@volpe30 and
2jeeps-patriotx1 - Great Thread! I am looking at both the XV-2 and the Patriot X1-N (completely different price ranges) and debating.
1. Would you do the Webasto Heater again? I ask as it's something like a $5k option, versus just using a Mr. Heater?
2. Any thoughts on an X1-N and doing a hardtop RTT like the James Baroud Evasion Evolution? I ask because the N has an MSRP that is $9k less plus comes with air suspension (which is a $2.8k option on the X1). I do like the idea of the larger space the full X1 has, and the steps versus the ladder. Right now it's just the girlfriend and I, but that could change. Like the idea of the N as I could do a hardtop (quicker setup/take down) & save $5k or more, but then I miss out on steps v ladder and having a changing room.
3.
2jeeps-patriotx1 - I live near Glenwood Springs, any chance in exchange for some beer/whiskey/etc we could meet somewhere in Denver and I check out the trailer? I'll PM you.
Thank you again for a great thread!
It's been quite a while since I've posted, so I thought I'd just post a portion of my PM to jkaylen. In a PM to me he asked the above questions plus a comparison with the XV-2, the trailer I owned before my Patriot.
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The XV-2 is a good trailer. It just has a lot of compromises. The biggest pros are the base trailer is absolutely nuclear bomb proof and it is utilitarian in that you can use it as a cargo trailer. But it is a military utility trailer that has been gussied up (did I just use the word gussied?) to fill the overland trailer niche. That means it has a lot of compromises. First and foremost, the torsion suspension is can be horrible off road. Unless the trailer is heavily loaded down, and even then, it bounces around like crazy. There were often times I hated towing it off road due to how the suspension handles. A tie for first is setup. The kitchen is a pain to set up. I know it doesn't seem like much, and I thought the same thing, but if you are moving regularly, like you would be on an overland trip, setting it up and breaking it down gets REALLY old. In addition, not having quick access to the kitchen and all your kitchen goods/food (because they are tucked away in the bed of the trailer somewhere) sucks. Second, the rack rattles like crazy. The only advantage the XV-2 has over the patriot is the ability to use it to haul cargo, or whatever, and I do miss having the tailgate. I also miss the outstanding perimeter and rock lighting (still not sure why the Patriot doesn't come with rock lights.)
Unlike the XV-2, the Patriot was built from the ground up to be an overland trailer--and it shows in every way. As opposed to the XV-2, it is an absolute dream to tow both on road, and more importantly, off road. The suspension setup is so impressive. I have the XV-1 GT, but I think the suspension on all of them is impressive. The kitchen setup is amazing. It is so nice to be able to just stop wherever and have instant access to your entire kitchen, fridge, and food. Just like how it handles off road, the Patriot is rock solid. Not a peep on the trails. And, believe it or not, because of the compartmentalization/design I can fit more in the Patriot than I could in the XV-2. The 40 plus gallons of water is appreciated as well. It's an amazing trailer.
You asked in the post if I would get the Webasto again. That's a really good question and it kind of ties in with which model to consider. Here's my take, IF you are thinking you might have kids and, yes this is true, if you have a dog and plan on having the dog with you, I think the X1-GT is the way to go. First, as we found out, you can outgrow your RTT. If you have kids, they will eventually want their own space. So what you purchase now should work for any future plans. The X1 with the "kids" annex is hard to beat for two, no, three reasons. First, the kids annex will fit two cots/kids plus plenty of gear. The kids definitely appreciate, as will you, having their own space. Second, having the lower, main annex attached to the main tent is so damn nice. After having a RTT for two plus years on the XV-2 I can't tell you how nice it is to have an area to walk into and stand up in. It's so nice having that space to stand up in as part of your overall tent/living space. You have so much room for doing stuff, and for your stuff, and even hanging out in during bad weather. Plus, you can fit/sleep extra people if you needed to. Most importantly, my wife loves having that space for all the aforementioned reasons and having a private area with access to all the storage on that side of the trailer. Finally, it's where our dogs sleep. We used to have them in the back of our 4Runner when we had the RTT, but it is so much nicer having them in with us and not barking at every animal that walks by the camp in the middle of the night. Plus they end up jumping up on and sleeping with the kids on their cots, which they really like (the kids and the dogs). Finally, the main tent annex is why I'd choose the X1-GT over the X1-H--that and the significant up-charge. The X1-H is pretty nifty, and will certainly set up faster, but will it really? As much as we appreciate and love having the main tent annex we would always have to attach it to the X1-H after setup. Plus, the annex is pretty big and takes up a lot of space in your cargo area, where it is all just part of the main tent under the soft cover on the X1-GT (the annex can't fit under the hard top, from my understanding, so has to be stored somewhere else). All that being said, completely setting up the X1-GT with the kids annex takes some work/time. But it's not horrible. Forget the awning, that's a chunk of setup time on it's own--kind of the weak link of the trailer in my opinion. The awning has nice coverage, but takes bit to set up and requires the guy lines to be set up from the start as a sudden breeze will break things.
So, back to the Webasto. Believe it or not, our trailer has two climate zones. Maybe even three. Because the main bed is raised up, it is actually a decent amount warmer than when you climb down the stairs. I know it sounds crazy, but it can be quite a bit warmer up on the bed than in the main tent annex. Even cooler in the kids annex. Depending on the temperature, the Webasto doesn't heat the tent as much as makes it a little less cold. This is especially true if you don't have the kids annex on and windows are zipped up. In that configuration it works pretty well. Even with the kids annex on it helps keep the main bed area a bit warmer, but not the kids annex. During cold nights, like high 30's or lower, the Little Buddy Heater gets broken out to warm things up, especially if the kids annex is set up. Would I spend the extra $5,000 on the Webasto again, man I honestly don't know. There's an X-factor involved too--there's been issues with the Webasto when used at higher elevations due to the fuel mixture not being right for the higher altitudes. For someone like me who will be heading to higher altitudes next summer in Colorado that's something to think about. Kind of like the trailer in general, and maybe I expect too much, but if I spend $5,000 for an accessory I expect it to work and be trouble free, period. So I'm honestly not sure if I'd get it again when a Little Buddy can crank out serious heat for a less than tiny fraction of the price. That being said, we never keep the Little Buddy on due to the carbon monoxide concern and burning through a lot of propane (we have the adapter so we can run it off the larger tanks). You can keep the Webasto running constantly without issue, and we have. On top of that it is SUPER efficient. It's crazy how little diesel the Webasto uses. So you can see why it's not an easy answer.
So, my opinion is if you can swing it Patriot over the XV-2 hands down. As far as which model, I honestly think that even if it was just my wife and I I'd go with the X1-GT again. The main tent annex is just so nice to have as a "living room," which is what if functions as--an overlanding living room. It takes a little longer to set up and break down than the X1-H or a RTT on an X1-N like a James Baroud, but for us having the extra space is worth it. Plus the bed on the X1-GT is awesome and, again, this sounds silly, but the "steps" that lead from the bed are SO much nicer than climbing up and down an ladder--especially in the middle of the night when nature calls. And, again, given how we would almost always want the main tent annex attached, I don't think the X1-H would be any faster to set up in the end and would take up precious cargo space in the trailer or truck. That and saving the large up-charge cost for the X1-H.
