Our Kingdom Camping Trailer Build

[Treefarmer]

Really liking the cabinets and flooring. What materials are your using for these components?

The flooring is (1)puncture resistant fiberglass, (2)Azdel, (3)1/2' foam layer before aluminum frame (4)1.5" high density foam ib between aluminum frame, (5)Azdel, (6)hard fiberglass skim with screw retention, and finally (7) dog-proof industrial linoleum. There is an aluminum framework holding the floor together and adding maximum strength at joints with walls etc. Not as thick as the walls, but we do have heat vented under the floor as well.

The cabinets are a teak wood grain polyethylene. They are strong, light and hold a screw well. We have solid oak everything now. It's strong and durable, but way too heavy for our new trailer.

 

[Treefarmer]

Wow that's some thick walls.

The local dealer says folks should not live full time in thier RVs so what are you guys doing here ? maybe he doesn't know about Kingdom Camping and this bad ******** rig

That's right. No one can, should be allowed to, or should ever consider living and traveling full time in a trailer. All trailer activities should be limited to weekend off road excursions curated for You Tube and with everything on the trailer empty.

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

You forgot driving on sensitive salt flats in 8 inches of saltwater and 9 foot wide roads with 7 foot snow banks in a 8.5 foot wide trailer. I guess it makes entertaining videos but why?

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

The flooring is (1)puncture resistant fiberglass, (2)Azdel, (3)1/2' foam layer before aluminum frame (4)1.5" high density foam ib between aluminum frame, (5)Azdel, (6)hard fiberglass skim with screw retention, and finally (7) dog-proof industrial linoleum. There is an aluminum framework holding the floor together and adding maximum strength at joints with walls etc. Not as thick as the walls, but we do have heat vented under the floor as well.

The cabinets are a teak wood grain polyethylene. They are strong, light and hold a screw well. We have solid oak everything now. It's strong and durable, but way too heavy for our new trailer.

Really like how your cabinets look with flooring

 

[Treefarmer]

What is the tow vehicle ??

We have a 2012 F350 that we've put a lot of mods into. It's the 6.7L diesel and "only" has 160,000 miles on it. We really like that truck and are hoping it gives us many more years. It doesn't have the tow and payload capacities of the new one ton trucks, but it should easily dominate a 9,920lb trailer.

 

[Alloy]

The panel has tank drain switch but it looks like the tank drain is mounted off to the side. You'll need an air dryer especially if it going to be used below freezing and I hope it's not wet/muddy when it's time to get under the trailer to work on the compressor.

I'm really surprised at the location of the tanks. It's 800lbs bouncing on the front of the trailer that will deflect the frame (especially with the triangle stopping at the 1st cross member) transferring the force into the walls.

Poly Ethylene stretches. If the top is less than 3/8" it will sag and the bottom of any PE tank will belly if not supported.

 

[Treefarmer]

We agree, we hope it's not wet and muddy whenever we get under any trailer to work on it! In eleven years, we've never been forced to work underneath a trailer in the mud, and we'll try to keep the streak going. We don't tow into places that are seriously muddy. That's not our idea of fun. When we do get rained on, we just wait for things to dry up before we move again (or work underneath the trailer). Not being at the mercy of the weather is one of the many benefits of being retired. All the areas where we have tanks located have heat vented directly into them from the Truma Combi Comfort Plus (22,400 BTU/h), so that should help with cold weather. The skid plates are also insulated.

There aren't many options for tank location. Having them a little in front of the suspension is better than behind. There's not enough room directly between the trailing arms for the tanks. The tank placement will give us a little more tongue weight. We tow with an F350, so that doesn't worry us. We'll always stay well below the trailer's GVWR, no matter what.

If the tank weight (or any other weight like the 300lbs of lithium batteries we'll have on board) causes the tanks to deform or fall out and the frame to deflect and fail (along with the walls), that will be a real bummer. We're not really concerned about that at all, but if it did happen, we would be on here warning everyone about the disaster(s) that ensued and telling them not to buy a lousy trailer like we did. ?

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

The panel has tank drain switch but it looks like the tank drain is mounted off to the side. You'll need an air dryer especially if it going to be used below freezing and I hope it's not wet/muddy when it's time to get under the trailer to work on the compressor.

