Repair advice? Blown head gasket on 4th Gen 4Runner?
- Thread starter cbradley
- Start date
S
Scenic WonderRunner
Guest
I'm sorry, my mistake. I now see that you have the 4.0. Ask if they have a good price like that on the other engines.
If it were me, I would have it completely Rebuilt. It will probably need to be rebuilt in within the next 50k+ miles anyway.
That was my point.
I've been there and wasted plenty of money trying a cheap fix with just head gaskets with pretend mechanics.
If I were you, I would try and find the best deal on a complete engine rebuild with a 5 year/50,000 warranty.
After one bad head gasket job. And a Very bad engine rebuild that blew up in the Panamint Mountains. I finally found a good rebuild shop with a 5 year warranty. Although they even had to rebuild my engine a 2nd time, because I was burning 1/2 quart of oil every 500 miles. Or 1 quart per 1,000 Miles!!!!! The new rebuild had less than 3,000 miles on it.
My engine has now been apart so many times, I will have to look at my paper work to figure out how many times.
Here it is....apart.
Paint it Silver! Silver is good! It matches the SWR and you can spot the oil leaks!:victory:
.
If it were me, I would have it completely Rebuilt. It will probably need to be rebuilt in within the next 50k+ miles anyway.
That was my point.
I've been there and wasted plenty of money trying a cheap fix with just head gaskets with pretend mechanics.
If I were you, I would try and find the best deal on a complete engine rebuild with a 5 year/50,000 warranty.
After one bad head gasket job. And a Very bad engine rebuild that blew up in the Panamint Mountains. I finally found a good rebuild shop with a 5 year warranty. Although they even had to rebuild my engine a 2nd time, because I was burning 1/2 quart of oil every 500 miles. Or 1 quart per 1,000 Miles!!!!! The new rebuild had less than 3,000 miles on it.
My engine has now been apart so many times, I will have to look at my paper work to figure out how many times.
Here it is....apart.
Paint it Silver! Silver is good! It matches the SWR and you can spot the oil leaks!:victory:
.
Last edited by a moderator:
cbradley
Adventurer
After much consideration and financial gnashing of teeth, I gave my mechanic the green light to replace the engine. They are putting a comparitively youthful 38K engine in place of the middle-aged 140K engine. I am hopeful to have her back later this week. While they are in there, I am having them replace the radiator, the hoses and the water pump.
4Runer weight loss plan
A metaphor for my wallet after this is all done
The dearly departed (she looks so young)
The donor engine
Hopefully we will see her back in action soon.
4Runer weight loss plan
A metaphor for my wallet after this is all done
The dearly departed (she looks so young)
The donor engine
Hopefully we will see her back in action soon.
cbradley
Adventurer
I am really sorry to hear that you may be hainvg a similar problem with your engine. What you are describing is almost exactly what I was running into, engine symptom by symptom. Besides you, I only know of one other person that ran into this issue and they ended up replacing their engine as well. (http://www.toyota120.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6765)
I ended up having a shop in Orange County do the work. They aren't necessarily the cheapest shop around, but they do a lot of work on Toyotas, they seem to have done a very good job (I've used them for routine maintenance since then) and most importantly seem pretty trustworthy. I don't remember the cost off the top of my head, it wasn't cheap, but I will call them tomorrow and get it for you along with the contact information. If they aren't too far away from you, I would have them at least take a look at it.
I would avoid driving it anywhere until you know if there is a gasket leak or not. I tried limping it to the shop when I first got the check engine light and probably did more damage to the engine in the process. I don't know if it would ultimately have made any difference, but I wish I had gotten it towed.
Good luck with all of this and let me know how else I can help. If you end up replacing the engine and are feeling adventurous, you may be able to get a group of guys either here, at Toyota120 or at Toyota-4Runner.org to help you do the swap. All three communties are pretty good that way.
