Question

[cobblecrazy]

I have a BMW 1200GS Adv. Last year I purchased a F800GS as I felt it would be a more capable off-road machine, and I thought it would be adequate for commuting from time to time. What I discovered after months of riding both kind of suprised me.

I had set up both bikes with Jesse hard cases and a few other things so the bikes were generally similar in design/appearance. I began to discover that I preferred the feel of the 800 for most of my riding days. There were a few times the larger bike was "better," but, as time has gone on, those occasions have been fewer and fewer.

During the winter I preferred to ride the 800 on poor weather days, or times when I was not sure if I'd be riding through the snow on the way home. I'm not intimidated by the 1200, but I knew the 800 would be easier to "recover" from a slip, or slide, on my way home.

Originally, the 1200 served well for two-up riding, but, in reality, my wife does not really like to ride that much. We have a Sportsmobile that we use to travel around to various locations, and we usually have our mountain bike tandem along to cruise around the trails and back roads, or just drive the van. When I talked with her the other day, she said she preferred the occasional day trip on the bike, but the "long haul" type of trips were not that appealing to her.

I like multi day trips, but I usually like some "adventure" to the rides I take. The 800 is more that capable to haul whatever I need, and I have never been intimidated by taking it up on the freeway if I need to get somewhere a little faster than the back roads (I had an '01 650 Dakar that was not very fun to ride on the freeway, and, I felt, a pig off road).

Over the years I have been a Dakar junkie, and I have always wanted to build a rally bike. Recently I cam across the Touratech conversion for the 450X (see attached image). This got me thinking....

I have looked at putting a versa haul sportbike tray on the back of the Sportsmobile that would easily carry the 800 and the 450X (I'm not a really big fan of hauling trailers). We can travel to a spot and use the 800 for both/one to ride, or I can take the 450X/Rally to have some fun.

Right now BMW has a deal going on the '09 450X that is almost too hard to pass up...

I guess only I can truly answer if I would miss the 1200. I've always been a fan of the boxer engine for its capabilities and its durability, and this seems to be really the only thing holding me back from selling the big bike and building up something that I've always wanted.

Just sending this out to the masses to see if anyone has had the same dilema, or at least has an opinion.

 

[wesel123]

I think is boils down to if your wife will ever ride with you again. I had an 800 and the better half HATED riding two up. Beside the bike really isn't designed for it. I think you'll regret getting rid of the 1200. I know you said the 800 is more of the bike you'd be riding but I think having the 1200 and the 450 would be better. You could strap the 450 to the back of the SMB and keep the 1200 for around town and long distance stuff.

I was in your same boat. Had am 05 GS and sold it, STUPID move. A year latter bought a 1200 RT, great bike but for a single purpose only. Thought to my self ohhh the new 800 is perfect....it was far from it. Sold it to buy an 09 1200GSA. Was happier but not as happy as I was with the 05 standard GS so I sold the 1200 to get and 1150 GSA and I have that same feeling I did with the 05 GS, just plain love it. If I had the extra change I would get the 450 and have the best of both worlds. That 450 is an awesome bike, I rode a buddies and had as much fun as I did on my KTM 450EXC (again a bike I should have never sold).

So the moral of my overly long story is stick with the 1200 and 450 combo. The 800 is just an OK bike for what your looking to do....your CFO will be happier trust me.

 

[goodtimes]

I look at the 800GS as a nice bike for trips that require some freeway use (couple hundred miles to/from) along with some moderate terrain (use your own definition of 'moderate'). But it isn't all that great for racking up thousands of street or graded dirt miles on. IMO, a 1200GS is a better choice there. But then, for the tight trails, big rocks, steep/loose climbs, extensive sand work (etc), I wold take a 450 over the 1200 or 800.

For example:

If I were to take a trip from Arizona up to Alaska with the intent of riding up to Dead Horse, and then ride home -- I would take a 1200GS.

If I were to go ride the TAT (including to/from the trail heads), I would take an 800GS (after I put a decent seat on it, and new springs under it).

If I were to go explore an unknown route across the local mountain range for a day or two, with little/no freeway, I would take a 450.

Of course, there are many other brands out there that would be suitable (KTM, Honda, Suzuki, blah blah blah), but since you specifically mentioned BMW, and those 3 models in particular, I kept my examples restricted to those three.

In the end, it all boils down to what you are doing with the bikes, and how comfortable you are with the bigger bikes in tighter terrain.

 

[R_Lefebvre]

I sort of agree with Wesel. If you're going to have two bikes, the 1200 and the 450 make more sense than the 450 and 800. It's a much better spread in capabilities.

BTW, that rally conversion is pretty cool. I'm interested in doing that type of thing with my little WR250X. Love the bike but would like some wind protection.

 

[cobblecrazy]

I think is boils down to if your wife will ever ride with you again. I had an 800 and the better half HATED riding two up. Beside the bike really isn't designed for it. I think you'll regret getting rid of the 1200. I know you said the 800 is more of the bike you'd be riding but I think having the 1200 and the 450 would be better. You could strap the 450 to the back of the SMB and keep the 1200 for around town and long distance stuff.

I was in your same boat. Had am 05 GS and sold it, STUPID move. A year latter bought a 1200 RT, great bike but for a single purpose only. Thought to my self ohhh the new 800 is perfect....it was far from it. Sold it to buy an 09 1200GSA. Was happier but not as happy as I was with the 05 standard GS so I sold the 1200 to get and 1150 GSA and I have that same feeling I did with the 05 GS, just plain love it.QUOTE]

I have to agree I liked the 1150GSA over the 1200 (w/the exception being wind protection).

My wife's ridden on the back of the 800, and she said there was not much difference to her (she just does not like riding that much), but she did say it was easier to climb up onto than the 1200. I really think her "trips" will be limited to day outings from the campsite, or from home.

I think the long distance riding is really down to comfort. A really nice seat makes all the difference to what you ride, and a little wind protection goes a long way to that drain at the end of the day (more so if your doing the long trips). I think to that Lois gal ("Lois on the Loose") who rode a TT230 (or something similar) from England to the bottom of Africa. Sure there were times I would assume she wanted to have a little more of this, or that, but there are many quotes from people who think the 800 is going to be the choice of round the world travelers (see Helge's 800GS video).

 

[KHJPHOTO]

Think Hack

For her comfort hang a sidecar on your 12GS.

www,freedomsidecars. com - Claude is finishing mine end of this month.
My lady never liked to ride the 12GS and with the hack it will be much more comfortable for her. And for my solo camping; take the seat out and you have a "pick up". I'll be carrying my Honda 2000i genset and have all the comforts of home.

On the West Coast look at Dauntless Sidecars.

 

[cobblecrazy]

Even if I included a lounge chair w/massage capabilities, tv, hot tub, and wine bar, in the sidecar, she still would find a reason to not come for a ride....

 

[RHINO]

i think the 1200 would be the bike to keep if your were going to get that 450,,,,

 

[Redline]

So what it the deal that's 'almost' too good to pass up for the 450?

 

[cobblecrazy]

In the mid $7000's, which puts it just a little below some of the others in its same category. The kicker is the 2010 will be up in the $10,000 range (they made some slight changes if my info is correct) so if I'm really going to do the build the price for the '09 is more compelling...

 

[Redline]

I would would love to have a new 450 for 7-8k, I love the 3/36k warranty on a dirt bike! Maybe next year.

Now is not the time for me as my old 1150 is sitting neglected and unloved not getting any attention/love.

I understand your wife not liking to travel much on the bike.

I think I want an 800 (though I have yet to ride one), but I’m not sure it’s a good replacement for my excellent, dialed 1150?

In the mid $7000's, which puts it just a little below some of the others in its same category. The kicker is the 2010 will be up in the $10,000 range (they made some slight changes if my info is correct) so if I'm really going to do the build the price for the '09 is more compelling...

 

[cobblecrazy]

My main concern is they are only in the 2nd year of production, and, although they acquired Husky (this is the origin of the design), I'm not sure how much BMW will be dedicated to the off-road market. This "deal" seems like they're desparate to sell the leftovers so you have to wonder.

BMW's origins were in the 6 days and off-road, but it just seems like their bread and butter is in the long distance "adventure" tour crowd - there's a reason the GS and RT are their highest sellers, even the LT has gone by the wayside for the time being.

I talked to Jerry and let him know I know the reliability of the boxer is tried and true - 100,000 - 200,000+ miles with proper care - but I'm not sure about the rotax engine. He said the testers are going strong at 100,000 - 150,000 range - again with the proper care.

I REALLY like riding the 800. I started making some changes which gets it closer and closer to the long range touring machine I think it can be. I know the 1200 is comfortable, but, as one poster said, you sacrifice some off-road performance if thats what your plan is at your intended destination. Have we become so spoiled that we need the two wheeled couch to get us to where we want to go. I can ride the 1200ADV just about anywhere, but there are times that the fun is lost in the anticipation of wondering if the trail/road gets worse, can I get the bike turned around by myself without dropping it....

Having said all this, I am a HUGE fan of the Dakar and similar races. I have always dreamed of having a rally style bike. When I had my '01 Dakar, you could get a rally conversion from Touratech (65 pages of instructions), but it was $12,000 for the parts ($20,000+ if you wanted a whole bike) so it was a little out of my reach at the time. When we priced everything out it was about $13,000.00 (including the price of the bike). I don't have to do it all at once, and my ADV would just about cover all the cost as it is.

 

[R_Lefebvre]

I'm I reading it right, that the BMW 450 is only about 260lbs?

 

[UK4X4]

"Love the bike but would like some wind protection."


that little fairing is to cover the GPS - road book and sentinal units

not sure it will make your ride any les windier !

BMW 450 in this years Desert Challange start of day 4 and a couple of local Honda CRF450X's the local weapon of choice !

 

[T.Low]

I've decided to sell see pics under this posting

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=45409

I can see the widom in this move. I currently have a 450, (and dream of the GasGas Desert 450 and 515). http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Gas Gas/gas_gas_fsr_515_desert.htm

While I do have an affinity for big performance bikes ( I still miss my CBX) if i were to get a 2nd bike now it would be the F800 because I want true versatility.