I'm really surprised at the location of the tanks. It's 800lbs bouncing on the front of the trailer that will deflect the frame (especially with the triangle stopping at the 1st cross member) transferring the force into the walls.

Poly Ethylene stretches. If the top is less than 3/8" it will sag and the bottom of any PE tank will belly if not supported.

I am not sure where else those tanks would go. I would assume they disperse the weight of the water being so thin. Those are some beefy members in that frame. I am no chassie engineer but it appears to me like the triangle stops at the second cross member after running through the first.

I have never seen a chassis any beefier then this so I would not worry one bit.

 

[Alloy]

I am not sure where else those tanks would go. I would assume they disperse the weight of the water being so thin. Those are some beefy members in that frame. I am no chassie engineer but it appears to me like the triangle stops at the second cross member after running through the first.

I have never seen a chassis any beefier then this so I would not worry one bit.

View attachment 766447

I was wrong and apologize for my comment about the front cross member. In saying that I've seen delamintion (below front windows) on 6yo trailers that don't go offroad. Frames are 8" (with pass through front triangles) deep and big tanks ahead of the axles.

As to the tanks a sub frame for the Cruismaster suspension it would:
- allow the tanks to go above the axles
- provide more ground clearance
- reduce or remove the wheel well notch
- allow the cross members to be located around the tanks
- reduce the penetration so the basement can be sealed, insulated and heated so there is no need for tank heaters.

 

[Treefarmer]

Good ideas. It would be interesting to see how much taller those changes would make the trailer overall. I don't know if the combination of higher off the ground and a higher roof would make it a little more top heavy and "tippy". I'm curious to see how top heavy and tippy it will feel when we extend the CM ATX suspension to its max height.

The tanks will be in an area that is sealed, insulted and heated. We added tank heaters as well. I don't know if we'll ever need them, but I view it as a "belt and suspenders" design approach.

 

[Alloy]

Good ideas. It would be interesting to see how much taller those changes would make the trailer overall. I don't know if the combination of higher off the ground and a higher roof would make it a little more top heavy and "tippy". I'm curious to see how top heavy and tippy it will feel when we extend the CM ATX suspension to its max height.

The tanks will be in an area that is sealed, insulted and heated. We added tank heaters as well. I don't know if we'll ever need them, but I view it as a "belt and suspenders" design approach.

If you watch a few of the videos of Cruisemaster you'll see it off road at max height/pressure (no suspension/articulation) to acheive maximum clearance. With a subfame the suspension is can be left in normal position for the cost of 1 additional step on the stairs. Plus you get 1 or 2 extra inches of XPS (waterproof) foam insulation under the tanks........They insulated the steel tube (sides) around the tank on yours?

In this video he'd get the best ride at 20-25psi. The last shot at 40psi too much which is shown by the number of times the cables reach the full length. FYI.....best way to adjust pressure is to use a regulator.

 

[Treefarmer]

Thanks for the video and PSI level hints. We don't know anyone who has actually lived with this suspension, so learning the best practices for using it will take a little trial and error. In our correspondence with Cruisemaster, they say the tank should be drained once a month and no more than two times a month if under heavy use. When you are stationary, they recommend that air bags always be inflated to some degree in order to avoid wear on the bags and the rubber bump stops.

The gray/fresh tanks sit within the steel frame. The sides of the steel frame where the tanks sit are not insulated. It is insulated at the bottom of the frame/tanks and on top of the frame/tanks. Then heat is vented into the area between the top/bottom insulate where the tanks are located and where there are some short plumbing runs from the tanks into the trailer. It's not a perfect insulation scenario by any means, but better than most trailers. The goal is that the vented heat and tank warmers should keep tanks and plumbing above 33 degrees in the worst weather we'll see. Taken together, the heat venting, frame insulation, and heating pads are far beyond the protection we have in our New Horizons 5th wheel, which claims to be a "four seasons" coach. We've never had a frozen tank/plumbing issue in the NH. We've been in weather as cold as 7-9 degrees overnight, and have only experienced below freezing temps in stretches of no more that about 72-94 hours straight at a time. Cold yes, but not extreme by many people's standards.

