Size matters, part 3

[haven]

One common belief is that full size trucks aren't a good choice for off-road adventures. They're too big for tight trails, use too much gas, and, well, lack the mojo of a Jeep or Land Rover. But is this true in 2012?

The next couple of posts include dimensions and capacities of 2012 trucks from Jeep, Toyota and Dodge. My observations:

--The Dodge pickup is indeed wider than the Jeep and Toyota pickup. The difference is less than 6 inches, the width of an outside mirror.

-- The Jeep is shorter than the two pickups by almost 3 feet. That's good for maneuverability, but bad for cargo capacity. Piling stuff on the roof creates its own problems.

-- The Dodge has a tighter turning circle than either the Jeep or Toyota.

-- The Dodge has a V8, so it's rated lower by 2 mpg in city driving. For highway driving, the rating is about the same, with Toyota ahead by 1 mpg. The range of all three vehicles is the same because the Dodge has a bigger fuel tank.

-- The Dodge has 1400 lb capacity for cargo, Toyota 1200, Jeep 1000.

-- The Dodge is way ahead in towing ability.

Conclusion: These 3 vehicles are close to each other in most dimensions. Each has its advantages. If I were looking for a truck to use with a camper, then I'd give the Dodge (and similar short wheelbase full size trucks from Ford and Chevy) serious consideration.

 

[haven]

Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Sport 4x4

MSRP... ...$26,445
Engine... ...3.6L V6
Transmission... ...5 speed auto
HP... ...285
Torque... ...260
EPA... ...16/20
Transfer Case ratios... ...2.72
Final Drive ratio... ...3.21 (3.73. 4.11 opt)
Limited Slip - rear... ...limited slip optional, fr and r locker optional

Cargo Area - Bed Height... ...37
Cargo Area - Bed Length... ...?
Cargo Area - Bed Width Wall... ...58.7
Cargo Area - Bed Width Wheel... ...44.7
Approach Angle... ...41
Breakover Angle... ...18
Departure Angle... ...37
Ground Clearance... ...8.7 (10 opt)
Overall Body Width... ...73.9
Overall Height... ...70.8
Overall Length... ...173.4
Overhang - Front... ...26.7
Overhang - Rear... ...30.6
Track - Front... ...61.9
Turning Diameter - curb-to-curb... ...41.2
Wheelbase... ...116

Head Room - Front... ...41.3
Shoulder Room - Front... ...55.8
Hip Room - Front... ...55.6
Leg Room - Front... ...41
Passenger Interior Volume (cu ft)... ...104
Seating Capacity - Maximum Seating... ...5
Seating Capacity - Standard Seating... ...4


Base Curb Weight - Automatic Trans... ...4100
Fuel Tank Capacity... ...22.5
GVWR - Maximum... ...
Payload Capacity - Standard... ...1000
Towing Capacity - Standard equip... ...2000
Towing Capacity - Optional equip... ...3500

Brakes - Front... ...Disc
Brakes - Rear... ...Disc
Maximum Number of Doors... ...4
Steering... ...recirc ball
Suspension - Front... ...Solid Coil
Suspension - Rear... ...5 link Coil

Tires... ...P 225/70 R 16

 

[haven]

Toyota Tacoma 4x4 Access Cab

MSRP... ...$25,900
Engine... ...4.0L V6
Transmission... ...5 speed auto
HP... ...236
Torque... ...266
EPA... ...16/21
Transfer Case ratios... ...2.57
Final Drive ratio... ...3.73
Limited Slip - rear... ...limited slip standard, rear locker optional

Cargo Area - Bed Height... ...18
Cargo Area - Bed Length... ...73.5
Cargo Area - Bed Width Wall... ...56.7
Cargo Area - Bed Width Wheel... ...41.5
Approach Angle... ...35
Breakover Angle... ...26
Departure Angle... ...24
Ground Clearance... ...9.3
Overall Body Width... ...74.6
Overall Height... ...70.3
Overall Length... ...208.1
Overhang - Front... ... ?
Overhang - Rear... ... ?
Track - Front... ...63
Turning Diameter - curb-to-curb... ...40.7
Wheelbase... ...127.4

