Shrinking demand for RV Towables.

Todd780

OverCamper
Yep a big big big reason the go bigger RV thing is so stupid. However the go bigger trend is mainly driven by “rv parking lots” errr Resorts, I mean RV side by side trailer parks.. ERrr damn I don’t know how to classify that trend??
Depends I guess on your defination of big and parking lots.

We have a 21' would like to go to a 24'. We don't feel it's huge and the extra couple feet wouldn't be a factor in the campgrounds we've stayed at. By our definition they aren't parking lots. We like treed, private sites. But def not dispersed and I'm sure by many peoples standards these are just treed parking lots...

That being said, I do wonder when I see 30' + units where they are going...

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calicamper

Expedition Leader
Depends I guess on your defination of big and parking lots.

We have a 21' would like to go to a 24'. We don't feel it's huge and the extra couple feet wouldn't be a factor in the campgrounds we've stayed at. By our definition they aren't parking lots. We like treed, private sites. But def not dispersed and I'm sure by many peoples standards these are just treed parking lots...

That being said, I do wonder when I see 30' + units where they are going...

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24ft is definitely the upper limit but also there are about 1/5th the number of sites big enough for much over 22ft. Even Yellowstone in 2017 it was near impossible to get a spot for anything over 22ft.
 

DFNDER

Active member
Between hipcamp, forest service dispersed sites, BLM, etc. it's still possible to stay away from commcial campgrounds, and hotels, air bnb's and inns have become crazy expensive, so we still prefer taking our chances with trailer camping, but agree that for many people, the reality of campgrounds becomes less appealing than the idea once you stay in one for a while. There are certainly some nice state and national park campgrounds here and there where full boon docking is not allowed, but commercial campgrounds full of giant RV's and screaming kids will drive many back to the Hyatt for sure. We shouldn't jump too far in the pessimism department though. Corrections off the top of a bubble always seem steep and painful, but often end up right back where the normal trend would have been without the bubble. People still want to get away, and hotels and restaurants will bleed you dry pretty quick. As far as the trend towards these huge off road trailers, I just don't get it, and have no idea why anyone short of a full-timer would want to haul some of these new behemoths around. Totally alien concept to me.
 

calicamper

Expedition Leader
Between hipcamp, forest service dispersed sites, BLM, etc. it's still possible to stay away from commcial campgrounds, and hotels, air bnb's and inns have become crazy expensive, so we still prefer taking our chances with trailer camping, but agree that for many people, the reality of campgrounds becomes less appealing than the idea once you stay in one for a while. There are certainly some nice state and national park campgrounds here and there where full boon docking is not allowed, but commercial campgrounds full of giant RV's and screaming kids will drive many back to the Hyatt for sure. We shouldn't jump too far in the pessimism department though. Corrections off the top of a bubble always seem steep and painful, but often end up right back where the normal trend would have been without the bubble. People still want to get away, and hotels and restaurants will bleed you dry pretty quick. As far as the trend towards these huge off road trailers, I just don't get it, and have no idea why anyone short of a full-timer would want to haul some of these new behemoths around. Totally alien concept to me.

All the hip camp places I have eyed run so close to the Airbnb rental cost in town that “camping” vs airbnbing it is decided by how much time I want to spend setting up camp/tearing down camp and the packing/ unpacking at each end of the trip.

Only time car camping has been attractive to us the past 10 yrs was small remote state campgrounds, NP camps and private land camps. We quit the big popular state camps years ago due to every trip having drunken, screaming, belligerent, aggressive people wandering through camp sites and zero staffing or Ranger enforcement of basic camp rules/ behavior etc. Not getting sleep due to drunken idiots rummaging your bear box at 3am and walking off with your camp chairs is a crap trip!!
 

TGK

Active member
We’ve been hauling our 23ft 1971 Airstream around the PNW for 18 years. It’s was the smallest Airstream made with tandem axles. Also, these old units are close to 1,000lbs lighter than newer ones of the same length. It does have it’s quirks though, as Airstream didn’t add gray water tanks till 1974. This forces one to use a dolly for gray water if not hooked up. Otherwise, it’s been a great trailer, as the interior was updated by previous owner and we added new axles, shocks & brakes. We are selective about how far we drag it down the backroads though and slightly smaller would be better. It does have lot’s of character but, after a while, that only goes so far.
 

