Report: Diesel Wrangler On It's Way

discotdi

Adventurer
You are very pessimistic on V6 rating or very optimistic on diesel
For 2014 Grand Cherokee is rated 4WD mpg 20/28 for diesel and 17/25 V6. There is no reason to believe difference will not be similar in Wrangler. Hence it will never pay back in itself.

Jeep website specs rate the v6 Pentastar engine at 17/21 in 4x4 model. Using the 28 estimate for the 2014 diesel.
I assume all things equal except mileage and fuel prices. So at 15k per year and $1 diff. Per gallon the diesel still saves you $100.
Obviously there are many factors that weigh into which vehicle is best for each individual my point is simply that the higher price of diesel does not in itself make a diesel less economical. But generally if you can get 10 mpg better then diesel Will save you money, all else equal.
 

BigDan

Observer
I had a 2.5L 5 cyl in my westfalia 20 mpg changed the engine for a modded 1.9 TDI AHU ( 150/285) doing easy 30 mpg ......

I tried for 3 days a 2012 JK with the pentastar ..... best ever at 21 mpg and torque wise sorry wont beat my Cj`s modded 258 ........

let`s face it the pentastar is better then the anemic 3.8L ( what a goof ) but still wont do the job on torque needs !

the wrangler is way due for a diesel ...imagine 420 ftpound torque @ around 1600 rpm and 28 mpg easy ! for over 20 years Ive been asking Chrysler for this move !
youll be able to pull more then a puny trailer over that .....
a 4 door JK will be a great value pulling a load of 5000 lbs with off road capabilities

jsut waiting for theese to come out ......
I`d trade my 26 years owned CJ for one ....nothing else made me feel like this yet !

Dan
 

WagoneerSX4

Adventurer
As long as the diesel mark-up price is reasonable I might be very inclined to jump on the band wagon and get a wrangler in a few years. The diesel option in the GC is on the verge of not economically sensible, hopefully they can close the gap a bit on the wrangler.

The only thing that stopped me from buying a jeep 2 years ago was fuel mileage and lack of an engine choice I liked.
 

Monterorider

Adventurer
Jeep website specs rate the v6 Pentastar engine at 17/21 in 4x4 model. Using the 28 estimate for the 2014 diesel.
I assume all things equal except mileage and fuel prices. So at 15k per year and $1 diff. Per gallon the diesel still saves you $100.
Obviously there are many factors that weigh into which vehicle is best for each individual my point is simply that the higher price of diesel does not in itself make a diesel less economical. But generally if you can get 10 mpg better then diesel Will save you money, all else equal.

28 estimate is for GC diesel. As of today hwy mpg of Wrangler Unlimited v GC are correspondingly 21 and 23. One may reasonably expect some improvement for Wrangler (just like GC that show + 2 mpg) with new Pentastar and transmission at least say +1 mpg to total of 22(maybe 23). There is no reason to expect same performance on hwy from brick like Wrangler as GC. You could reasonably expect hwy mpg of diesel Wrangler be somewhere in the range of 25-26. Hence the spread is not 11 mpg as you calc but rather mediocre 2-3-4 mpg at best.
In your calcs you compare 17 city mpg of Wrangler to 28 mpg of sleeker newer GC. That's apples to watermelons comparison.

There are definitely benefits to diesel Wrangler (lot more power) but saving money won't be one of them.
 

Metcalf

Expedition Leader
On diesel vehicles I think you generally see less of a hit from more weight and larger tires.....

IMAG0006.jpg


This was with big knobby 37" tires at about 15-20psi, manual transmission, soft top, front and rear bumpers, winch, 3.5 lift, hard doors, 4.10 Rubicon axles, 2dr chassis with the lastest generation 2.8L 4cyl diesel in mixed driving consisting of low range off road work, highway, and around town stuff as far as I know.....

I would suspect the 3.0 can and will do a bit better....
 

discotdi

Adventurer
28 estimate is for GC diesel. As of today hwy mpg of Wrangler Unlimited v GC are correspondingly 21 and 23. One may reasonably expect some improvement for Wrangler (just like GC that show + 2 mpg) with new Pentastar and transmission at least say +1 mpg to total of 22(maybe 23). There is no reason to expect same performance on hwy from brick like Wrangler as GC. You could reasonably expect hwy mpg of diesel Wrangler be somewhere in the range of 25-26. Hence the spread is not 11 mpg as you calc but rather mediocre 2-3-4 mpg at best.
In your calcs you compare 17 city mpg of Wrangler to 28 mpg of sleeker newer GC. That's apples to watermelons comparison.

There are definitely benefits to diesel Wrangler (lot more power) but saving money won't be one of them.

21 mpg is the official sticker hwy mpg of the wrangler 4x4. 28 hwy for diesel is an estimate. The wrangler is lighter than 4x4 GC so should meet that average. Since the diesel doesn't exist then we have to estimate. 21 v 28 is a diff. Of 7 mpg. That translates to savings of $143 all things being equal with diesel at $4.80 v gas at $3.80. Numbers don't lie why so hard to understand?
If you don't like diesel don't buy it. Yes, the diesel Will probably have a higher msrp which will of course be. Consideration. I'm just saying all things equal except fuel prices and mpg.
 

Jorsn

Adventurer
The JK is 1,000lbs+ lighter than the Jeep GC... That will make a difference. Jeep has said they plan to make the new wrangler more aerodynamic and make it lighter, Plus the talks of a diesel wrangler. Win/win/win.
 

reece146

Automotive Artist
The JK is 1,000lbs+ lighter than the Jeep GC... That will make a difference. Jeep has said they plan to make the new wrangler more aerodynamic and make it lighter, Plus the talks of a diesel wrangler. Win/win/win.

