Supertramp Flagship LT pop-up slide-in pickup camper

[Chadx]

@jaywo
Feels like you are creeping towards a decision. You'll gather a lot of data on your rental trip. Compromises are inevitable, and perhaps the answer is having two camping rigs. A van for the longer trips (and knowing your offroad adventures will be a bit more limited and/or slow going). And then having the Bronco with existing rooftop setup for those trips where you want to get further out on rougher trails. Not a bad solution. We considered that ourselves. Camper van or hardwall pickup camper and then a jeep or small pickup with rooftop tent or topper camper. If only the vans had more towing capacity. Then one could pull a flatbed with a stripped down, light weight Jeep or Bronco for trail work and satelliting away from base camp.

Agreed on the the offroad capabilities being rather large between the Sprinter and Transit. Have was watching to see if Ford would offer something a bit more offroad worthy (lift, room for bigger tires, etc.) but Transit is a global platform and the offroad/van community is miniscule in overall sales numbers, so they are unlikely to mod the platform for such a niche market.

Many were concerned when the new Sprinter moved away from a high/low range transfer case and a "part time 4x4", but it was really more of an AWD system in function hence why many called it an "engageable AWD" and it couldn't split power 50/50 front to rear. New sprinter is fulltime AWD and transmission has more gears and a granny gear for first that gets ratio to the ground nearly as low as the previous gen in low range. Tranfer case design gave way more ground clearance, too. With there was a gas version of the sprinter available with the AWD system in the U.S. That would be a popular rig to get away from the emission issues with the Sprint diesels.

But all that is discussion for the camper van threads. Keep us posted after your rental trip!

 

[SimplyAnAdventure]

@jaywo
Feels like you are creeping towards a decision. You'll gather a lot of data on your rental trip. Compromises are inevitable, and perhaps the answer is having two camping rigs. A van for the longer trips (and knowing your offroad adventures will be a bit more limited and/or slow going). And then having the Bronco with existing rooftop setup for those trips where you want to get further out on rougher trails. Not a bad solution. We considered that ourselves. Camper van or hardwall pickup camper and then a jeep or small pickup with rooftop tent or topper camper. If only the vans had more towing capacity. Then one could pull a flatbed with a stripped down, light weight Jeep or Bronco for trail work and satelliting away from base camp.

Agreed on the the offroad capabilities being rather large between the Sprinter and Transit. Have was watching to see if Ford would offer something a bit more offroad worthy (lift, room for bigger tires, etc.) but Transit is a global platform and the offroad/van community is miniscule in overall sales numbers, so they are unlikely to mod the platform for such a niche market.

Many were concerned when the new Sprinter moved away from a high/low range transfer case and a "part time 4x4", but it was really more of an AWD system in function hence why many called it an "engageable AWD" and it couldn't split power 50/50 front to rear. New sprinter is fulltime AWD and transmission has more gears and a granny gear for first that gets ratio to the ground nearly as low as the previous gen in low range. Tranfer case design gave way more ground clearance, too. With there was a gas version of the sprinter available with the AWD system in the U.S. That would be a popular rig to get away from the emission issues with the Sprint diesels.

But all that is discussion for the camper van threads. Keep us posted after your rental trip!

Ford has that Transit trail right? Lifted a little on 31's? Not anywhere near the Beast MODE Storyteller but better than stock, you can factory option a roof fan too which is pretty awesome for the DIY crowd. Truly a great time to be alive and camping!!

 

[jaywo]

I will keep you posted.

@SimplyAnAdventure the beast is a bad deal. You pay 40K over just for the offroad stuff. The consensus is to buy a lower model and just pay a shop to upgrade suspensions.
Those 12kwh and 16kwh systems (over 1000ah) are impressive and it’s amazing not to need propane. Takes gas from the tank to heat, electricity for everything else. I would love the Flagship to do that especially since this is exactly what they did on their new 440,000 megatron.
Storyteller has a promo going on and the one we looked at is 160K, not much more than a F250 + Supertramp especially when you factor the massively expensive power system.

