The Status of Overlanding Today

[Jupiter58]

@Oscar Mike Gulf Yankee

Remote? Yes. My idea of remote eliminates 95% or more of the people calling car camping etc overlanding.
Some folks idea of remote is a rutted blm road where they can drag their glamper.
Totally different views of ‘overlanding’

I don’t believe there are ‘thousands’ going to the areas I am referring to. Yes, there are many more now in this latest craze.
Again, America is an anomaly as we have an enormous (compared to other countries) subculture of rock crawlers and extremely capable vehicles and the areas to use them.
That is my view and it is why I have a wrangler. Small enough and capable enough to go pretty much anywhere. That eliminates a lot of the other groups.
I enjoyed remote and difficult adventuring on dual sports (solo) and the way I look at my wrangler is I can get to most of the same places with more comfort and safety.

 

[Av8Chuck]

Remote? Yes. My idea of remote eliminates 95% or more of the people calling car camping etc overlanding.
Some folks idea of remote is a rutted blm road where they can drag their glamper.
Totally different views of ‘overlanding’

I don’t believe there are ‘thousands’ going to the areas I am referring to. Yes, there are many more now in this latest craze.
Again, America is an anomaly as we have an enormous (compared to other countries) subculture of rock crawlers and extremely capable vehicles and the areas to use them.

I think this is right. Homeless people who look to vehicles as affordable or alternative housing tend to stay close to city centers. Some are certainly venturing out more but in the wilderness it's way more difficult to get food or money. Most are parking in, or on the outskirts, of neighborhoods that are in political districts where homelessness is on the margins and local or state government are unwilling or incapable of addressing this complicated issue. But I think on the National (or federal) level these types of homelessness issues are a very small percentage of the overlanding community even though a significant percentage of overlands can be considered homeless.

Just in case anyone is interested, I am the CEO of an Industrial Inspection company, - https://aerialalchemy.com/ - In an effort to mitigate wildfires caused by utilities we've been inspecting the western US for almost a decade. We continually come across homeless encampments, most are family oriented trying to survive in a safer environment. I'm not aware of many of these encampments starting major wildfires. I'm not saying these encampments don't represent serious risk to the National Parks, but I do believe overall its a very small risk. Is there a possibility the government will take a zero tolerance approach? Sure, we just shut the country down because of a disease with about a 1% mortality rate. However, this is why it's important to define overlanding and its relationship to camping, car camping and RVing for example because it could represent a significant, influential voting block.

 

[billiebob]

Stay-length limitations on public land also means moving regularly. So I move my rig over the land on a regular basis, typically looking for that sweet spot where no one is around

That says you are a boon docker.

Overlanders tend to be in constant motion, they have goals, destinations to reach and many include breaks in AirBnBs or hotels on route,

Boondockers are just hiding from reality.

 

[MiamiC70]

Just watching some YouTube “Expo” videos this morning. I have to say between the YouTube paid shills (I mean (“influencers”), the vendot’s pushing the lates “must have” overpriced crap and the myriad of rich **************** Overlanding is just another marketing scam. Seriously, how much crap do you need to go ************** camping? Rigs that cost more than a house. Drones, cameras, enough electrical and lighting to power a small tow, air conditioning, hot showers, full kitchens, gourmet cooking and coffee enough tools and fab equipment to build another rig on trail yet 95% of the time these clowns are close enough to call AAA.

I find myself caring less and less about Overlanding, YouTube, even these forums. I’m over it.

 

[Anti-lander]

Just watching some YouTube “Expo” videos this morning. I have to say between the YouTube paid shills (I mean (“influencers”), the vendot’s pushing the lates “must have” overpriced crap and the myriad of rich **************** Overlanding is just another marketing scam. Seriously, how much crap do you need to go ************** camping? Rigs that cost more than a house. Drones, cameras, enough electrical and lighting to power a small tow, air conditioning, hot showers, full kitchens, gourmet cooking and coffee enough tools and fab equipment to build another rig on trail yet 95% of the time these clowns are close enough to call AAA.

I find myself caring less and less about Overlanding, YouTube, even these forums. I’m over it.

Me too but for the complete opposite of you, I'm sick of people with $3000 "cars" thinking the people with "$100,000" trucks aren't out in the wild. Well yall don't see us because your in cars that can't go where we go because your in a $3000 that's usually a 2wd.
Also tired of people acting like forrest roads are offroading I mean good lord it has road right in the name.
I can care less about if camping gear is expensive or not that is up to your comfort level, I'm happy with just my $100,000 truck and my guide gear truck bed tent and a sleeping bag, heck I'm probably as against the glamping gear as you are but that's likely where our similarities end.

Maybe you need to look for a better job or more income so that a $100k truck don't seem so expensive to you. This seems to be a regular argument, guess what these super built trucks are why overlanding got popular to begin with.

