blackangie
Well-known member
Yeah LR AU sent to me after asking a few questions about it to a dealer.
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New Defender Rage/Hate Thread
- Thread starter DieselRanger
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blackangie
Well-known member
New new defender is a very different vehicle to the LR3/4 structure/chassis wise, im not sure why your comparing them. Defender is uses 95% different parts even from a D5.
Spec wise, as per TFLCAR vid, its on the money to go head to head with the top offroaders.
If they had seen these photos it would have won the comp, maybe they will do it again when the find out.
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blackangie
Well-known member
blackangie
Well-known member
But a modern Land Rover with lockers plus their traction control - they climb like goats.
Even the Wrangler has traction control now. Has for over a decade.
If you want the ultimate in off-road traction, more articulation than any live axle, superior ground clearance, turns and stops on a dime, can refuel even while driving, range in the thousands of miles, can maneuver through the tightest obstacles, and will get you home in a snowstorm or when passed-out drunk, then you need one of these:
View attachment 551530
And, if it dies in the mountains in the middle of winter, you can eat it and survive until spring.
100% agree re: Horse, amazing design, best 4x4, you forgot stock snorkel in the fuel pipe.
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Except when the ground is like marbles under all 4 wheels. TC hunts and fails on hill climbs. TC's weak mode is depending on at least one or two wheels having a surface that it can grab onto to continue forward momentum. Defenders with lockers walk right up as all four wheels work.
Note: The 'demo' was the LR sponsored day trip attended by all flavors of Rovers and 'technology'. Wife won the teeter-toter event with our D1. Shortest time to balance point.
The discussion also noted lockers. Can you add front and rear lockers to the new Luxury Defender with a simple 3rd member change?
LOL, now you also want a certain type of lockers to be installed in a certain way to make your argument.
There are lockers on the new Defender. Not the old-school ones you prefer, and prefer to install in a very specific fashion, but locking differentials none the less.
And, no, it won't be as easy to weld the axle shut either, like it would on your favourite imaginary rock crawler/ultimate "offroad" vehicle (i.e. a dedicated rock crawling rig).
Agreed. The LR3/4 is a unibody on full frame. You can actually lift the body off the frame. I believe the new Defender is aluminum unibody to reduce weight. Body is not removable. Likely lots of adhesive and rivets/welds.
I'm referring to Arb lockers. Easily installed. Does the new Defender have a front diff locker?
Point is TC has limitations and requires momentum. That is a old discussion.
Yes, it's an old discussion. And every time progress is made, there are always naysayers. Especially when it comes to vehicles and hobbies. Some always resort to "the old was better" despite evidence to the contrary.
It was time to update the Defender so it can once again be the best off roader LR makes. During the last couple of decades it was staying where it was, left behind by more modern approaches that works better in a wider range of scenarios.
Haha,, you actually ARE trying to use a supposed dealer event as evidence for something. Sheesh!
I wasn't talking about the dealer event or the "results" of such an event. The only one I blame is you for attempting such red herrings that no one can check.
As for rock crawling, I mention that because you constantly default to use arguments that support that notion, equating rock crawling with "Offroad", because only there do you get to claim that it is not as easy to alter to do better, but that the old one is better.
It's called "empirical data", in case you want to actually use it some day. An anecdote from a supposed dealer event just doesn't cut it.
Edit: Here is an explanation of what "empirical data" actually is:
From here.
https://study.com/academy/lesson/empirical-data-definition-example.html
Nothing in your supposed event (I am still not sure it actually happened) anecdote lives up to that.
I guess you must have missed all the "do I need HD locker" discussions over the years where it was highlighted "it depends" and spoke to the limitations of TC.
Yeah, must have. I tend to give rock crawler arguments and threads a miss if I can. Obviously, not having an open differential or a "dumb" LSD is important off road. Being able to lock your differential is important. But anything faster than slow-as-molasses rock crawling, and a welded axle is in problem. As is solid axles (more unsuspended weight in solid axles).
So, no, people upgrading their cars with aftermarket lockers or asking about it in a thread is not something I delve into.
A lot of people's builds on here is about how to have a travel vehicle, but a lot ends up with a rock crawler with their choices.
I don't have an interest in rock crawling, and to be honest, I barely consider it "off-road", as it's usually done in very specific situations, with very specific rigs, and often the vehicles used are trailered there.
It's like closed circuit racing: Utterly irrelevant to me. Offroading to me it getting things done, going from A to B and so on, and on varied terrain (and ground). Not about running a course of obstacles.
I also like how you avoided taking the "empirical data" point to heart. Especially when it showed that your (supposed) event and the anecdote from that "event" was very much not "empirical data".
So, no, people upgrading their cars with aftermarket lockers or asking about it in a thread is not something I delve into.
A lot of people's builds on here is about how to have a travel vehicle, but a lot ends up with a rock crawler with their choices.
I don't have an interest in rock crawling, and to be honest, I barely consider it "off-road", as it's usually done in very specific situations, with very specific rigs, and often the vehicles used are trailered there.
It's like closed circuit racing: Utterly irrelevant to me. Offroading to me it getting things done, going from A to B and so on, and on varied terrain (and ground). Not about running a course of obstacles.
I also like how you avoided taking the "empirical data" point to heart. Especially when it showed that your (supposed) event and the anecdote from that "event" was very much not "empirical data".