@Chadx great idea but 160K van + keeping our 70K Bronco rig is a bit steep for us unfortunately. TBH 160-170 is our max total.

Two things we forgot to talk about!!
1) MPG. Consensus is the transit Storyteller gets you 12mpg loaded. Much more for a diesel sprinter but again I can’t do a sprinter. How much are you getting on the LT? Especially interested in having the number on a F250 V8 gas engine or similar.

2) technology. With the Storyteller you are stuck with a base ford without even adaptive cruise. I love all the tech on my Bronco for long road trip. That’s a plus for the Flagship because now I can get a Lariat with all the tech I want.
Of course Apple to Apple comparison I could buy a loaded transit and have it fully Custom by Rossmonster or a similar company then this is not an issue anymore. It’s the same deal as ordering a new truck, wait for it etc.

Last: I just got a crazy idea. Buy a F150 long bed for 60K. Put a Tune M1 camper on it (exact same dimension interior as a Flagship except it’s a shell). Have it built out and insulated by copying the same layout as the LT but addressing the shortcomings (people have put 800W solar easy on the tune M1).
Now for less than $100K I have a copy of the LT for cheaper despite lacking a few things (no electric lift, …) and I keep the Bronco.

Well. We will start with seeing how the rental goes and go from there.
If anybody reading this has a Flagship and lives in Utah, please I would love to check it out if you wouldn’t mind.

Merry Christmas all!

 

[SimplyAnAdventure]

I will keep you posted.

@SimplyAnAdventure the beast is a bad deal. You pay 40K over just for the offroad stuff. The consensus is to buy a lower model and just pay a shop to upgrade suspensions.
Those 12kwh and 16kwh systems (over 1000ah) are impressive and it’s amazing not to need propane. Takes gas from the tank to heat, electricity for everything else. I would love the Flagship to do that especially since this is exactly what they did on their new 440,000 megatron.
Storyteller has a promo going on and the one we looked at is 160K, not much more than a F250 + Supertramp especially when you factor the massively expensive power system.

@Chadx great idea but 160K van + keeping our 70K Bronco rig is a bit steep for us unfortunately. TBH 160-170 is our max total.

Two things we forgot to talk about!!
1) MPG. Consensus is the transit Storyteller gets you 12mpg loaded. Much more for a diesel sprinter but again I can’t do a sprinter. How much are you getting on the LT? Especially interested in having the number on a F250 V8 gas engine or similar.

2) technology. With the Storyteller you are stuck with a base ford without even adaptive cruise. I love all the tech on my Bronco for long road trip. That’s a plus for the Flagship because now I can get a Lariat with all the tech I want.
Of course Apple to Apple comparison I could buy a loaded transit and have it fully Custom by Rossmonster or a similar company then this is not an issue anymore. It’s the same deal as ordering a new truck, wait for it etc.

Last: I just got a crazy idea. Buy a F150 long bed for 60K. Put a Tune M1 camper on it (exact same dimension interior as a Flagship except it’s a shell). Have it built out and insulated by copying the same layout as the LT but addressing the shortcomings (people have put 800W solar easy on the tune M1).
Now for less than $100K I have a copy of the LT for cheaper despite lacking a few things (no electric lift, …) and I keep the Bronco.

Well. We will start with seeing how the rental goes and go from there.
If anybody reading this has a Flagship and lives in Utah, please I would love to check it out if you wouldn’t mind.

Merry Christmas all!

So 160K including taxes is exactly the amount I have into my XLT Gas Tremor w/ 37's, ARB Compressor, Radio, Ditch Lights, and 85K (Including tax) Supertramp. All 2023's and all purchased brand new. I was getting 11.3 MPG (not adjusted for my 37's) without the camper mounted to it and I got 10.6 MPG (again not tire size adjusted) after I put the camper on it. I consider that more than sufficient for a truck this big.

I LOVE your last idea, get a F150 Hybrid with the largest payload you can get and throw an M1 on there. I haven't seen an M1 in person but watched a bunch of videos, they look amazing. I'd love to see one of those built out for FT use.

