Tacoma brakes

[p1michaud]

More brake caliper problems!

Interesting that you've gone through so many calipers. I assume these calipers saw frequent off-road use. If so, they'll require more frequent and careful cleaning and possibly servicing with new seals now and then.

I figured that I'd update since I had to replace the driver side caliper again yesterday! :Wow1:
We were out on a snow run two days ago and when stopped for lunch we were standing by the truck talking and I kicked some snow on the wheel only to hear and see it boil off! I reached down to touch the wheel and could barely keep my hand on it. So after a bit of field repair, we found that one of the pistons was seized out causing the brake pad on one side to stay against the rotor. We managed to break the piston free with a pry bar and I kept a close eye on that wheel for the rest of the day. We were able to make it home without incident. During the replacement I decided to take a look a the passenger side to make sure everything was good only to find it had a siezed piston as well :Wow1: It was not far enough to cause the pad to stay against the rotor so I'll be changing that one next week. I can't believe that this is normal. Anyone have any suggestions?

So the updated list is as follows:
119K - New passenger side caliper, front rotors (cheap ones, mistake) and brake pads
127K - New driver side caliper
132K - Replaced passenger side caliper again and front brake pads because one piston was seized.
150K - New Brembo OEM solid rotors since the cheap one installed at 119K were badly warped also installed ceramic brake pads. Much much better performance over all.
153K - New driver side caliper, one of the lower pistons was seized again.
154K - New passenger side caliper, one of the pistons was seized again (yet to be replaced).

 

[kevin]

I had problems with my rotors on my old tacoma, but that was comon for the earlier years, and was fixed for the later generation. I never had problems with my calipers, and they saw heavy use/abuse. I noticed you are posting from Canada. I wonder if due to federal saftey regulations the US calipers differ from the canadian ones?

 

[asteffes]

I would ensure that *all* of the brake fluid is flushed with new, quality DOT-4 fluid (Valvoline, Motul, AP, etc.) It seems like something must be happening inside the caliper to cause the pistons to bind. I would flush the whole system with fresh fluid just to be sure it's not the fluid. Someone didn't put DOT-5 silicone-based fluid in by mistake, did they? That would cause all sorts of problems.

 

[p1michaud]

The brake fluid was replaced.

I would ensure that *all* of the brake fluid is flushed with new, quality DOT-4 fluid (Valvoline, Motul, AP, etc.) It seems like something must be happening inside the caliper to cause the pistons to bind. I would flush the whole system with fresh fluid just to be sure it's not the fluid. Someone didn't put DOT-5 silicone-based fluid in by mistake, did they? That would cause all sorts of problems.

I did replace all of the brake fluid with Valvoline DOT-3 after replacing the driver side caliper. We emptied the brake fluid reservoir with a Turkey Baster, then refilled it and bled the entire system starting with the furthest point first.
Out of curriosity, why did you recommend DOT-4 brake fluid when the OEM recommends DOT-3?

Cheers :beer:,
P

 

[cruiseroutfit]

I must be one of the lucky guys. 128,000 miles on the original rotors. Maybe because I have a manual trans?

Ditto, 150k on the Taco, original rotors, I am religious about swapping out pads often... I use trans-brake ALOT though...

 

[asteffes]

I did replace all of the brake fluid with Valvoline DOT-3 after replacing the driver side caliper. We emptied the brake fluid reservoir with a Turkey Baster, then refilled it and bled the entire system starting with the furthest point first.
Out of curriosity, why did you recommend DOT-4 brake fluid when the OEM recommends DOT-3?

Cheers :beer:,
P

Well, it sounds like you were very thorough. I suggested DOT-4 fluid as it meets the DOT-3 specs while also being less compressible (for a firmer pedal and better modulation) and tends to have a higher boiling point (for better pedal feel and brake reliability as the fluid heats up if you're on them a lot on big hills.) Most fluids meet the DOT-3 and DOT-4 specs simultaneously, so it's sort of a moot point.

I'm not sure what to suggest. I've never heard of a vehicle consuming brake calipers the way yours is. If you keep the calipers clean between outings, and the fluid is fresh, the only other thing I can think of is that *maybe* your master cylinder isn't releasing completely. That would cause the pads to drag, get hot and possibly cook the internal seals in the calipers. You would most definitely smell burning pads and experience serious brake fade if that was the case, though. You wouldn't just suddenly have a seized caliper.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Not too familiar with it myself. But I have heard of a commercially? available brake pad that has a sandpaper like material on the face. You run it for a couple spins around the block to de-glaze and tune/true your rotors. I rear about it for the first time on another forum. Interesting to say the least rngartis

 

[p1michaud]

Well, it sounds like you were very thorough. I suggested DOT-4 fluid as it meets the DOT-3 specs while also being less compressible (for a firmer pedal and better modulation) and tends to have a higher boiling point (for better pedal feel and brake reliability as the fluid heats up if you're on them a lot on big hills.) Most fluids meet the DOT-3 and DOT-4 specs simultaneously, so it's sort of a moot point.

