Tacoma re-design: Predictions?

[Toyotero]

It seems like there would be some cost savings to be reaped with a one-world design. The Hilux and Tacoma designs have been converging in the last two generations and appear to basically share everything except the diesel engine. (maybe boxed frame differences?)

Personally, I think the Hilux looks better... more utilitarian perhaps...

Possibility of Prerunner only...from my buddy over at toyota corporate
Tundra would be the only 4x4 pickup option

Say whaatttttttttttttt...

My 03 DC just went up in value

:-D

 

[Mojavejohn]

x2

Prerunner only would make sense for Toyota. They seem to sell like hotcakes since they first appeared. I see loads of Prerunners everyday, and only a handful of real 4x4s. Sorry to offend any of you Prerunner owners, but your trucks are lame fakes just like 6cyl Mustangs and Camaros. Maybe its just me, but I don't see the point in having a wannabe.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Prerunner only would make sense for Toyota. They seem to sell like hotcakes since they first appeared. I see loads of Prerunners everyday, and only a handful of real 4x4s. Sorry to offend any of you Prerunner owners, but your trucks are lame fakes just like 6cyl Mustangs and Camaros. Maybe its just me, but I don't see the point in having a wannabe.

I sort of doubt the Tacoma will not have a 4wd option, too many people do still use it in northern states in snow and it still does get the locker. But your point is well taken. I also see the 4x4 option in Tundras as often marketing fluff for a lot of the same reasons. I wonder if it's a geographic issue, I suspect there's not much call for 4x4 in the winter down in Texas or the Mojave so there's no reason to get it unless you plan to use it off road.

From Toyota's standpoint they probably make more money on 2wd or something (Prerunner - pay for the look of 4wd but you don't get the extra hardware!) and there's also probably a MPG advantage.

It seems like there would be some cost savings to be reaped with a one-world design. The Hilux and Tacoma designs have been converging in the last two generations and appear to basically share everything except the diesel engine. (maybe boxed frame differences?)

Personally, I think the Hilux looks better... more utilitarian perhaps...

I am in 100% agreement. The current Taco is not as offensive to me as others but the Hilux looks MUCH better to me, too. I'd be all over the bed with the double outside handles and external rails.

 

[zolo]

I agree with many points here. I have to say that compared to the big 3, the Tacoma is very utilitarian.
It is a truck, rides like a truck and gets MPG like a truck.

However I think that it could be improved upon to make it more beefy as a truck.
If its going for the 100% truck feel and ownership experience then make it have even more utility and usefulness as a truck.

1-Brakes. They need an upgrade for sure.
2-Rear suspension shackle set up. The inverted design is just to easily damaged if you use the truck off road.
3-Composite/plastic bed. I am a fan of metal beds on trucks. I always thought the bed, bed sides and whole cargo area was weak.
4-Range. Needs either a way to improve the MPG or just more fuel capacity.
5-Seats. Just a little more support would be nice. Doesn't have to be leather Cadillac style but some bolstering and cushion would go a long way.
6-Get away from the fully electronic 4wd system. I really hate that about the current Tacoma. Of all the things Id like to take away from the HiLux that manual t-case is the most wanted. Even over the diesel engine.

I'm sure there is more I'm forgetting but this is a good start for the next gen truck.
Ok Toyota I hope your reading this....

Any of these trucks including the L200 Mitsu would be fine by me :wings:

 

[Clutch]

I agree with many points here. I have to say that compared to the big 3, the Tacoma is very utilitarian.
It is a truck, rides like a truck and gets MPG like a truck.

The big 3 have commercial versions of their trucks, which can be had with manual windows, vinyl seats, rubber flooring. The only thing the Tacoma has on the big 3 is a manual transmission. I am comparing their 4WD 1/2 ton trucks with the 4WD Tacoma, since the Taco is about the same price and fetches about the same mpg (actually it fairs a little less in the mpg department with 4WD, with less power to boot, yea!) Maybe if the Tacoma was $10K less and achieved outstanding fuel economy I wouldn't compare it to the half tons...but it doesn't.



IIRC, the regular cab, 4 cyl Taco is the only model with hand crank windows...no vinyl seating or flooring. Want a access cab, double cab, or V6, the manual windows go away. So I would say the Big 3 commercial offerings are more utilitarian. Which are darn near the same price as a Taco, heck even the Nissan Frontier is more inexpensive and has a more powerful engine rated at 260hp/280tq. Toyota needs to work on power and efficiency, which they already have in other models...kinda hard to see why doesn't Toyota throw it at the Tacoma. WTH, Toyota!?

Toyota has loyalty going for it, I am guessing that is going to fade if they don't step it up. Ram 1500 diesel is here this fall (might be the goldilocks of light duty trucks) GM has a diesel Colorado coming, rumors of Ford bringing the diesel Ranger, or they might slip that diesel in the F150 (more likely).

