Suspension Upgrade & GVWR

mycophagist

knowledge is power
Hello all, I've upgraded to a full Old Man Emu suspension, with the Dakar leaf pack (no AAL) on my 2004 Ext cab Tacoma

My question to you is this. Does the Dakar leaf pack increase my GVWR? And do frame reinforcements increase this limit as well?

I'm in the process of building her up and i'm trying to plan out what i can do to her before heading on a trip from new england, down to costa rica this winter.

I have no intent of going over my GVWR of 5100lb, and ideally id like to top out at 90% of that weight.

Thanks for any and all help!
 

DaveInDenver

Middle Income Semi-Redneck
To legally increase GVWR you'll have to re-engineer the vehicle, technically called re-manufacturing. The OEM will sometimes have a process for doing this. As an example when a vehicle is stretched into a limousine the company is reinforcing the vehicle in a way that (as an example) Cadillac recommends and it will receive a new GVWR on a new title. It's not just as simple as welding on the recommended brackets, the brakes, suspension, drivetrain, tires are modified.

Doing it on your own will involve a lot of red tape and dead-ends. Then as the new manufacturer you'd have to certify compliance with FMVSS laws such as roll-over and crash testing since the OEM no longer will be responsible, unless they are the one doing the re-rating (this sometimes happens with commercial trucks, the OEM will raise or lower the GVWR to meet a customer's need).

Practically speaking all you can really do is reinforce your truck so that it can tolerate its GVWR under continuous duty.
 

kmcintyre

Observer
To legally increase GVWR you'll have to re-engineer the vehicle, technically called re-manufacturing. The OEM will sometimes have a process for doing this. As an example when a vehicle is stretched into a limousine the company is reinforcing the vehicle in a way that (as an example) Cadillac recommends and it will receive a new GVWR on a new title. It's not just as simple as welding on the recommended brackets, the brakes, suspension, drivetrain, tires are modified.

Doing it on your own will involve a lot of red tape and dead-ends. Then as the new manufacturer you'd have to certify compliance with FMVSS laws such as roll-over and crash testing since the OEM no longer will be responsible, unless they are the one doing the re-rating (this sometimes happens with commercial trucks, the OEM will raise or lower the GVWR to meet a customer's need).

Practically speaking all you can really do is reinforce your truck so that it can tolerate its GVWR under continuous duty.

I don't think he wants to certify the vehicle just increase the GVWR. I've often wondered what the difference is between a 1/2, 3/4, 1 ton truck (beside 1/4 ton :)). Part of it is probably the tires, but is there thicker steel on the frame? Is the rear end bigger (that's probably more a function of the engine output), etc.? I know the suspension may be part of it for sure.
 

quickfarms

Adventurer
I don't think he wants to certify the vehicle just increase the GVWR. I've often wondered what the difference is between a 1/2, 3/4, 1 ton truck (beside 1/4 ton :)). Part of it is probably the tires, but is there thicker steel on the frame? Is the rear end bigger (that's probably more a function of the engine output), etc.? I know the suspension may be part of it for sure.

Even in the categories there are light and heavy spec light trucks.

On my truck the factory modifications that I know about include.

Larger radiator
Auxiliary transmission and power steering coolers
Transmission upgrades
Different transfer case
Different axles with different gears and differentials
Different brakes
Different springs
Different tires
Different rims
Different frame
Different wiring harness

All of this is heavy duty.

I have found this on both ford and chevy's

On the chevy I ended up dealing with a gmc heavy truck dealership to get parts and service.
 

Theoretician

Adventurer
Nothing you do to a vehicle will affect the GVWR, save for stuff like limosine recertification that was mentioned. You never know what the limiting factor was in the manufacturer defining the GVWR, so you'll never know if you're safe in exceeding it after mods. As an example, for my F150 the max GVWR package has thicker frame members, a totally different rear differential, and requires the stronger 18in wheels.

You might feel more comfortable with a stronger spring rate and stiffer swaybar but cops won't care (Canada and California have reputations for looking for overloaded vehicles and fining them if they're heavier than GVWR) and any lawyer representing someone else in an accident would love the fact that you were too heavy.

Get a bigger truck if you need more capacity.
 

Dalko43

Explorer
Get a bigger truck if you need more capacity.

^ This. If you're at or over the GVWR, then that's a sign you should be looking for another vehicle. I know a lot of people on here claim to drive at or even exceed their GVWR with no issues, but there are so many factors that go into determining that rating it's not worth fooling around with. The suspension is only one of many underlying factors when it comes to determining a vehicle's GVWR.
 