 

[Alloy]

Thanks for the video and PSI level hints. We don't know anyone who has actually lived with this suspension, so learning the best practices for using it will take a little trial and error. In our correspondence with Cruisemaster, they say the tank should be drained once a month and no more than two times a month if under heavy use. When you are stationary, they recommend that air bags always be inflated to some degree in order to avoid wear on the bags and the rubber bump stops.

The gray/fresh tanks sit within the steel frame. The sides of the steel frame where the tanks sit are not insulated. It is insulated at the bottom of the frame/tanks and on top of the frame/tanks. Then heat is vented into the area between the top/bottom insulate where the tanks are located and where there are some short plumbing runs from the tanks into the trailer. It's not a perfect insulation scenario by any means, but better than most trailers. The goal is that the vented heat and tank warmers should keep tanks and plumbing above 33 degrees in the worst weather we'll see. Taken together, the heat venting, frame insulation, and heating pads are far beyond the protection we have in our New Horizons 5th wheel, which claims to be a "four seasons" coach. We've never had a frozen tank/plumbing issue in the NH. We've been in weather as cold as 7-9 degrees overnight, and have only experienced below freezing temps in stretches of no more that about 72-94 hours straight at a time. Cold yes, but not extreme by many people's standards.

I'm thinking Criusmaster doesn't have much experience with systems below 32F. Air bags are the same as air tanks but there's no way of draining the water out of air bags. Before air dryers became inexpensive we use to drain the water out of the tanks daily and there was still water in the lines 200' away. You need an air dryer or water will freeze inside the system. Best practice is to allow the air to cool (copper tube) before it reaches the tank and dryer.

Cruisemaster is right about the bump stops but the problem with leaving air in the system is the trailer will move around when set up for camping.

Heat rises. At 5F with 15-20mph winds I've recorded (you have a way to monitor temps?) 33-34F (caught it before it was a problem) at a water line next to the steel frame inside a heated basement.

 

[Treefarmer]

I'm thinking Criusmaster doesn't have much experience with systems below 32F. Air bags are the same as air tanks but there's no way of draining the water out of air bags. Before air dryers became inexpensive we use to drain the water out of the tanks daily and there was still water in the lines 200' away. You need an air dryer or water will freeze inside the system. Best practice is to allow the air to cool (copper tube) before it reaches the tank and dryer.

Cruisemaster is right about the bump stops but the problem with leaving air in the system is the trailer will move around when set up for camping.

Heat rises. At 5F with 15-20mph winds I've recorded (you have a way to monitor temps?) 33-34F (caught it before it was a problem) at a water line next to the steel frame inside a heated basement.

You're probably right about Cruisemaster's lack of cold climate experience. That can probably be claimed for just about all caravan related products from Australia. We don't plan to spend a cold climate winter in the trailer, but we will experience below freezing temperatures. When expecting below freezing temps for any period of time, we'll need to make sure the ATX system is drained before it hits. I wish we knew of somebody with a Bruder trailer. They specifically brag about the ability of the trailer to perform in below freezing temps. They are the only Australian caravan manufacturer I know of that makes that claim and I assume it applies to their air bag suspension as well. Of course, it could just be part of their snazzy marketing.

If we were going to sit in one spot throughout an entire winter in a cold northern or high elevation spot, we would take the usual steps of skirting around the trailer, wrapping outside water hoses with electric heated sheathing, and probably placing a boat engine compartment heater under the trailer or in other critical locations. We would also be plugged into the grid.

We'll have five jacks with the capability to lift the entire trailer, so we're not worried about trailer movement when stationary. We have four jack points on our 5th wheel and it stays pretty still even in a 50 mph wind (which we just experienced a few days ago here in southwest AZ).

 

[Treefarmer]

Progress is being made and we have what is starting to look like a dual axle off road capable trailer.

Everything has gone well with the project so far except for one hiccup. The entry door was specified without a window, and, of course, showed up with a frosted glass window in it. The production and delivery of the new door will push our delivery back from April 4th to April 12th. Not too bad for these manufacturing challenged times we live in!

More details and photos here: RVino