They shouldn't rest on their laurels too long.

 

[zolo]

Yeah I understand what your saying. I guess the big 3 comparison was a bit off. I look at the Tacoma as coming from the very utility based back ground.
SO the fact that is rides like a truck and get MPG like a truck seems to be a normal attribute of a truck.

I'm not so quick to condemn Toyota for not changing a good thing just yet. Its been a good seller and a reliable drive train.
But there could always be improvement.
I personally think the electric 4wd system is the worst thing the Tacoma has going for it. I realize going to a manual t-case is going backwards at this point but for me it would be an improvement.

Range through MPG gain would be a welcome sight also. In reality it is my first desire for the new truck.

 

[Clutch]

Yeah I understand what your saying. I guess the big 3 comparison was a bit off. I look at the Tacoma as coming from the very utility based back ground.
SO the fact that is rides like a truck and get MPG like a truck seems to be a normal attribute of a truck.

I'm not so quick to condemn Toyota for not changing a good thing just yet. Its been a good seller and a reliable drive train.
But there could always be improvement.
I personally think the electric 4wd system is the worst thing the Tacoma has going for it. I realize going to a manual t-case is going backwards at this point but for me it would be an improvement.

Range through MPG gain would be a welcome sight also. In reality it is my first desire for the new truck.

It has been an "OK" seller....compared to how many half tons the Big 3 sells.

Yes, the Tacoma is a great truck, it is getting a bit long in the tooth though.

Manual T-Case isn't a deal breaker for me, we are ok with e-lockers...don't see why a electronic t-case would be
any different. I like power windows too. I have had many vehicles with manual windows...I love the button...so nice
NOT to lean over and crank down the passenger window.

Still can get a manual t-case in the Big 3 trucks...yet no manny trans, (damn you big 3! )

Manual trans is pretty big deal for me, that is main reason keeping me out of a half ton, I might have to give it up...however
a NV4500 will slip into a Chevy without too much drama. So maybe not all is lost.

Yes, range and fuel economy is up there. Those new Chevy's have great power and efficiency. The 5.3L V8 (355hp/383lb-ft) and the 6.2 (420hp/450tq!!!) will fetch over 20 mpg hwy. Even their 4.3 V6 (285hp/305tq) smokes Toyota's paltry 236hp/266tq 4.0....why have less power and the same (maybe a little) less fuel economy?

I have owned Toyotas for over 25 years now...I am looking elsewhere though for my next truck. It might be a Chevy, or a Nissan Frontier.

 

[zolo]

It has been an "OK" seller....compared to how many half tons the Big 3 sells.

Yes, the Tacoma is a great truck, it is getting a bit long in the tooth though.

Manual T-Case isn't a deal breaker for me, we are ok with e-lockers...don't see why a electronic t-case would be
any different.

I agree its time for a change. I like the idea of sharing the Hilux platform, and possibly some engine choices. I don't see that as very likely though.

I suppose I'm against the electric t-case because mine failed. Its way more complicated that the rear electric locker and it works in conjunction with the front diff actuator so its not as simple as the locker is. They tend to have problems and many times its to do with the front diff actuator but in my case the t-case motor failed. It is a pain to deal with when your stuck in low range in the woods.

Just sayin..

 

[Clutch]

I agree its time for a change. I like the idea of sharing the Hilux platform, and possibly some engine choices. I don't see that as very likely though.

Toyota seems to be fixated on Hybrids, I would guess we would see a hybrid Tacoma before they dropped a diesel in it. Heck they won't even drop in the 4.0 gasser
that the FJ and 4Runner receives.

They do have a diesel-hydrid in their Hino trucks though.

I suppose I'm against the electric t-case because mine failed. Its way more complicated that the rear electric locker and it works in conjunction with the front diff actuator so its not as simple as the locker is. They tend to have problems and many times its to do with the front diff actuator but in my case the t-case motor failed. It is a pain to deal with when your stuck in low range in the woods.

Just sayin..

Oh, I do like levers over switches too. But not an absolute deal breaker for me....far more "flaws" in the current Tacoma other than E-Transfer case that keeps me away. It needs to go back to being a cheap basic 4WD mini-truck....or step up capacity, power, and efficiency for the price it commands. Nissan Frontiers come in $5,000 less, with comparable models...with a more powerful V6 engine.

http://www.nissanusa.com/buildyournissan/variant/index

They aren't bad looking either.




I do wonder if it is just the name of Toyota that sells vehicles, cause the specs don't look that great....

 

[DaveInDenver]

I'm no fan of the electronic t-cases for the same reason as zolo, had one fail in a Ranger which was one of many less-than-well built features of that truck that made me jump ship to Toyota in the first place. IMHO they add complexity where none is required nor is it really an improvement that demands the complexity.