Maybe it's not a great time to be alive and camping, too many damn options!! Go back 30 years and you would be in a 4WH camper, done hahaha....

 

[Chadx]

Two things we forgot to talk about!!
1) MPG. Consensus is the transit Storyteller gets you 12mpg loaded. Much more for a diesel sprinter but again I can’t do a sprinter. How much are you getting on the LT? Especially interested in having the number on a F250 V8 gas engine or similar.

@SimplyAnAdventure can give you good mpg stats. He picked up his camper already and went the long way home. His pickup is a Tremor on 37s. I pick up my camper in March. [Edit: He's a quick one today! Ha.]

For us, I expect our load mpg to be about the same as the Tundra was with camper. 10 to 13mpg depending on road speed. The Tundra was a 4.6L V8 and would get great mileage unloaded and poor mileage when loaded with camper. and worse with camper and towing. Not much mileage on our Superduty 7.3L yet, but its gets bad all the time. I suspect it will get about the same mpg as my Tundra when they are both loaded up and/or towing, which is 75 - 85% of my annual miles.

 

[SimplyAnAdventure]

@SimplyAnAdventure can give you good mpg stats. He picked up his camper already and went the long way home. His pickup is a Tremor on 37s. I pick up my camper in March. [Edit: He's a quick one today! Ha.]

For us, I expect our load mpg to be about the same as the Tundra was with camper. 10 to 13mpg depending on road speed. The Tundra was a 4.6L V8 and would get great mileage unloaded and poor mileage when loaded with camper. and worse with camper and towing. Not much mileage on our Superduty 7.3L yet, but its gets bad all the time. I suspect it will get about the same mpg as my Tundra when they are both loaded up and/or towing, which is 75 - 85% of my annual miles.

hahaha, I am quick, I'm at work but there's not too many people around and I don't have too much to do. Sadly i'm working right now, and through the weekend and Christmas which will probably be even more quiet. Thanks for keeping me entertained all of you!!

 

[Maxim Sprinter]

Top 11 Most Common Problems With Sprinter Van (RV)​

Willing to purchase a used Sprinter Van? You need to find out some issues & technical difficulties you might bу dealing with. It is obvious to everyone that Sprinters have grown in popularity in the past decade. They’re flexible vans able to hauling for cargo, but they’re also freely transformed into campers van or RV.

Regardless of their versatility and german high-quality, it’s important to know the top common fails and issues with Sprinter Vans.

I’ll say right away that everything can be repaired, so I won’t dramatize it. Nevertheless, the Sprinter has its weaknesses. I have selected the most common problems in these great vans that require your attention.
Here Top 11 Most Common Problems With Sprinter Van

• “Rumble Strip” Noise or Torque converter​

• Injector issue or “Black death“​

• Glow Plug Failure​

• Broken Exhaust Flex Pipe​

• Start Count Down​

• Losing power Limp mode​

• Clogged DPF​

• Air leak in Turbo Resonator​

• DEF Heater Failure​

• Oil Cooler Leak​

• Intercooler Hose Leaking​

  Sprinter Service & Repair Vista
  Sprinter Service & Repair San Diego
  Sprinter Service & Repair Redlands
  

  
  
  ​

 

[sg1]

