P38 vs Disco II

Hoping to start an open discussion on the merits of both as an overland vehicle. I'm intrigued by both for many reasons. So have at it, what say you?

I have a family of 5, plus a Dobie. I'll get a large rooftop tent. Most often it'll be me and the kids (the wife thinks camping is the econo lodge).
 

JeremyT101

Adventurer
I would say if you have the money go for the LR3, if not, an 04 D2 would be the best bet out of those choices. The question is, with you, your wife, three kids and a dog, is even an LR3 enough space? Because if you fill it up with gear, and all the seats with kids, no room for the dog. I have seen on this forum that once you reach into the three kid range you have to start looking for something with another row, such a suburban or the like. You can even get them in the same vintage as these LR's. They are easy to find parts for in the US, and hell get about the same gas mileage. I would look into something bigger if I were you.
 

454

Exploder
I'd steer clear of the P38; just too many issues. Even for a Rover.

And I do love the look of a mildly lifted '38, so no hate here.
 

dcarr1971

Adventurer
D2 with the 3rd row jump seats. Get a rack for your gear and you'll have plenty of room for the 3 kids and the dog.

As stated by others, no matter how cool they look, the P38 is a problem waiting to happen. There are a few guys on here that have proven lucky with them, but most p38s are even worse than you can imagine...
 
Well let me re-qualify my statements.

I have a family of 5, most likely for the next 3-4 years it would be me and the oldest boy. Wife will not camp. She doesn't do it, and I aint making her. I don't go to the nail salon because she likes it either, so no biggie for me. If the twins (1.5 years as of now) come, it'll be for the day, then home with Momma. The Doberman too. Dobermans don't camp, it's beneath them, as there is no bed or climate control. I live in the North East, so initially it'll be weekend trips.

I am a tinkerer. I fear nothing mechanical. Even Rovers (Murphy will probably strike me down for this!) Worse comes to worse with the P38 I'll make it a diesel ala Redrover. I also have an affliction for exotic vehicles. This would not be my daily driver, but a project car, that theoretically could be passed onto the oldest boy when his time comes. I'm not buying new, or lightly used. I've got a cash budget, but just like everything, it's limited. These two vehicles are just about in that range, taking into account ancillaries, rebuilds, failures and the like.

I am also an avid fly fisherman. This would be the fishing wagon too. Here in the north east there is an advantage to a vehicle the size of p38 or Disco II. There are roads I could fish from that I would not be nearly as comfortable driving a Burb up, or my likely turning around on. Plus when the day comes, that all three kids want to go, it's a great time to build a trailer right?

So on a side by side comparison, not whether or not to, what are the advantages? My goal for a vehicle is something that I can scratch the paint on. Get muddy inside and out. take for a day fishing or weekend camping, and not have to worry about crapping it up. Wash and wear so to speak.

Is there markedly more space in a P38? Is the Disco II that much more reliable? Just looking for some insight from those that have either, or maybe both?

Dreaming!
 

rijosho

Adventurer
LR3 with the 3rd row. The LR3 is only a few grand more than a bunch of the 2004 D2s I've seen, if not the same price in a few instances. Many also come with a 3rd row, which I've sat in for 3 hours loaded up with a bunch of other friends and it was actually pretty comfortable.

Which would you rather?

http://philadelphia.craigslist.org/cto/3159498546.html

or

http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/cto/3146795951.html

No brainer to me. The LR3 has the 3rd row. You don't even know it's there when it's folded down. My buddy got a green 2008 one with around 70k miles a year ago in the high teens $$ and it's been awesome
 

dcarr1971

Adventurer
There will be more room in a D2 and it should be more reliable (once you've caught up on all the maintenance). I have 2 D1s and 2 D2s...all have proven pretty reliable with routine maintenance. I have friends with P38s that can't say the same thing...and one of them is a Rover mechanic.

All of the above said, if I ever thought I could make make a P38 reliable I'd love to own one, but I don't see that happening any time soon.