Electronic lockers are an improvement, or least a wash, because selectable lockers do have a qualifiable advantage over auto lockers and the alternatives using air or cables do not have a clear advantage. So while it's more to fail the added maintenance and failure chances are worth it to me. Plus in the case of the Toyota locker you can use hand tools in a pinch if the motor fails or convert them to cables. Replacing the e-shifter on the transfer is AFAIK not as simple.

Electronic t-case shifters main reason for existence to make interior designer's jobs easier, they offer no functional improvement. So that is why they are unnecessary in my estimation.

I think it's important to qualify that I think Toyota needs to make a low buck utility version of the XtraCab 4x4 Tacoma. You can get fleet-like Tacos in regular cabs and 4x2, but the 4x4 version usually end up with all sorts of convenience stuff that I don't find useful. But it's almost impossible to describe my ideal truck. I say I want a basic truck and the truck I bought used in 2000 started as a DLX with a bench seat and AM/FM radio but now sports 4Runner buckets, a center console (Tuffy), decent Alpine radio, and a few gadgets, etc.

So the truth of the matter is I would buy a base 4x4 Tacoma XtraCab with proper manual shift driveline, crank windows but with decent buckets and a reasonably OK radio. The one thing I really wish we could still get is vinyl floors, my truck's carpet is in terrible shape. It might be easier if Toyota allowed one to delete items like keyless entry and Bluetooth junk.

I also disagree that the Tacoma needs to be changed just because it needs to be changed. Toyota does fine with 25 year model runs of utility Land Cruisers. I'd buy a brand new version of my truck in a heart beat with improvements where they make sense. Like better engines or suspension (although I do not dislike either the 22R-E or the Hi-Trac torsion IFS all /that/ much). IOW, I think they nailed the Hilux in the generation or two after mine. The 3RZ-FE and coil spring IFS (or live axle optionally!).

 

[Clutch]

Yeah, I agree Toyota needs a basic 4WD Access/Double Cab version. You have to get a SR5 model...with a bunch of BS "upgrades".

What I want is 280hp/300tq gas engine, that flirts with 25 mpg hwy, or a diesel with 30 mpg hwy, manual trans & t-case, rubber flooring, cloth bucket seats, power windows, AC, 1800-2000 lbs pay load, 7000 lbs. towing, coil sprung IFS. All for $25K.

I don't even need a radio "per-say"....my iPod/amp or smart phone with Pandora works great, I can't stand regular radio, bleh....

I keep on looking at the new Tacomas, while I do like they size of them, I just can't bring myself to lay down the money for one. They really don't
do anything better for what I already have (maybe they are a little worse in some areas)....and I think there are far better options out there, even if those options aren't perfect either.

 

[DaveInDenver]

So Toyota would sell at least two of them, eh Kermit? We are 0.001% of the market, we demand satisfaction.

 

[Clutch]

So Toyota would sell at least two of them, eh Kermit? We are 0.001% of the market, we demand satisfaction.

At least! LOL

 

[NorthernWoodsman]

View attachment 169253

I agree that the Hilux is the better looking of the two trucks these days. I've seen one in person and I definitely liked it better. It was smaller which is a plus for me as I just do not need a big truck. I like 'em, I just don't need one. And the one in the photo has the look of early '80's trucks with that bed and lettering in the tailgate. The smaller size with the right motor (ahem, diesel) would net 25-30 mpg hwy I think.

So Toyota would sell at least two of them, eh Kermit? We are 0.001% of the market, we demand satisfaction.

Add me in to that equation. With three of us, how can they resist? I have considered under what conditions I might be willing to buy a new vehicle. So far, none. A Hilux that was bare bones with rubber flooring, manual windows/seats/trans, manual t-case, no radio, diesel, or very fuel efficient and powerful 4-cyl., a metal bed...yes, I might be tempted then. I don't need bells and whistles. Again, I like 'em, but I don't need them. Oh, and maybe a less Camry-esque grill.

 

[old1959]

As an owner of 2005 DC Tundra with 110k miles on it I want to buy a new truck. However, I don't want another full size truck since the kids are grown and gone plus I want something a little easier to manuver/park along with better gas mileage. I prefer a Toyota since I have bought several over the years and have had good service from them so what do I buy? A new Tundra which came out in 2007? No, the truck is huge plus a gas hog. Or, better yet, a new Tacoma which came out in 2005? No, for less money I can get a Ford F150 with more features, etc. Not to mention, I don't want a Ford F150...

The story is the same for Honda and Nissan. The only manufacturers which have designed something new has been the big 3. The Japanese manufacturers, not just Toyota, have fallen way behind in providing competitive trucks. This is dumb. And so I continue to drive my truck.