Between the dads in ASICS, the tactical neckbeards, tree huggers and generaly liberal people overlanding has become too diverse.
Now if you have a lawnmower with a backpack you overlanding.

 

[dogbite]

Me too but for the complete opposite of you, I'm sick of people with $3000 "cars" thinking the people with "$100,000" trucks aren't out in the wild. Well yall don't see us because your in cars that can't go where we go because your in a $3000 that's usually a 2wd.
Also tired of people acting like forrest roads are offroading I mean good lord it has road right in the name.
I can care less about if camping gear is expensive or not that is up to your comfort level, I'm happy with just my $100,000 truck and my guide gear truck bed tent and a sleeping bag, heck I'm probably as against the glamping gear as you are but that's likely where our similarities end.

Maybe you need to look for a better job or more income so that a $100k truck don't seem so expensive to you. This seems to be a regular argument, guess what these super built trucks are why overlanding got popular to begin with.

Between the dads in ASICS, the tactical neckbeards, tree huggers and generaly liberal people overlanding has become too diverse.
Now if you have a lawnmower with a backpack you overlanding.

Offroad! Good lord it's right in the name!

 

[Jupiter58]

@Av8Chuck. That is a good point about homeless encampments. I have come across a few of the family style ones, just trying to survive. Felt like a scene that could have come from the depression. Very sad.
I do see the other types of encampments also. Obviously not families.
I have an irrational fear of dealing with them in the wilderness. Heck, I have a similar fear of tweakers in and around towns.

 

[billiebob]

I think this is right. Homeless people who look to vehicles as affordable or alternative housing tend to stay close to city centers. Some are certainly venturing out more but in the wilderness it's way more difficult to get food or money. Most are parking in, or on the outskirts, of neighborhoods that are in political districts where homelessness is on the margins and local or state government are unwilling or incapable of addressing this complicated issue. But I think on the National (or federal) level these types of homelessness issues are a very small percentage of the overlanding community even though a significant percentage of overlands can be considered homeless.

Just in case anyone is interested, I am the CEO of an Industrial Inspection company, - https://aerialalchemy.com/ - In an effort to mitigate wildfires caused by utilities we've been inspecting the western US for almost a decade. We continually come across homeless encampments, most are family oriented trying to survive in a safer environment. I'm not aware of many of these encampments starting major wildfires. I'm not saying these encampments don't represent serious risk to the National Parks, but I do believe overall its a very small risk. Is there a possibility the government will take a zero tolerance approach? Sure, we just shut the country down because of a disease with about a 1% mortality rate. However, this is why it's important to define overlanding and its relationship to camping, car camping and RVing for example because it could represent a significant, influential voting block.

My take is homeless are just trying to survive.

Boondockers squat on land by choice trying to dodge taxes of all forms while using public facilities and disregarding any regulations and moving on only after they have filled a site with garbage and dumped holding tanks in the ditch... or creek.

Overlanders who have sold it all to live out of a vehicle while touring or overlanding are usually doing fine financially and follow land use bylaws without question.

 

[Oscar Mike Gulf Yankee]

Well, after reading some comments I have an idea!

1. We establish our political clout by uniting in the "Overlanders of North America, Inc" A non profit political action organization. Of course, this will have membership dues (to be announced) to finance operations. And to do the following:

a. Define "overlanding" so that purposely equipped vehicles, that must be owned by members, define the activities that can be accomplished.

b. Promote the selected activities and advance our mission by influencing political actors with money, payoffs, bribes, gifts as well as any illicit matter or favor to gain their support, as is customary in the U.S.

c. Set aside public lands suitable for our traveling quests for (1) Our organization, (2) The general public after meeting qualifications to use public lands, and (3.) Ensure unqualified persons are strictly punished, by law, for trespass upon designated lands.

2. QUALIFICATIONS:

For individuals, including immediate family members, to qualify for land use each applicant must ;

a. Show proof of income by Federal Tax Returns, Schedule 1040 and/or attachments of Certified Financial Statements each year reflecting an income of at least 50% more than the average income for that metropolitan statistical area, and/or;

b. If retired, show a net worth, not counting motor vehicles or other personal property, sufficient to generate the income required in (a.) above, if invested at the average current 12 month T-Bill rate.

c. Under no circumstance shall any applicant be required to pay any certain amount of federal income taxes, tax documents are to verify an income level or ability to meet financial obligations as members.

c. Applicants must be able to recite the current specifications or ratings of the following;

(1) class of off road trails, specifically to define the degrees of difficulty of area trails; and

(2) define at least 4 vehicle classifications generally accepted as worthy overlanding vehicles; and

(3) must demonstrate good camp management and land use skills; and

(4) must demonstrate at least three types of vehicle recovery techniques utilizing a 5,000 or more pound winch.


The floor is now open for suggestions to make this organization a more viable entity to ensure proper land use by those deserving of member's exclusive use of public lands, as the organization may define such.