Stryder106

Explorer
GVWR as stated by the manufacturer: 1) Is very conservative; 2) Is based on the configuration of the vehicle AS THEY SOLD IT. Note - manufacturers (unless you are specifically buying an HD vehicle -which will have an expected harsh ride), install softer suspension, undersized tires, and too soft sidewalls for the purpose of making a truck ride more like a car - to influence the woman's experience because if men and women shop together - it is the woman's opinion that carries by far the most weight in the purchasing decision. Of course, when they do this - there is the follow on of weaker-than-should-be parts installed on said vehicle.
//
A 1/2 ton truck with 265x70-17 P-Rated tires, 3.23:1 gears, base rate springs, 11"-12" discs, and 1/2" tie rods - will be very pliable and soft-riding (translation = comfortable ride) and the associated GVWR will be based on that config. If you start changing components: E-rated tires, steeper gearing, stiffer springs, bigger brakes, stronger/thicker/bigger steering components, etc - the vehicle will handle that max GVWR in a much more efficient and safe manner, but will also increase the vehicle's ability to handle additional weight as well.
//
Think of it in terms of the human body - a typical male 5'10" tall, 180# - who doesn't TRAIN - say can bench press 190# and squat 225#. Now - take that same human and turn him into a bodybuilder who trains, eats better, and builds his body (increasing muscle, strengthening bones, joints, tendons) - and now that person can move that same amount of weight with much less effort and more stability, or can move substantially more weight because his body has been modified for the purpose. Or, think of a race car - better stuff equates to increased performance and capability.
//
Having said that, it is far more cost efficient to start with a more purpose built platform to begin with (less modifications necessary) - but I would not say that you cannot increase the GVWR (not official increase, but practical increase) capability of a vehicle with the proper modifications.
//
My 1/2 ton Avalanche 4x4 came factory with 4.10 gears (instead of 3.73), a higher capacity air filter, Z-71 springs (instead of base) - everything else in the engine, frame, diff, brakes, P-Rated tires, etc was exactly the same as a base model - and my listed GVWR is ~100# more than a base model.
//
Since then, I have modded it to have: 1.5" tie rods (stock 1/2"), larger brake discs and calipers, larger tires E-rated, 4.88 gears, Hummer springs, aftermarket front and rear control arms, aftermarket pitman & idler arms with additional bracing, additional separate coolers (rather than integrated), 100% aftermarket transmission and torque converter, headers, bigger exhaust, higher capacity air intake, performance tuner, aftermarket suspension, strengthened the differential, and welded in sliders along the frame - which have the added benefit of strengthening the widest (most vulnerable) portion of the frame. My truck now makes 22% more HP and 30% more torque. More importantly, it makes that torque much lower in the RPM band than stock so I don't have to wind up the engine to get it.
//
Point being - you can modify a vehicle to increase it's capability - to a point - but most of my mods could have been avoided if I had started with a 3/4 Ton HD platform to begin with. Oh well - I'm stubborn.
 

zidaro

Explorer
GVWR is just that. It is a rating set to each vehicle by the MFG. You cannot change that. Unless by legal recertification.

Any modifications made can or will have an effect on the vehicle. You may improve the handling of weight by changing suspension, adding frame plating, etc...
 

*TRD*

Observer
Suspension upgrades can make your truck more controllable as the weight approaches gvwr but does not actually increase the rating.

GVWR and towing capacity are usually driven by the strength of the frame.
 

mycophagist

knowledge is power
Well, my question was definitely answered, and then some! Many things i'd never even occurred to me, such how a vehicle is legally transformed into a limo.

Constantly i am impressed by the ability of the members on Ex-Portal to churn out accurate information!

Thanks again.
 

AaronK

Explorer
All this said, I'd encourage everyone to weigh their vehicle as it sits now. I bet you'll be surprised how heavy it is. Your cargo rating is including people. A lot of mid size vehicles are coming with cargo capacities around 1000 lbs. Subtract a couple of 200 lb adults and almost half your capacity is gone. Subtract steel bumpers, winches, sliders, racks, etc and on many vehicles there's nothing left for your actual stuff!

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk
 

bkg

Explorer
No matter what you do to increase the capability of.your truck, if you get in an accident, the insurance company with go by gvwr.... You definitely don't want to be over.
 

Stryder106

Explorer
No matter what you do to increase the capability of.your truck, if you get in an accident, the insurance company with go by gvwr.... You definitely don't want to be over.

If the accident is that bad then all of the fluids will be on the pavement and all your stuff will be scattered about - so all that weight will be gone. LOL.
 

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