I'm not sure what to suggest. I've never heard of a vehicle consuming brake calipers the way yours is. If you keep the calipers clean between outings, and the fluid is fresh, the only other thing I can think of is that *maybe* your master cylinder isn't releasing completely. That would cause the pads to drag, get hot and possibly cook the internal seals in the calipers. You would most definitely smell burning pads and experience serious brake fade if that was the case, though. You wouldn't just suddenly have a seized caliper.

Thanks for your advice. I guess I'm going to have to bite the bullet and replace them more often. I took one of the pistons out of my old caliper to see how the internal seal looks like (not the seized one) and everything looks fine. I have yet to encounter the smell of burning pads or brake fade so I'm going to dismiss that cause for now. I'm trying to pick up a set of used brake calipers, rebuild them then have them as spares. I'd rather prevent than react, but I'm drawing a blank at this point.
Cheers :beer:,
P

 

[njtaco]

P1Michaud,

On the same thought as the master cyl being bad, have you replaced the soft lines to the calipers? I've seen them fail internally (not on a toyota, though) and hold a caliper "closed" sporadically. This doesn't explain why only one piston sticks, unless said piston happens to fail first when the caliper overheats...

Worth a try, and cheaper than calipers.

 

[p1michaud]

Both calipers changed

P1Michaud,

On the same thought as the master cyl being bad, have you replaced the soft lines to the calipers? I've seen them fail internally (not on a toyota, though) and hold a caliper "closed" sporadically. This doesn't explain why only one piston sticks, unless said piston happens to fail first when the caliper overheats...

Worth a try, and cheaper than calipers.

njtaco,
I have not yet changed the soft caliper lines. I've now replaced both calipers so I'll wait and see in about 12 to 18 months if any of the pistons seize again. That seems to be the time frame where these last ones failed.
Thanks for the advice.
Cheers :beer:,
P

 

[Ursidae69]

This thread is well timed, as I need to address the brakes on my HEAVY Taco. Jonathan from TLC in So Cal is working on a set of better calipers with SSBC. That, combined with better pad material will improve stopping. Then I hope to source a set of crossed drilled or slotted rotors to improve fading and reduce glazing.

My brake performance at this point is unacceptable, so I need to make changes quickly...

I look forward to seeing what you do here. My Taco was really heavy in Mexico and the brakes were very noticably diminished. I'll need to upgrade too.

 

[BajaTaco]

Quote:
Originally Posted by expeditionswest
...I need to address the brakes on my HEAVY Taco.

My brake performance at this point is unacceptable, so I need to make changes quickly...


I look forward to seeing what you do here. My Taco was really heavy in Mexico and the brakes were very noticably diminished. I'll need to upgrade too.

You guys are panzies. Just use a little more muscle, it'll stop

 

[asteffes]

You guys are panzies. Just use a little more muscle, it'll stop

Or throw a boat anchor out the window.

 

[p1michaud]

More brake problems!

So the updated list is as follows:
119K - New passenger side caliper, front rotors (cheap ones, mistake) and brake pads
127K - New driver side caliper
132K - Replaced passenger side caliper again and front brake pads because one piston was seized.
150K - New Brembo OEM solid rotors since the cheap one installed at 119K were badly warped also installed ceramic brake pads. Much much better performance over all.
153K - New driver side caliper, one of the lower pistons was seized again.
154K - New passenger side caliper, one of the pistons was seized again (yet to be replaced).

I must have angered the brake gods at some point! :ar15:
150K - New rear proportioning valve (Load Sensing Proportioning Valve - LSPV).

I got in the truck to head home and found that my brake pedal was unusually hard and the brakes were not as effective as they typically are. Anyhow, we did some troubleshooting and found that my rear brakes were not getting any brake fluid then we traced it to the LSPV . I don't have any pics right now, but will take some of the valve if anyone is interested. We replaced the LSPV, re-bled the brake system starting at the master cylinder and working our way arround the truck. I then adjusted the rear brakes. The pedal feels normal now, but I have not regained full braking power. If I mash on the brake pedal, the truck slows down but does not lock up the wheels. Out of curriousity for the guys with heavier trucks and runnning larger tires can you lock up your wheels if you stand on the brakes? My truck is a 1999, manual transmission with 32" tires on OEM wheels and tips the scale at 4700 lbs. I don't have ABS either. Before this, I could get the wheels to lock up, but can't anymore. Is this normal?
Cheers :beer:,
P

 

[Super Doody]

When you replace your pads, you should also run down to your nearest auto machine shop to get your rotors turned...if they are not wrapped. I think brembo OEM replacements for tacomas are the best upgrade. I heard cross drill rotors are crack and are not meant for offroading due to debris loading. And don't forget the stainless steel braided brake lines. TRD pads are okay but you pay for the name. YOu can get the same pads at autozone for 20$ less. They are made by performance friction.

Here is OC Mike page on his brake mods.


http://www.octacoma.com/Brakes.html