Some other things to consider...there is little aftermarket support for the P38, and all of the electronics are genuinely problematic.

The P38 was Rover's first shot at a 'drive by wire' system, and you can tell. They put the computer/ECU under the passenger seat because it was too big to put anywhere else. (Remember this the first time you come up to a stream.)

Justin at Lucky8 LLC is trying to start supplying aftermarket off-road parts for the P38s, and has a build thread for one on this forum, but I don't know that anyone else is bringing them in at this point. If you really want a P38, Justin might be a good guy to speak to. I'd also check out the forums over at RangeRovers.net.
 

dcarr1971

Adventurer
The LR3 is also a good choice if you aren't going to do anything too exciting off-road, but if you're willing to look at the '99 - '01 you can find exceptional examples in the sub $5k range. Just remember the LR3 is 10 inches longer than the D2.

FWIW, if you had asked 'P38 versus LR3', my answer would be 100% LR3 and if you had asked 'D2 versus LR3' it would be a lot more dependent upon what you wanted to use it for...
 
Ok dcar. I'm game. Make the argument for D2 v. LR3. My needs are the same above. $15k is still what I'd put in to the whole thing total. Bumpers, RTT, racks etc. included.
 

dcwhybrew

Adventurer
Well let me re-qualify my statements.

I have a family of 5, most likely for the next 3-4 years it would be me and the oldest boy. Wife will not camp. She doesn't do it, and I aint making her. I don't go to the nail salon because she likes it either, so no biggie for me. If the twins (1.5 years as of now) come, it'll be for the day, then home with Momma. The Doberman too. Dobermans don't camp, it's beneath them, as there is no bed or climate control. I live in the North East, so initially it'll be weekend trips.

I am a tinkerer. I fear nothing mechanical. Even Rovers (Murphy will probably strike me down for this!) Worse comes to worse with the P38 I'll make it a diesel ala Redrover. I also have an affliction for exotic vehicles. This would not be my daily driver, but a project car, that theoretically could be passed onto the oldest boy when his time comes. I'm not buying new, or lightly used. I've got a cash budget, but just like everything, it's limited. These two vehicles are just about in that range, taking into account ancillaries, rebuilds, failures and the like.

I am also an avid fly fisherman. This would be the fishing wagon too. Here in the north east there is an advantage to a vehicle the size of p38 or Disco II. There are roads I could fish from that I would not be nearly as comfortable driving a Burb up, or my likely turning around on. Plus when the day comes, that all three kids want to go, it's a great time to build a trailer right?

So on a side by side comparison, not whether or not to, what are the advantages? My goal for a vehicle is something that I can scratch the paint on. Get muddy inside and out. take for a day fishing or weekend camping, and not have to worry about crapping it up. Wash and wear so to speak.

Is there markedly more space in a P38? Is the Disco II that much more reliable? Just looking for some insight from those that have either, or maybe both?

Dreaming!

Just for clarification, Redrover has a Range Rover Classic, not a P38 Range Rover. P38s were the 2nd generation Range Rover. You may know that, but I just wanted to be sure. I couldnt tell if your reference to Redrover was to his Range Rover or his diesel engine. Speaking of diesels, a conversion in a P38 will be a PITA and expensive. If youre going to spend that much, then get the LR3.

Otherwise, heed the advice from everyone else who has replied. Get the D2 over the P38, especially if you're going out in the back country. Yes, there are people who wheel their P38s. They are capable, however they are just more trouble prone. You should keep doing the research. There are many LR bulletin boards, so join them and just do a search. Rangerovers.net will tell you all you need to know about the Range Rover models. Honestly, I have owned D1s, D2s, RR Classics, P38s, and now LR3s. Get the LR3 and sell whatever else you're driving. You be glad you did in the long run and your wife wont get angry with you when you're constantly buying parts or taking the car to the shop.
 

drewdub

New member
Is the LR3 substantially more reliable than a well sorted DII?