Head Room - Front... ...40
Shoulder Room - Front... ...57
Hip Room - Front... ...53.6
Leg Room - Front... ...41.7
Passenger Interior Volume (cu ft)... ...88
Seating Capacity - Maximum Seating... ...4
Seating Capacity - Standard Seating... ...2

Base Curb Weight - Automatic Trans... ...4070
Fuel Tank Capacity... ...21
GVWR - Maximum... ...5350
Payload Capacity - Standard... ...1280
Towing Capacity - Standard equip... ...3500
Towing Capacity - Optional equip... ...6500

Brakes - Front... ...Disc
Brakes - Rear... ...Drum
Maximum Number of Doors... ...2
Steering... ...Rack & Pinion
Suspension - Front... ...Ind Coil
Suspension - Rear... ...5-Link Leaf

Tires... ...P 245/75 R 16

 

[haven]

Dodge Ram ST 4x4
6.5 ft pickup bed

MSRP... ...$25,600
Engine... ...4.7L V8
Transmission... ...6 speed auto
HP... ...310
Torque... ...330
EPA... ...14/20
Transfer Case ratios... ...2.72
Final Drive ratio... ...3.55
Limited Slip - rear... ...Limited Slip optional

Cargo Area - Bed Height... ...20.1"
Cargo Area - Bed Length... ...76.3"
Cargo Area - Bed Width Wall... ...66.4"
Cargo Area - Bed Width Wheel... ...51.0"
Approach Angle... ...19.1 deg.
Breakover Angle... ...18.7 deg.
Departure Angle... ...25.6 deg.
Ground Clearance... ...8.7"
Overall Body Width... ...79.4"
Overall Height... ...75.2"
Overall Length... ...209.0"
Overhang - Front... ...40.0"
Overhang - Rear... ...48.4"
Track - Front... ...68.2"
Turning Diameter - curb-to-curb... ...39.8'
Wheelbase... ...120.6"

Head Room - Front... ...40.3"
Shoulder Room - Front... ...66.0"
Hip Room - Front... ...62.9"
Leg Room - Front... ...41.0"
Passenger Interior Volume (cu ft)... ...63
Seating Capacity - Maximum Seating... ...3
Seating Capacity - Standard Seating... ...2

Base Curb Weight - Automatic Trans... ...4866 lbs.
Fuel Tank Capacity... ...26.0 gal.
GVWR - Maximum... ...6350 lbs.
Payload Capacity - Standard... ...1484 lbs.
Towing Capacity - Standard equip... ...6200 lbs.
Towing Capacity - Optional equip... ...8900 lbs.

Brakes - Front... ...Disc
Brakes - Rear... ...Disc
Maximum Number of Doors... ...2
Steering... ...Rack & Pinion
Suspension - Front... ...Ind Coil
Suspension - Rear... ...5-Link Coil

Tires... ...P 265/70 R 17

 

[scrubber3]

Very interesting. I have seen so many new wranglers as of late and I can't help but thinking chrysler is making it more car-like. It's a shame really, but the only one I'd own out of the bunch would be the Toyota Tacoma as I do not believe one bit in any chrysler product. It's just my own personal opinion YMMV. It is interesting to note that the breakover angle is so much higher in the Taco though not to mention it weighs less than the wrangler. Didn't it used to be the other way around? The turning radius being shorter in the ram is probably due to the fact that it is a short bed single cab. For proper comparison you should probably use the tacoma short bed single cab as well. That being said the unlimited version of the jeep probably shouldn't be used either. I think that would make it a fair comparison.

 

[Ridge Runner]

The turning radius being shorter in the ram is probably due to the fact that it is a short bed single cab. For proper comparison you should probably use the tacoma short bed single cab as well. That being said the unlimited version of the jeep probably shouldn't be used either. I think that would make it a fair comparison.

Concur. Also, the Jeep and Tacoma are more mid size than full size. A better comparison would be between the Silverado, Ram, F-150, and Tundra.

 

[4x4junkie]

Yup, it certainly could've been made a more fair comparison.

However I have to wonder if the point of the post was rather to point out that (what used to be) the smaller vehicles have all become so bloated out now that it's almost like what's the point of even having them anymore. Since Ford killed off the Ranger there's no practical smaller option in a true 4WD vehicle left.