I own both a Transit AWD camper (for Europe and surrounding areas) and a F 150 with an OEV CampX. Both have about 100k miles. I am 6.2 , not quite as tall as you but tall enough. I have ordered a Wilderness Van Transit to replace the truck.
In terms of off road capabilities the truck with pop up is in a different league. The Transit (like the Sprinter) are AWD without low range or locking differentials. The systems are managed by electronics and after extended use in slippery conditions the brakes and the transfer case get very hot. The tires are small . But they are still surprisingly capable. I did the whole Panamericana and Sub Sahara Africa with a Transit. The main difference is that in challenging conditions I can be completely relaxed in my truck and simply drive through without drama. In my van we have to use all the experience of 40 years and get quite stressed, but we still manage.
When driving the truck is more comfortable and much quieter.
Camping is more comfortable in the van. I am almost 70 years old and climbing up a ladder and squeezing through that tiny door in a pop up is not great. Lounging on the turned front seats with the view through the huge windows in the front of a van is much nicer than a dinnete basically without windows in a pop up. Especially if you travel a lot in the shoulder seasons in the Rockies where night comes early and can be cold. We want a wet bath with privacy. Difficult in a compact pop up. There is more easily accessible storage in van than in a pop up.
Sleeping east/West at 6.5 won't be comfortable both in a van and in a pop up. Wilderness Van has a great north/south floor plan with a pullout bed over the dinette. If you use fitted sheets you don't have to make up the bed from scratch every evening.
We went back and forth between a van and a pop up when we choose our new rig. Finally we choose a van because it is capable enough for off road and more comfortable to live in. The choice between Ford and Sprinter was easy. The next Mercedes dealer is almost 2 hours away (Ford 10 minutes) and prices for service and parts are very different. Modern 2 liter diesel engines with a lot of hp are simply not reliable. I have seen a lot of broken down Sprinters on the Panamericana with injector or emission control issues. To fix that is very expensive.

 

[jaywo]

We test drove 5 trucks and a Transit, see below the feedback.
@Chadx @SimplyAnAdventure thanks for the MPG estimates. 10-20% worst than a gas van it seems.
@sg1 Great feedback. Everything you say is pretty much how I envision it. I loved sitting in the Storyteller and watching out the big windows. In the Flagship you are facing the kitchen when lounging, window is in your back but anyway I would not order the window because we need the bunk bed for futureproofing. I feel like you for Offroad: the main advantage of the truck is no stress and faster and that’s big for us. The Transit remains us of our old SUV. We used to always stress Offroad and never know if we could make it. This is what pushed us to get a Bronco. What an amazing experience to just go anywhere without worrying to ever making it or not, and at high speed.

As I said we test drove yesterday a F-150 Tremor, F-150 Hybrid (for tune M1), a F350 Tremor for the Supertramp, and Chevrolet Silverado. We also tested a brand new Ford Transit Trail (empty). Here is the feedback which hopefully also helps other people going through the same process:

- Someone mentioned earlier there is good storage in the rear seats of a Full Size. I can confirm this person spoke the truth. Gigantic storage in the rear when you put the seat up. Fantastic flat floor. It’s almost like a mini van cargo. That would help a LOT. I could probably fit all the “hobby“ gear there or close.

- Something that I am surprised @sg1 did not mention: the Transit front seat is absolutely awful for a tall guy. I have my knees in my face (can’t pull back the seat enough), seat is not comfortable, there is no technology (heated ventilated seats, adaptive cruise…, at least in the storyteller but if you custom a van then yeah can have some of that). I have to be honest with myself it’s almost a deal breaker right here.
Then you get into a F-150 and it’s a 5 star hotel. Amazing seats, space, legroom, comfort, quiet. I mean it’s night and day even for my short wife let alone for a tall person. The Sprinter by the way is much better than the transit. Again it would have been the best of both worlds for us (comfort of a truck, offroad much better than transit, but 6’4” internal height is deal breaker).

- The Chevys have seats like a stone. Super hard. Strongly recommend a Ford to anyone getting a truck camper. The ZR2 suspension was great though.

- Huge difference between a F150 short bed and a F350 Tremor. So much better the F150, and of course I am not talking about the fact the F350 is stiff (it wont be once you put the camper) but the handling, long wheelbase and front solid axles make a huge difference. Feels like driving the bus, and the F150 feels great. Not that it’s a huge issue because it’s still miles better in cabin comfort than a Transit anyway.

We will see if I can drive 3h straight in the Transit next week. When selecting some places to camp in southern Utah, I was already bumping my head because I am not sure the Van will make it and I am already stressing.