I ended up having a shop in Orange County do the work. They aren't necessarily the cheapest shop around, but they do a lot of work on Toyotas, they seem to have done a very good job (I've used them for routine maintenance since then) and most importantly seem pretty trustworthy. I don't remember the cost off the top of my head, it wasn't cheap, but I will call them tomorrow and get it for you along with the contact information. If they aren't too far away from you, I would have them at least take a look at it.
I would avoid driving it anywhere until you know if there is a gasket leak or not. I tried limping it to the shop when I first got the check engine light and probably did more damage to the engine in the process. I don't know if it would ultimately have made any difference, but I wish I had gotten it towed.
Good luck with all of this and let me know how else I can help. If you end up replacing the engine and are feeling adventurous, you may be able to get a group of guys either here, at Toyota120 or at Toyota-4Runner.org to help you do the swap. All three communties are pretty good that way.
SOAZ
Tim and Kelsey get lost..
Ouch, sorry to hear this. 140k is so young for what I'd expect that motor to last.
I don't think the 3.4 V6 or the 4.7 V8's have had any issues like that. Either way, I say it's way too young for a toyota motor to go.
Glad to see that the shop was able to find a low mileage used motor.
Hope all turns out well.
:smiley_drive:
I don't think the 3.4 V6 or the 4.7 V8's have had any issues like that. Either way, I say it's way too young for a toyota motor to go.
Glad to see that the shop was able to find a low mileage used motor.
Hope all turns out well.
:smiley_drive:
Thanks for the reply Chris. It took me a while to read your post as I forgot to subscribe to your thread and have an email alert set up.
I've taken it to a shop and they said it was the driver side head gasket. They quoted me $2600 for the repair (L&R head gaskets, water pump, oil change, coolant, thermostat, and machining if necessary) I don't really know if that is a good deal or not. I did find another shop that specializes in Toyota trucks (specifically the Land Cruiser) in the San Fernando Valley K&H Imports. I'm just waiting to get a quote from them before I make my decision. I've been driving the 4runner for about a month with this issue and so far all seems well (oil looks good, coolant is okay aside from the gas smell and refilling the overflow reservoir every week or so, no white smoke). I'm heading out to Yosemite in a few weeks so I guess I'm going to have to bite the bullet and take it in to get the job done.
If you can get me that information about your shop I wouldn't mind making the trek out to OC if they can get the job done at a reasonable price.
Thanks!
-Flo
I've taken it to a shop and they said it was the driver side head gasket. They quoted me $2600 for the repair (L&R head gaskets, water pump, oil change, coolant, thermostat, and machining if necessary) I don't really know if that is a good deal or not. I did find another shop that specializes in Toyota trucks (specifically the Land Cruiser) in the San Fernando Valley K&H Imports. I'm just waiting to get a quote from them before I make my decision. I've been driving the 4runner for about a month with this issue and so far all seems well (oil looks good, coolant is okay aside from the gas smell and refilling the overflow reservoir every week or so, no white smoke). I'm heading out to Yosemite in a few weeks so I guess I'm going to have to bite the bullet and take it in to get the job done.
If you can get me that information about your shop I wouldn't mind making the trek out to OC if they can get the job done at a reasonable price.
Thanks!
-Flo
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shortbus4x4
Expedition Leader
Be careful about running your vehicle too long with a blown head gasket. O2 sensors and catalytic converters don't care for coolant. Cats+coolant=$$$$. Don't necessarily go with the cheapest shop, find one that does a good job. A cheap head job or engine rebuild is always more expensive than a good one.
keezer37
Explorer
flo4run,
If you've never overheated, machining shouldn't be necessary. Aluminum heads warp when they overheat. That's when machining is necessary. I've had this problem on my 4.0 in my Tacoma for awhile now. Heater gurgles, air bubbles in the coolant reservoir and #6 fouls at cold starts (105k miles). Mine doesn't do it enough to pop codes. If you are above the low line on your coolant in the morning, I recommend not filling it. Check it again when it's hot. Filling it to the high line when it's cold can cause it to overflow leading you to believe you are loosing coolant. I rarely need to add coolant, twice in the past year. Chevron fuel system cleaner seems to stop the plug fouling for about 3k miles. I guess it's cleaning the plug? I had a coolant system pressure test done awhile back and it held. I'm going to do one myself, an overnight test just as soon as I can find the right adapter.