In my particular case a fullsize truck definitely would not be practical, it won't fit down many of the trails I use to get to remote camping spots in California's Sierra mountains, at least not without some new character along the sides lol (I've knocked in the mirrors a few times on my 67" wide Bronco II squeezing it through some of the rocks and/or trees up there). With these so-called "mid-sizes" being nearly the same size as the big trucks, it looks like I'll probably be buying used for awhile if something should happen to my BII.

Different people will always have different needs however (I'm probably in the minority here venturing down the tight rocky trails I do), so even if the above wasn't the point of the post, I'm sure it still has plenty of validity.

 

[scrubber3]

I agree with your reasoning fully. Though even as that being the case, the smaller options of those vehicles are available as are much larger options of the Ram. If you compare a king cab Ram, it will be a much different story. To me, that would make the point across in a more relevant manner. Just saying.... To someone that would not notice, that would be a little misleading.

 

[Mighty Dodge Ram]

I think Haven is on the right track, though. I didn't look at it as an apples to apples comparison of which vehicle is best but rather dropping the assumptions and misconceptions about the "types" of vehicles...Jeep vs. mid-size vs. full-size. He makes a good point about trade-offs and your individual needs. I drove a '93 YJ before buying my Dodge. It was a billy goat but a pain to camp in...very limited GVW. The Dodge doesn't go quite everywhere the Jeep did, but pretty darn close. And I can sleep comfortably along with gear under my shell; turning radius...the Dodge definitely rules. But if I were to buy another truck I would be taking a good, long look at a newer Tacoma. The aftermarket for that vehicle is unbelievably deep compared to my Dodge.

I like these type of threads...it opens up good discussion points and I always learn something new. Carry on gentlemen! :sombrero:

 

[78Bronco]

The only thing certain is Toyota has an anemic powerplant and DRUM brakes still on a 2012 vehicle. ******

 

[bob91yj]

The newer GM 1/2 ton trucks use drum rear brakes as well. <baffled>

 

[Hilldweller]

The U-turn radius is exactly one more entire lane for my Power Wagon than it was for my JK 2-door....

And the breakover angle is terrible.

But like you said, it's tow-licious.

 

[Ridge Runner]

The only thing certain is Toyota has an anemic powerplant and DRUM brakes still on a 2012 vehicle. ******

Meh, it could be worse. I used my dad's '09 double cab 4WD to tow my '70 Blazer (roughly 3700 pounds + a heavy trailer + no top and backwards, so it had the drag coefficient of a sail) last summer across Tennessee. I admit, I usually kept it out of overdrive, but I still did 13-15 MPG and wasn't lacking too bad for speed. More power would certainly be nice, but I wouldn't call it anemic. More like right at sufficient.

 

[haven]

The four door pickups like the Power Wagon and Raptor are built on a longer wheelbase than the Dodge single cab I chose for this comparison. Longer wheelbase means larger turning circle and lower breakover angle.

Next year, Dodge is using the Pentastar V6 and 8? 9? speed transmission in the Ram 1500. That should be an interesting combination.

 

[Buliwyf]

If you're not into hardcore offroad trails or rockcrawling. The fullsize trucks are far better machines. It's very rare that I take my truck camping and it's too big to fit. In fact my truck(s) have never failed to get me to a destination. I just need them to get me to the trail head. I have no intention of driving them on REAL trails.

There is a huge difference beteween trying to get to an offroad destination, and driving around offroad trying to get stuck in mud and challenge yourself. One avoids the tough spots, one seeks out those spot. The fullsize is better for the first, the Jeep is superior for the second.

I save the real hardcore offroad trails for my Honda CFR450r or mountain bike. Both of which fit easy in my truck. The worlds absolute best trails still require "Mark I Tennis Shoes" anyways.

My YJ was great for local trails. It was like a 4 wheeler toy. I often accidentally found myself on 4 wheeler and dirt bike trails. It still fit with some trail stripping. It stunk for camping or any kind of destination travel. And hauling a dirtbike was terrible. A Jeep deosn't work too well on most trails up here anyways, unless it's modified to the point where you have to tow it to the trail. So if I have to tow something, I'd rather tow a bike(s), not a Jeep. My Jeeps loaded fuel economy was far worse than a fullsize gas F250.

My new ride is still being built: