The 2drx4 build, a Cherokee.
- Thread starter 2drx4
- Start date
Well, I wasn't going to give you an update until I got to a point that I felt I was actually making forewards progress.
But, I will.
Anyways, following the incident with my reshaping of the wheelwells, I tried a few different things and wasn't totally happy. I decided I would cut the entire existing wheel well out and build a new one. Unfortuantly, I discovered the front of the existing wheel wells was rather soft. The rust had got it fairly bad there (typical). Also, there was a few holes behind the crossbrace in the floor in front of the wheelwells. This is fairly typical.
Unfortunatly, the leaf spring pockets were both pretty trashed as they are in this area, and I cut the floor off the top of the uniframe and found some serious rust on the inside. Outside it looked FINE. So, I spent a lot of time debating if I should just patch it back up and run it, find another chassis, build another comanche instead, or do something really stupid and different.
I chose 'stupid and different'.
The first thing was to strip the rest of the interior and such. Then remove the tcase. I didn't use the method recommended in the FSM, but it saved me from working on my back. The tcase turned out to have some issues when I pulled it, and will need rebuilding. Not that I had planned to actually use this case.
Pulled all the wiring out and everything off that comes off... I left the rear windows because they scare me - but they do need to come out. I'm not sure what the best way to do them without breaking them is. I'm not much of a glass guy.
I pulled the engine and tranny. The AX-15 won't go back in. I will use my AW4 with my manual controller - but I will look for a TCU so I can use it in automatic too. Don't rig your hoist like I did.
Pushed the carcass out and spun it around in the driveway (which isn't flat... That made things hard)
Then things got interesting.
I cut out most of the floor/uniframe in the mid section too, but did not take a picture. The rear area will need to be cut out, but it might be a hair more tricky.
So, I imagine by now everyone is either fairly confused, or has written me off as being certifiable (which I may well be).
But there is a plan here. Or at least a vauge idea of one. I decided that I should just build a new 'frame'. Ambitious, yes. Stupid, probably. But it will work.
The majority of the new frame will be 2x4x.188 HSS, which is good match to the uniframe rails' dimensions in the engine bay. However, the belly section is more like 3x3 on an XJ. So, I will raise the floor 1" but keep the bottom of the framerail in a comparably similar location to stock. I will also build the new frame about 2" wider (outside, 4" inside) than the old one to provide more clearance for the exhaust and all the other doohickies that have to get crammed under there. In the rear, I'm planning to go slightly wider than stock again, with the intention of allowing a little more space for a gas tank.
The axles are going to be different... I bought a couple little gems. And the suspension will change a bunch, since I've already go it all apart.
I could get more into the actual technical aspect of how I plan to do this if anyone cares.
So, yeah, never let me near your cherokee.
But, I will.
Anyways, following the incident with my reshaping of the wheelwells, I tried a few different things and wasn't totally happy. I decided I would cut the entire existing wheel well out and build a new one. Unfortuantly, I discovered the front of the existing wheel wells was rather soft. The rust had got it fairly bad there (typical). Also, there was a few holes behind the crossbrace in the floor in front of the wheelwells. This is fairly typical.
Unfortunatly, the leaf spring pockets were both pretty trashed as they are in this area, and I cut the floor off the top of the uniframe and found some serious rust on the inside. Outside it looked FINE. So, I spent a lot of time debating if I should just patch it back up and run it, find another chassis, build another comanche instead, or do something really stupid and different.
I chose 'stupid and different'.
The first thing was to strip the rest of the interior and such. Then remove the tcase. I didn't use the method recommended in the FSM, but it saved me from working on my back. The tcase turned out to have some issues when I pulled it, and will need rebuilding. Not that I had planned to actually use this case.
Pulled all the wiring out and everything off that comes off... I left the rear windows because they scare me - but they do need to come out. I'm not sure what the best way to do them without breaking them is. I'm not much of a glass guy.
I pulled the engine and tranny. The AX-15 won't go back in. I will use my AW4 with my manual controller - but I will look for a TCU so I can use it in automatic too. Don't rig your hoist like I did.
Pushed the carcass out and spun it around in the driveway (which isn't flat... That made things hard)
Then things got interesting.
I cut out most of the floor/uniframe in the mid section too, but did not take a picture. The rear area will need to be cut out, but it might be a hair more tricky.
So, I imagine by now everyone is either fairly confused, or has written me off as being certifiable (which I may well be).
But there is a plan here. Or at least a vauge idea of one. I decided that I should just build a new 'frame'. Ambitious, yes. Stupid, probably. But it will work.
The majority of the new frame will be 2x4x.188 HSS, which is good match to the uniframe rails' dimensions in the engine bay. However, the belly section is more like 3x3 on an XJ. So, I will raise the floor 1" but keep the bottom of the framerail in a comparably similar location to stock. I will also build the new frame about 2" wider (outside, 4" inside) than the old one to provide more clearance for the exhaust and all the other doohickies that have to get crammed under there. In the rear, I'm planning to go slightly wider than stock again, with the intention of allowing a little more space for a gas tank.
The axles are going to be different... I bought a couple little gems. And the suspension will change a bunch, since I've already go it all apart.
I could get more into the actual technical aspect of how I plan to do this if anyone cares.
So, yeah, never let me near your cherokee.
XXXpedition
Explorer
awesome build!!!
i love the rocker rails!
now i'm getting really curious...
keep it coming
i love the rocker rails!
now i'm getting really curious...
keep it coming
Root Moose
Expedition Leader
Doesn't look like anything particularly radical happening in your build.
If you haven't already, check out the advanced fabrication section at Naxja.org. There are a number of front frame builds there. Some really quite nice, others... not so much. : ) Would be a good place to get/steal some ideas.
If you haven't already, check out the advanced fabrication section at Naxja.org. There are a number of front frame builds there. Some really quite nice, others... not so much. : ) Would be a good place to get/steal some ideas.
02TahoeMD
Explorer
Two favorite things so far that I have read:
"Swearing.Lots of swearing" (boy, I can identify with that)
And, "I dont know what I am doing"
I think you may be lying to us just a little bit. I see a creative fabricator hard at work in this build. I really look forward to seeing what you do with her! (regardless if you change directions multiple times during the build) Keep up the work, I will be watching this thread.....
"Swearing.Lots of swearing" (boy, I can identify with that)
And, "I dont know what I am doing"
I think you may be lying to us just a little bit. I see a creative fabricator hard at work in this build. I really look forward to seeing what you do with her! (regardless if you change directions multiple times during the build) Keep up the work, I will be watching this thread.....
Root Moose said:Doesn't look like anything particularly radical happening in your build.
If you haven't already, check out the advanced fabrication section at Naxja.org. There are a number of front frame builds there. Some really quite nice, others... not so much. : ) Would be a good place to get/steal some ideas.
Yup. I read those. The 'not so nice one' is on pirate too, I tried to give him some advice but gave up. I'm fairly confident that nobody has done what I plan to do, though. Save maybe jbhill, who put a MJ cab onto a S-10 frame to do a body-dropped mini-truck. Which really isn't the same thing, but I'll give him credit.
stumptaco said:
Well... The fact that I decided to build a new frame has changed every aspect of the build.
Axles are still 'up in the air' at this point. But I have a 93~ F350 high-pinion D60 that I want to use for the front. It has ball joints, but not unitized hubs. I feel alright about that, the ball-joints are plenty strong but get a bad rap because people thing they're the same as D44 ones (not even close). I actually think the unitized hubs might be better for what I plan to do, since they're sealed considerably better than the servicable bearings. Anyways, I won't dwell on it too much. I plan to take about 5" out of the axle, as it is (IIRC) 69" wide now. 64" is about as wide as I can go with a D60 and still run the coil buckets in their stock location. I think I need to take about 2" out of the short side and 3" out of the long side to keep the driveshaft in a cozy place, but I need to do a bunch more measuring for that. I will be running 35spline outers, and I'm about 95% certain I will just go with 4340 axleshafts since I need custom inners anyways. I haven't decided which u-joints to use yet... And I'm torn between running drive flanges and just pulling them or actually running selectable hubs. The hubs cost a little more, and there's more things to break. But pulling flanges when it's cold/raining is kinda a pain. There will be an ARB stuck in there too. With 35" tires I think this setup will be absurdly bombproof.
Rear axle is a toss-up. I have a sterling 10.25 out of the same f-350. But. I also have a second HP D60 out of another F-truck. It is only a bare housing. I've tossed around the idea for a long time of building it into a HP D60 rear. The plan on that is to cut the spindles off the sterling rear and weld them onto the 60. The short side tube on the D60 has to come out - but that's actually fairly easy as I already took the plug welds out with a torch and a carbide burr. It should just be a matter of pressing it out now (we'll see). Then I can press a new tube in that is long enough to work. I will probably need to build an alignment bar for when I weld the spindles on, but I might just align them to the axletubes with a little machining and a press fit (not the best way). Again, I'd need custom shafts, but 35 spline chromo rear shafts are 'cheap'. An ARB would also go in here, I do think. I also need to convert it to disk brakes - I hate drums. Again, I think this will be fairly bombproof with 35s. The HP gearset is at a slight disadvantage in the rear, but the comp guys are running a LOT larger tires and a lot more power to them than I will, and they seem to keep them decently alive. The only consideration on that is that I will weigh a lot more than they will. However, I'm still not worried with 35s.
I'll probably run 16" rims just because I can then run the 1-ton front brakes. Besides, 16s are pretty balin' for me.
And I don't know if I want to run a NP231. It's an okay case, I've seen them live under abuse. But, breaking one on the trail is almost certain game-over. Stak makes a nice D300 case that would probably work for me, but it's a very expensive option. Also, it will make my front driveshaft about 5" shorter, which might not be a good thing. I'll never run a NP205. The NV241OR (rubicon) case might be okay, but I doubt I can find one here... This is an aspect I really have to think about.
Powerplant will still be a regular ol' Renix 4.0. They work well if they are actually cared for. I have a line on a really cheap HO head/intake/exhaust which I will probably pick up but may or may not use. I don't really feel like tearing into the engine at this point; I'd rather just put it back in and get it going so I can sort out all the other bugs.
Anyways, I just want a reliable but decently capable rig that I can drive on the highway to the area I want to explore. I figure if I can go 2 or 3 days without needing to resupply that would be fine. We'll see how that works out.
A road like this just begs me. Where does it go?
So... Did something.
Got the shell mostly gutted. Enough for now, I think. I left some peices that need to be removed as they aren't really going to be in the way for now. And I levelled it out decently. The rear is a sagging a hair (about 1/8"), but that shouldn't matter.
And my small collection of 1-tons + a D30 and some christmas lights. I have a 14B FF too, but I haven't picked it up yet.
I'm fairly close to being able to start on my frame rails, I think. I can't buy steel tomorrow, so I think I might try BSing with my NP241 and see if it will adapt to the AW4.
Got the shell mostly gutted. Enough for now, I think. I left some peices that need to be removed as they aren't really going to be in the way for now. And I levelled it out decently. The rear is a sagging a hair (about 1/8"), but that shouldn't matter.
And my small collection of 1-tons + a D30 and some christmas lights. I have a 14B FF too, but I haven't picked it up yet.
I'm fairly close to being able to start on my frame rails, I think. I can't buy steel tomorrow, so I think I might try BSing with my NP241 and see if it will adapt to the AW4.
XXXpedition
Explorer
istart to wonder why you started with an actual rig :sombrero:
why not start with some steel tubes and sheet metal
why not start with some steel tubes and sheet metal
Root Moose
Expedition Leader
You REALLY need to figure out how to incorporate those Christmas lights into the build.
;D
;D
Root Moose
Expedition Leader
Oh, BTW, please share what you find out about this. I want to adapt a NV242J to my 700R4 for the YJ - basically doing the inverse. If it is just a matter of swapping input gears then let's talk.
I'd rather come up with something homebrew instead of paying $500+ dollars for some adapter.My gut says it's not possible but you never know.