I am looking into picking up a 2004 DII but he prices of LR3s are tempting. However, all the electronic aspects of the LR3 vs. the relatively basic nature of the DII is something I cannot ignore...

What can one expect owning a LR3 at around 80-90k?

Thanks
 

spikemd

Explorer
I'll chime in as a P38 supporter. I love my P38 and it has been reliable and a pleasure to drive. I have kept up on all the maintenance and it hasn't given me any trouble and (knock on wood) it doesn't leak. There are a lot of P38 bashers out there and 10 years ago there were a lot of reasons to bash them...BECMs, EAS issues, HEVAC issues, leaking o-rings, airsprings/compressors, etc. There are a few modifications you can do to take most of your headaches off the table. To the horror of many owners on rangerovers.net, I will be converting from EAS air suspension to springs int he next few months. It comes down to reliability and the biggest crutch was the air suspension. If it blows, you are out of luck. (but for a car on the street, it drives like a dream and with simple maintenance, the eas is servicable and reliable) I just don't want to get stuck in the middle of Death Valley 100s of miles from pavement with a busted air spring.

That being said, I was originally going to buy a disco... until I drove a P38. The interior is so much nicer, in my opinion and I feel it is a nicer truck. Interior volume is about the same, actually a bit less when you consider the rake on the rear of the P38 while the disco is essentially vertical.

As far as engines... come on! They have the same 4.0/4.6 as the disco, so I don't know why it takes more heat in this category. The transfer case is different with four wheel traction control on the 1999 and newer P38s. The 04 has the locking diff, which the P38 does not have. But I have crawled up some trails with my P38 that amazed some.

Other electronic issues were the BECM or main body computer. Basically, all the interior/exterior electronic come to one main computer. In theory, a good idea because it eliminates a lot wiring and redundant system, but the early models were plagued with issues. I have not heard of the same issues with the later models (1999 and newer). Just be careful that you don go crossing 3 foot rivers with the doors open. The P38 actually has double sealed doors for excellent water control when compared with the disco.

There is definitely more aftermarket support for the discos with lots to choose from. Not so much with the P38, but the basics are out there. I have had to scour craigslist and ebay to find my goodies (axle guards, roof rack, winch tray, ladder, custom sliders, etc).

Drive both and see which truck calls to you.

Don't be afraid of the P38 with the wealth of knowledge on rangerovers.net to fix any issue that may come up. For every P38 issue, there is also a disco issue. Nowadays, you can get a compressor rebuild kit for $30 instead a new compressor for $1500. My P38 is easy to work on. Prices for parts are basically the same.

Only buy a newer (1999-2002) model though and get the 4.6. Bosch electronics, 4 wheel traction control and other electrical glitches fixed. More power for the same gas mileage. Most of my trips are with another P38 that is a 4.0 and I usually get better gas mileage.

It comes down to money when you consider an LR3. (they are asking WAY too much for that 04 disco by the way. you can find them for $8) The LR3 is a great vehicle and very capable in stock form or with a simple 2 inch electronic lift. Just throw some offroad tires on and you can go. But parts, maintenance and accessories are a lot more expensive. Figure out your total budget and what you want to do with the vehicle. If it is just for trips and trails, don't blow your load on the purchase price. Buy an older vehicle and modify it to be reliable and have all the goodies you want. My P38 is going to be just a trail rig within the next year, but I knew that when I purchased it. Spend your money on trips and gas, fridge, tent and things that will make your camping a better experience.

Some pics for you of our P38s in Moab and Death Valley:

dv12_d1_goler_p38.jpg

moab2011_ehill_rgb_artic.jpg

and an LR3 at the same obstacle just for fun..
dv12_d1_goler_suttle.jpg


let the P38 bashing continue...
 

Forum statistics

Threads
188,440
Messages
2,904,955
Members
230,360
Latest member
TNielson-18
Top