Unless your oil gets milky, (check the dipstick and underside of the filler cap) compression loss should not occur, assuming the head gasket leak is coolant passage to the cylinder.
If I can get the pressure test to fail overnight, I'm probably going to go ahead with the job. I do worry about the forward cat on that side plugging. The cost is no joke.
I'd avoid the quote with the machining cost built in. In that machining is not a given, it sounds like he may be padding the bill before the fact.
If you've never overheated, machining shouldn't be necessary. Aluminum heads warp when they overheat. That's when machining is necessary. I've had this problem on my 4.0 in my Tacoma for awhile now. Heater gurgles, air bubbles in the coolant reservoir and #6 fouls at cold starts (105k miles). Mine doesn't do it enough to pop codes. If you are above the low line on your coolant in the morning, I recommend not filling it. Check it again when it's hot. Filling it to the high line when it's cold can cause it to overflow leading you to believe you are loosing coolant. I rarely need to add coolant, twice in the past year. Chevron fuel system cleaner seems to stop the plug fouling for about 3k miles. I guess it's cleaning the plug? I had a coolant system pressure test done awhile back and it held. I'm going to do one myself, an overnight test just as soon as I can find the right adapter.
Unless your oil gets milky, (check the dipstick and underside of the filler cap) compression loss should not occur, assuming the head gasket leak is coolant passage to the cylinder.
If I can get the pressure test to fail overnight, I'm probably going to go ahead with the job. I do worry about the forward cat on that side plugging. The cost is no joke.
I'd avoid the quote with the machining cost built in. In that machining is not a given, it sounds like he may be padding the bill before the fact.
Shortbus I've only been driving my car to and from work since this started, I do check on the fluids (coolant & oil) every other day just to be sure. However I never really thought about the strain this could be putting on the cat. Thanks for the tip.
Keezer it seems like your issue hasn't progressed to be as bad as mine. My problem didn't just happen over night either it slowly progressed for about a month to become what it is now, which has become a daily morning ritual.
About the machining in the quote they only put that in there as a "just in case" so i would know what the cost would be ($275). The shop is pretty trustworthy based on a relatives recommendation and meeting the owner. The other shop K&H Imports is very trustworthy based on members from several toyota forums. I have actually taken my wife's Xterra to them before and they did a great job, it was just a bit pricey ($400 to replace a distributor). So I am just waiting for their quote and will probably get another before I decide. I did go to a Toyota dealer for a just for ******ts and giggles to see what the maximum cost would be they wanted $3300.
I definately want to get this done within the next couple of days. Might have to go on a Cup O' Noodle diet to pay for it but I gotta do what I gotta do lol. I'll let you guys know how this all turns out.
FYI...here is another post I found about the 4.0L head gasket, this was on an 05 Taco. http://www.tundrasolutions.com/forums/tacoma/154351-05-taco-dc-has-blown-head/
Keezer it seems like your issue hasn't progressed to be as bad as mine. My problem didn't just happen over night either it slowly progressed for about a month to become what it is now, which has become a daily morning ritual.
About the machining in the quote they only put that in there as a "just in case" so i would know what the cost would be ($275). The shop is pretty trustworthy based on a relatives recommendation and meeting the owner. The other shop K&H Imports is very trustworthy based on members from several toyota forums. I have actually taken my wife's Xterra to them before and they did a great job, it was just a bit pricey ($400 to replace a distributor). So I am just waiting for their quote and will probably get another before I decide. I did go to a Toyota dealer for a just for ******ts and giggles to see what the maximum cost would be they wanted $3300.