You may not believe win/win/win when it shows up on the dealer lots with IFS.

Ya, I'm being a jerk but we know this story isn't going to end well.
 

Monterorider

Adventurer
21 mpg is the official sticker hwy mpg of the wrangler 4x4. 28 hwy for diesel is an estimate.
why not 40 mpg if we decide to pick numbers off the wall.
The wrangler is lighter than 4x4 GC so should meet that average. Since the diesel doesn't exist then we have to estimate. 21 v 28 is a diff. Of 7 mpg. That translates to savings of $143 all things being equal with diesel at $4.80 v gas at $3.80. Numbers don't lie why so hard to understand?
28 mpg is no way average. Where does this number come from? 28 mpg is GC hwy mileage. Wrangler will always be worse on hwy. it has always been true for overseas diesel models. Can't cheat physics. Weight doesn't matter as much as aerodynamics on hwy with other thins equal. In city it's different story hence Wrangler is a bit better in city.
Love math. I see flaw in logic trying to point it out. First we compared city mpg of current dated Wrangler to hwy mpg of different model. Again now why 21? If Chrysler makes future Wrangler lighter and more aerodynamic wouldn't it translate into better V6 mpg? That's what we need to compare future V6 with future diesel.
If you don't like diesel don't buy it. Yes, the diesel Will probably have a higher msrp which will of course be. Consideration. I'm just saying all things equal except fuel prices and mpg.
I don't plan to yet. MSRP will be considerably higher for sure. Just like JC. What I'm just saying is money savings is not one of qualities that should be expected of diesel upgrade. Just for the simple fact that there is no reason to believe that mpg difference of V6 and diesel will much different than that in GC. GC only shows about 10-15% improvement. That gets pretty much eaten by difference in price right off the bat. To me money savings always includes paying off initial investment which will not happen with modest if any savings on fuel.
There are better reasons to buy one with diesel if available: far greater power is, better range is... etc
 

discotdi

Adventurer
Holy crap! Jeep stated mpg for Current V6 wrangler 4x4 is 21mpg hwy. 28 mpg is the stated hwy mpg for the 2014 GC 4x4. So not off the wall not from older model not an average. I used the stated maximum mpg for both cars for equal comparison. My original post was to counter that just because diesel is more expensive it's not necessarily less economical. 5 or 6 mpg more still costs less in fuel at current prices and even up to about $1 difference in price.
That's it, thats all I'm saying. There are lots of variables, I know I get it. And yes we don't even know that Jeep will do it for sure.
 

Mbogo

Observer
At this point, all we can do is speculate. Marchionne is notoriously tight lipped. He is like Steve Jobs in the way he likes big-publicity new product reveals. There are a few things we need to keep in mind, however. The new Cherokee is in by far the largest selling D-segment SUV category. It has to have broad appeal, which means IFS/IRS. The Wrangler is positioned in the more specialized B segment. The thing to worry about is that the wrangler sees a lot of cross shoppers from luxury-brand SUVs. These folks are used to a high number of comfort points, things as soft-touch materials, smooth on-road ride with a minimum of NVH and thumping or porpoising over expansion joints, etc. Also, this group expects off-road ride to be smooth and comfortable, free from strong rebound jouncing and head toss. Actual off-road prowess would seem to be less important than the mere appearance of such.

The other thing we need to worry about is CAFE fuel economy averages. Jeep has already indicated that streamlining styling to improve coefficient of drag is on the table. Unfortunately, this probably means mail-slot window openings and a lower seating position, making it much harder to see the trail off-road. But to the IFS question, weight reduction is also a big component of fuel consumption. Because the center section in IFS isn't subject to the shear stress that SFA is, it can be made lighter duty and of lighter materials (aluminum). Also, heavy axle tubes are not needed. For ultimate weight savings, IFS is the way to go. The question is if Jeep is willing to dilute the Wrangler brand by compromising off-road capability in the name of economy and comfort.

Mike Manley, CEO of Jeep brand, when asked whether indeed Jeep is willing to make the above compromises replied, "Obviously to get the level of capability that we need in the Wrangler, it comes with weight. That's part of the formula. So we do work, and we do look to take weight out wherever we can, but it's a balance, you know? How you make sure that the vehicle is true to purpose. So if we look specifically at Wrangler, there are opportunities. But we wouldn't want to sacrifice the capability of our vehicle. One of the things we said for example is the vehicle will remain body on frame for best support."

Although Manley didn't specifically mention IFS, the body-on-frame comment is encouraging. Because IFS needs less room to cycle, the suspension and axles can be tucked closer to the body. This advantage makes less sense if you intend to stay body on frame. We will just have to wait and see.
 

Rubicon_Fan

Adventurer
Here is my take on Diesel powered JK.
Im an outdoor enthusiast that enjoys long range driving, exploring, fishing, camping. Occasionally I like to get out with other 4x4 enthusiasts to go wheeling.
Here are some of the benefits that I like in diesel engine:
- more torque (I pull my camping/offroad trailer (CDN M101) every time I go camping
271d056b.jpg

-Better MPG on modified rigs. From my experience with Diesel vehicles such as Defenders, diesel Land Cruisers, I can say that lifting the rig, putting on larger tires, bumpers doesn't alter the MPG on diesel as much as gas powered vehicles.
-longer range. Living in Canada, we have lots of remote lands to explore, and long range really matters.
-last but not least, over all MPG (city/hwy)
 

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