Also, I just realized that Fourwheelcampers upgraded their campers a few weeks ago. Now for 60K you have a fully loaded flatbed one with 500W solar and over 400ah lithium, and all else being equal to the Supertramp. They even copied supertramp with under bed storage, electrical lifts, etc. And they give you an extension to sleep N/S which does not seem possible on a Supertramp due to the lifting poles.
If only it looked better but this aside it seems a better deal than the Supertramp with all the new additions. Is there anything I am missing here?

 

[Chadx]

Supertramp is working on a program to do custom paint colors. There will be a cost associated with a custom color compared to the base cost of one of the preselected base color options; Battleship Gray, Sand Dune Tan and Forest Green. White is the no-cost option.

They don't plan to do metallic paint, which is a more complicated application process. The intent is to be able to do colors based on paint code/pigment. Some rigs will look great with a color match setup. Our preference is to not be quite that matchy matchy. We want the camper and pickup to complement each other, but be decidedly different colors. Or at least contrasting shades.

We met up with a Supertramp Flagship LT owner yesterday that happened to be in town for the holidays. As mentioned, we were interested in seeing if our Glacier Gray pickup was compatible with the Supertramp Battleship Gray exterior color. Based on that meetup, I think we will go with the Battleship Gray camper rather than the white camper.

This Glacier Gray Tri-coat Metallic pickup color is very hard to capture in a photo, complicated by how a camera auto-compensates and how an image looks on a certain device. For example, the images below are from my phone camera. The images my wife captured on her phone look different (pickup more vibrant and camper darker). Anyway, in person, to me the two colors are right on the fence of working together or not. Standing there, I could have easily been swayed either way. My wife and the camper owner both thought the colors worked great together. Consider me swayed. We'll order the Battleship Gray. And each time I revisit these pictures, it grows on me more and more.

I'd considered trying to figure out a color code for a very dark gray or even considered black, as I think either of those would look even better, but am hesitant because the darker the camper the more heat absorption, plus we'd run the risk of requesting a color that ends up clashing.

Our delivery date is now set at March 22. Next week I have final meeting with Kelsey to lock in final order specs.

 

[Chadx]

Also, I just realized that Fourwheelcampers upgraded their campers a few weeks ago. Now for 60K you have a fully loaded flatbed one with 500W solar and over 400ah lithium, and all else being equal to the Supertramp. They even copied supertramp with under bed storage, electrical lifts, etc. And they give you an extension to sleep N/S which does not seem possible on a Supertramp due to the lifting poles.
If only it looked better but this aside it seems a better deal than the Supertramp with all the new additions. Is there anything I am missing here?

The latest announcements from FWC are sooooo long overdue, but they must have seen the writing on the wall if they didn't advance along with the competition and at least offer some of these things as options. Can't rest on name recognition forever. Will note that FWC had underbed storage option on some of their flatbed campers before Supertramp was even formed. The upgrades to decent heaters, batteries, etc. is a good move. I'll be interested to hear the cost of the electric actuators as an option on the FWC. OEV doesn't offer them on the slide-ins; only on flatbeds (wonder if that will change). A couple years ago, it was a $9,300 option. Last year I checked and it had gone up to $9,700. Not sure the cost for 2024.

Regarding the "better deal", that depends entirely on the individual. For me, there is a lot more to "better deal" than a cheaper price. We value composite construction greatly and that is one of the primary reasons we sold our FWC after 3 years. The daily condensation issues were not workable for us and that was in dry Montana and Utah. A trip to the pacific northwest in a cool, rainy september was the deal breaker. Mopping up water pooled under the mattress, even with keeping everything vented, is not acceptable for us. We started looking for a composite camper the day we got back from that trip. Certain FWC can be much lighter and lower profile and for some, they value that over other features. So all that comes down to personal opinion and use cases.

 

[tacollie]

@jaywo unless you're considering just the basic shell I would skip FWC. With all the new stuff they're 60k which put you in OEV territory and not that far off of ST. The back seat of our Supercab Ford has been great storage for all our backcountry activities with room left for our 65lbs dog. Keep in mind clothes, food, and kitchen will have a home in the camper. If you can fit everything in a bronco you'll be good with the truck camper. If you log a lot of miles on rough roads I would avoid a van. We have several friends who have sold vans and both truck campers because they vans can exhausting on rougher roads. As for the ST vs M1 you need to decide the level of comfort you want. We do a lot of fall, winter, and spring trips. It's really nice to get in a warm camper after a day of split boarding.