I definately want to get this done within the next couple of days. Might have to go on a Cup O' Noodle diet to pay for it but I gotta do what I gotta do lol. I'll let you guys know how this all turns out.
FYI...here is another post I found about the 4.0L head gasket, this was on an 05 Taco. http://www.tundrasolutions.com/forums/tacoma/154351-05-taco-dc-has-blown-head/
shortbus4x4
Expedition Leader
Any good shop auto repair shop is going to send aluminum heads they take off to a machine shop to:
1) be pressure checked. This checks for any cracks in the head that go through to the coolant passages. Cast iron heads get magnafluxed to check for cracks.
2) vacuum check the valves. This checks for the valves sealing in the heads and tells the machinist whether or not a valve job is in order.
3) surface the heads. Any good shop is going to want the heads surfaced before they put them back on. You don't have to overheat them for slight warpage to occur since they were first put on at the engine build factory. This also creates a new surface for the new headgasket to bond too.
A good shop will have a machinists straight edge and feeler guage to check the block to make sure its not warped. I have actually condemned a Toyota 3.0 because the block was so far out that a new headgasket wouldn't have sealed. This was after it came from another shop that had done the headgasket and it didn't fix the problem, go figure. This is not a common occurance unless you have really overheated your engine bad.
A good shop will also recommend doing both heads at the same time because its not that much extra for it. Compared to just doing one and then having the other side go a few months later, the risk isn't worth it. They should also recommend doing the timing belt, water pump, and thermostat with the heads without charging you full price for the labor of the timing belt. You have to take off quite a bit of stuff to do the heads that you would have to for the timing belt/water pump. If your radiator or acc. drive belts are bad you should be given the option to replace them at no labor charge, again they have to come out to do the heads.
1) be pressure checked. This checks for any cracks in the head that go through to the coolant passages. Cast iron heads get magnafluxed to check for cracks.
2) vacuum check the valves. This checks for the valves sealing in the heads and tells the machinist whether or not a valve job is in order.
3) surface the heads. Any good shop is going to want the heads surfaced before they put them back on. You don't have to overheat them for slight warpage to occur since they were first put on at the engine build factory. This also creates a new surface for the new headgasket to bond too.
A good shop will have a machinists straight edge and feeler guage to check the block to make sure its not warped. I have actually condemned a Toyota 3.0 because the block was so far out that a new headgasket wouldn't have sealed. This was after it came from another shop that had done the headgasket and it didn't fix the problem, go figure. This is not a common occurance unless you have really overheated your engine bad.
A good shop will also recommend doing both heads at the same time because its not that much extra for it. Compared to just doing one and then having the other side go a few months later, the risk isn't worth it. They should also recommend doing the timing belt, water pump, and thermostat with the heads without charging you full price for the labor of the timing belt. You have to take off quite a bit of stuff to do the heads that you would have to for the timing belt/water pump. If your radiator or acc. drive belts are bad you should be given the option to replace them at no labor charge, again they have to come out to do the heads.
shortbus4x4
Expedition Leader
You could have a thermostat or water pump that is starting to fail. Check your cooling system for hydrocarbons before condemning the headgasket. Napa sells a relatively cheap kit to do this, it looks like blue coolaid with a glass beaker. Just be careful of hot coolant and follow the directions on the kit. I have seen issues where it had a bad head and no hydrocarbons showed up in the cooling system so its not a 100%. I had a Isuzu Rodeo that had a crack behind the exhaust valve in the exhaust port on the head that would only steam when the cooling system built up pressure, wasn't enough exhaust back pressure to force combustion gas into the cooling system. Eventually it got to the point where it looked like a steam car so it was easy to see something was wrong. Of course the crappy machine shop my dumb dumb boss sent the heads too didn't pressure check them. Guess who got to do the job again? I actually pulled both exhaust manifolds off and then pressure tested the cooling system, coolant was running out the exhaust port on the bad head. I only did the bad head the second time.