Todd780

OverCamper
We quit the big popular state camps years ago due to every trip having drunken, screaming, belligerent, aggressive people wandering through camp sites and zero staffing or Ranger enforcement of basic camp rules/ behavior etc. Not getting sleep due to drunken idiots rummaging your bear box at 3am and walking off with your camp chairs is a crap trip!!
That would make me want to give up camping there too.
 

Raspy

Active member
It will cost well over a mill to retool new molds. They will hold out as long as they can. Its why we see very few fiberglass trailers, set up cost is way to much.
Plus, there is still a waiting list for the existing models. Oliver has plenty of money if they want to build a new one. They are very successful, and not just with trailers.
 

Treefarmer

Active member
Depends I guess on your defination of big and parking lots.

We have a 21' would like to go to a 24'. We don't feel it's huge and the extra couple feet wouldn't be a factor in the campgrounds we've stayed at. By our definition they aren't parking lots. We like treed, private sites. But def not dispersed and I'm sure by many peoples standards these are just treed parking lots...

That being said, I do wonder when I see 30' + units where they are going...

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"That being said, I do wonder when I see 30' + units where they are going..."

If you camp in the western half of the country, there is a lot of open, private space for those 30'+ units. We're dropping down to 26' (going from 18,000lbs to 9,800 lbs) and it will feel to us like we're towing nothing. We stay away from all campgrounds though.
 

Treefarmer

Active member
Oliver is an interesting story. A successful private business that was already successful with other products and owned by guys who liked to camp, but saw that the fiberglass trailers they used were not built very well. They have continued the "family" atmosphere with personalized interaction with people and by respecting the warrantee. They have found a niche group and aim their product and rallies at them. Now, that group is like a cult. Everyone is trying to spot an Oliver on the road, everyone paints their hull number on the trailer and refers to themselves by that number, people talk while waiting for delivery and become friends while supporting each other during the anguish of waiting, etc. It's kind of comical, but brilliantly affective for Oliver. Meanwhile the trailers have a simple layout that is becoming dated. But they are well built and should last generations, albeit with a few shortcomings. It seems most of the people who buy them have little if any experience with trailers, or have come from a more spartan camping style, so both of those groups are happy to have an Oliver. There has been some talk about a new model coming out, but we'll see if that actually happens, and when. In order for it to be able to have a larger solar system and insulated/heated lithium batteries, and for it to have a less archaic suspension system, and better insulation, as well as a reasonable bathroom, the design will have to be radically different. The body design will also have to have a few engineering changes to better deal with the stresses. I liked my LE2, as it towed extremely well and was durable and secure inside, but before long I became aware of it's shortcomings and decided to move on. As the price was continuously increasing, I sold mine for more than I paid for it. Now, after two other trailers, I'm moving to a Roamer1.
In terms of accessing remote spots, how do you think the Roamer1 will do in comparison to the X22?
 

Treefarmer

Active member
Yep. Even the giant fifth wheel style trailers. I have to laugh when I see one on the road. It is surprising how comfortable the "little" X22 is. Very practical, very capable and very comfortable. And it will get into places those big rigs can only dream about.
You know the 5th wheel hitch is the original "articulating" hitch, right? ?
 

Buddha.

Finally in expo white.
We had a trailer with an overall length of about 33’. I only had that one because I got a deal on it. We got that trailer into a lot of tight spots and I almost had a stroke many times, driving over curbs and hitting tree branches in state parks was the norm.

Now we’re about 33’ combined truck and trailer length.
 

Raspy

Active member
In terms of accessing remote spots, how do you think the Roamer1 will do in comparison to the X22?
The X22 is shorter with less distance from the hitch to the axles, so it will fit around tighter corners. But the Roamer1 has more ground clearance and a better departure angle, so rougher roads will work better. The Roamer1 is also taller, so clearance under trees is a bit less. Overall, there are not many places one will go where the other won't. The R1 will tow better on the road and is more spacious inside, with larger batteries and more solar, so it invites longer trips off-road and is more comfortable, I guess. The X22 was the most comfortable trailer I've had, so comfort is not a point against it. The weight difference is not a factor, and the width is the virtually the same.
 

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