 

[sg1]

We too sold our FWC Hawk because of condensation issues. That won't change because the basic design (aluminum frame, a perfect thermal bridge) of the FWC hasn't changed.
You are right Jaywo that the Transit is tight for tall drivers. At 6.2 I can just manage if I crank the front of the seat fully up, lower the rear a bit and push it back. At 6.5 you probably won't be comfortable. The F 150 is very comfortable. I finally had to decide between an Aterra Topper, the new not yet released OEV Alpine ( both on F150 heavy payload) and the Wilderness Van Transit.

 

[jaywo]

The latest announcements from FWC are sooooo long overdue, but they must have seen the writing on the wall if they didn't advance along with the competition and at least offer some of these things as options. Can't rest on name recognition forever. Will note that FWC had underbed storage option on some of their flatbed campers before Supertramp was even formed. The upgrades to decent heaters, batteries, etc. is a good move. I'll be interested to hear the cost of the electric actuators as an option on the FWC. OEV doesn't offer them on the slide-ins; only on flatbeds (wonder if that will change). A couple years ago, it was a $9,300 option. Last year I checked and it had gone up to $9,700. Not sure the cost for 2024.

Regarding the "better deal", that depends entirely on the individual. For me, there is a lot more to "better deal" than a cheaper price. We value composite construction greatly and that is one of the primary reasons we sold our FWC after 3 years. The daily condensation issues were not workable for us and that was in dry Montana and Utah. A trip to the pacific northwest in a cool, rainy september was the deal breaker. Mopping up water pooled under the mattress, even with keeping everything vented, is not acceptable for us. We started looking for a composite camper the day we got back from that trip. Certain FWC can be much lighter and lower profile and for some, they value that over other features. So all that comes down to personal opinion and use cases.

Wait you got me interested. Will I get the same condensation issues on a Tune M1? If I was to go that route I would put insulation on all aluminum panels. Doesn’t make a difference? It seems no Tune M1 owner in the FB group is reporting any condensation. Vans are aluminum as well and nobody has issues with this? I must be missing something but I am intrigued.

@jaywo unless you're considering just the basic shell I would skip FWC. With all the new stuff they're 60k which put you in OEV territory and not that far off of ST. The back seat of our Supercab Ford has been great storage for all our backcountry activities with room left for our 65lbs dog. Keep in mind clothes, food, and kitchen will have a home in the camper. If you can fit everything in a bronco you'll be good with the truck camper. If you log a lot of miles on rough roads I would avoid a van. We have several friends who have sold vans and both truck campers because they vans can exhausting on rougher roads. As for the ST vs M1 you need to decide the level of comfort you want. We do a lot of fall, winter, and spring trips. It's really nice to get in a warm camper after a day of split boarding.

Appreciate the feedback. Why wouldn’t it be warm in the Tune after splitboarding, with Thinsulate insulation + carpet like in a van, and a proper heater like the one they will soon offer as option

We too sold our FWC Hawk because of condensation issues. That won't change because the basic design (aluminum frame, a perfect thermal bridge) of the FWC hasn't changed.
You are right Jaywo that the Transit is tight for tall drivers. At 6.2 I can just manage if I crank the front of the seat fully up, lower the rear a bit and push it back. At 6.5 you probably won't be comfortable. The F 150 is very comfortable. I finally had to decide between an Aterra Topper, the new not yet released OEV Alpine ( both on F150 heavy payload) and the Wilderness Van Transit.

May I ask why you didn’t consider Supertramp?

 

[sg1]

I didn't consider a Supertramp because we own a CampX. This is very similar to the Supertramp. We want to upgrade to a more comfortable camper with a comfortable place to read or play board games on a long and dark evening, a wetbath with privacy and a comfortable door. The Supertramp doesn't tick any of these boxes.