting stuck, I will purchase a defender in 2021..

If you are going to make up fake bets to try to act tough on the internet, at least make them believable. You should have offered to buy a case of beer or something.

 

[CanyoneroJL]

Best call your bank now. There are tons of videos on Youtube of older LR products with air suspension (RRS, LR3, L322, etc...) driving Poison Spider and Hell's Gate. This new Defender with dual lockers, Duratracs and next-generation air suspension will easily tackle those trails.

I love the challenge. There’s a video of a Subaru doing Hells revenge. Talk is cheap. Looking at my calendar, I’m free to meet anyone in a new, stock defender at the trailhead of Poison Spider or Top of the World on October 19, 20, or 21. You lead, I’ll follow. I’ll bring a winch and PullPal just in case you get stuck, but it doesn’t sound like you’ll need them. This challenge is open to anyone, including dealerships, LR corporate, master 4wheelers who can tackle any obstacle with 31” tires on 20” rims. ?.

 

[CanyoneroJL]

If you are going to make up fake bets to try to act tough on the internet, at least make them believable. You should have offered to buy a case of beer or something.

I’ll throw in a case of beer, too. I’m pretty confident that a new, stock defender can’t drive those trails. The ledges are too high. Hells revenge and fins and things (when avoiding the obstacles) are easy enough for a four door sedan (see Subaru video above). Let’s see the defender take on Mickeys hot tub.

 

[soflorovers]

I’ll throw in a case of beer, too. I’m pretty confident that a new, stock defender can’t drive those trails. The ledges are too high. Hells revenge and fins and things (when avoiding the obstacles) are easy enough for a four door sedan (see Subaru video above). Let’s see the defender take on Mickeys hot tub.

Again, here you go.

 

[CanyoneroJL]

That’s hells revenge. A four door Subaru ran it (see video above). Despite its name, it’s one of the easiest trails in Moab, especially when you bypass the obstacles.

 

[soflorovers]

That’s hells revenge. A four door Subaru ran it (see video above). Despite its name, it’s one of the easiest trails in Moab, especially when you bypass the obstacles.

Oh, so now you're telling me Carwash isn't an obstacle? Ok then. What trail would you consider sufficient?

Edit: As you may or may not know, there's an entire "Rage/Hate thread" for the New Defender. Your opinions on this thread aren't exactly ground-breaking. These last few weeks have pretty much taught me that you and the others on that thread are just white noise. You were never going to buy a New Defender, let alone any new Land Rover product. Considering your only posts on this forum are on this thread, I think it's fair to say that you're just out here for the sake of trolling us. The new Defender is far more capable than any air sprung LR to come before it, and I've just provided you with plenty of resources above that show the capabilities of such machines. If an LR3 running the Rubicon doesn't impress you, then nothing will.

Rubicon, June 6-8 2016

167 new items added to shared album

photos.google.com

 

[CanyoneroJL]

Oh, so now you're telling me Carwash isn't an obstacle? Ok then. What trail would you consider sufficient?

October 19, 20, or 21. Meet me at the trailhead of Top of the World or Poison Spyder. Let’s leave early (9am). Friendly day of wheeling beautiful Moab. I am very curious to see how the new stock Defender fares. I promise to keep an open mind.

 

[soflorovers]

October 19, 20, or 21. Meet me at the trailhead of Top of the World or Poison Spyder. Let’s leave early (9am). Friendly day of wheeling beautiful Moab. I am very curious to see how the new stock Defender fares. I promise to keep an open mind.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt...I respectfully decline your invite as I'm on the other side of the country and crucially, don't own a New Defender. If you're ever in South Florida, feel free to reach out and I'll let you chase down my LR3 on 35's.

FWIW, here's a dealer's Demo sample running up Chinaman Gulch. In my opinion, the Proud Rhino lift rods that were installed on this particular Defender actually hampered its performance. In case you're not aware, lift rods merely trick the electronic suspension height sensors. So when "off road" height is selected, it's actually lifting itself to a mode that really should only be used for clearing extreme obstacles or where fear of high-centering is a thing; can't really blame the dealer for installing the lift rods on their brand new 80k truck to avoid trail damage. When in "extended" mode, suspension compliance and the ability to tuck a wheel is severely hampered. That said, I think it's pretty impressive that a New Defender without a rear locker performed so well. Are there things that I would do differently? Of course, but no vehicle is perfect, and this is a solid base.

 

[DieselRanger]

@Christian P. Yeah, recommend moving all of @CanyoneroJL 's posts to New Defender Rage/Hate Thread.

 

[CanyoneroJL]

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt...I respectfully decline your invite as I'm on the other side of the country and crucially, don't own a New Defender. If you're ever in South Florida, feel free to reach out and I'll let you chase down my LR3 on 35's.

FWIW, here's a dealer's Demo sample running up Chinaman Gulch. In my opinion, the Proud Rhino lift rods that were installed on this particular Defender actually hampered its performance. In case you're not aware, lift rods merely trick the electronic suspension height sensors. So when "off road" height is selected, it's actually lifting itself to a mode that really should only be used for clearing extreme obstacles or where fear of high-centering is a thing; can't really blame the dealer for installing the lift rods on their brand new 80k truck to avoid trail damage. When in "extended" mode, suspension compliance and the ability to tuck a wheel is severely hampered. That said, I think it's pretty impressive that a New Defender without a rear locker performed so well. Are there things that I would do differently? Of course, but no vehicle is perfect, and this is a solid base.

Thanks. One thing I really like about the new Defender is the towing capacity. I like the idea of towing a Black Series HQ15. My Jeep cannot tow this.

 

[CanyoneroJL]

@Christian P. Yeah, recommend moving all of @CanyoneroJL 's posts to New Defender Rage/Hate Thread.

I responded to the initial post expressing hate towards Bill Burke. I’m not a hater, just agreeing with what Bill said. If you’ve ever met Bill, you know that he loves LR, and the criticism of him isn’t fair.

 

[DieselRanger]

I’m pretty sure Colorado Springs hasn’t had a population less than 200,000 in over 50 years.

Yup. over 300K in 1980, a little over half a million today.