 

[Jay61]

I am 61 years old, make a heck of a decent living and looking forward to a fun filled retirement in a few years pursuing my little version of whatever this is we are talking about. It was the late 1990s before I had a vague understanding as to what the internet really was. I had been exposed to it in both college and grad school a decade before but due to its complicated nature, lack of content and expense for the general public to use, I went on with my life not thinking about it. I am saying this to point out my ideas about vehicles are long held and not internet inspired, they are from living life.

I am from the "small town" rural, deep south. In the 1970s when I was in high school the "car cultures" were very important. You could tell a lot about a person just by quick glance of their vehicle. I was a guy that loved to hunt, fish and camp while doing so. I was literally obsessed with it. My and my like minded friends' vehicles all reflected this obsession. Ford Broncos were probably the most sought after vehicle by my group with certain pickups being a second. All of our vehicles had gun racks with a few guns (even in the school parking lot nobody thought anything about it) Replacement bumpers, both front and rear, and with Broncos either a factory tailgate spare tire mount or a homemade one, many of the bumpers were homemade also. The trucks also utilized some type of tire mount that got it out from under the vehicle, because if you spend a lot of time in the woods you are going to shred it going over a shed antler or limb. Winches, no question, you had one. if it was not a pickup you had a roof rack. You had to have a CB, no cell phones back then. Our group had all the vehicles that had " dual gas tanks" which was a common option on certain four wheel drives especially Broncos, I do not think I knew anyone with a Bronco that did not have that option. They were all true four wheel drive with manual locking hubs and the standard transmission was the only way to go (push starting vehicles with dead batteries, the replacement bumpers were handy for that if another vehicle was with you). Tires, big monster mud tires were a joke to us, our tires were never over 35s, they were narrower than the average off road tire and they had the heaviest load rating we could find the closest tire today would be something like a KO2. Interestingly enough the pickup guys in our group had shell top campers, which were put on for camping/hunting trips. If the auto industry ever gets around to creating a true "overland" trim (I do not know how the hell the Jeep came up with its new "Overland" trim) the dual fuel tank is an option that needs to be included. Auto shop was probably the most popular elective class taught in school throughout the south for males, so we had a lot of really knowledgeable mechanics in our group who could answer any question we had and if they could not, the teacher would so every single aspect of our vehicles, especially dealing with function was gone over amongst us before the trigger was pulled on the mod. Function and utility was all we were concerned about. I can not emphasize too much how engrained our car culture was back then. When I saw the first photo of something called an "overland" vehicle on the internet my first thoughts leaped back to my high school car culture. This naturally shaped my thoughts on "overland'.

I do not know what overland means to most, nor do I care. To me, it is a good google search term. What I do know is the origin of most of the gear. Lets talk about RTTs which is a popular debate amongst us Americans. I was familiar with them a good 35 to 40 years before I saw one knowingly first hand, I attempted to acquire one in the early 90s before the days of google and even yahoo, my attempt was frustratingly unsuccessful. They hit the commercial market in the late 1950s (from Italy of all places) targeting certain groups, one was the American traveling public, this was before the Interstate Hwy System and cross country travel could be very trying with regards to motels, open gas stations at night, along with numerous other issues, but for whatever reason they did not catch on here. The other targeted market where they did take hold was called the "Adventure sport venturer" this was the Safari Crowd and the Explorers and simply due to circumstances those residents of the Australian Outback. In the Australian outback simply going to town for supplies for many could often be an adventure in and of itself, especially back then, due to lack of infrastructure in the outback. Plus camping and just plain going "walk about" is pretty much the only recreation always close at hand for those outback residents. The Australian outback and the African bush and veldt are over run with venomous snakes, spiders and scorpions and night time is when they come out to play and they do have a habit of sneaking into tents, and anything else left out overnight on the ground for that matter, because to them it seems like a good place to find food or hide as the sun is coming up . In Africa the lions and hyenas were known to sneak in to camp at night and grab person or two for a snack from time to time. The value of RTTs was immediately obvious to these people. RTTs are fast and easy to put up or take down, they free up a lot of internal storage space for the heavier items to be stored in the vehicle, and the most obvious reason, they keep you and whatever items like shoes and socks up off the ground all night long away from all those potentially dangers animals. Space is critical because you could not have too much fuel and water. Pretty much everything else to include storage, gear or whatever (there are some exceptions, but not many) evolved out of military surplus items that were improved upon design and construction wise and jumped on by local manufacturers, heck even the term "kit" is British military slang meaning required or necessary gear. There is a reason our little niche industry is heavily influenced by South African and Australian manufacturers like no other market in America. Want to really know what overlanding is, ask a South African or Australian. Think about it, in the Australian Out Back or the bush and veldt of Africa if you choose to travel over land as opposed to ship. plane or rail, you are talking about hundreds of miles on at best, unimproved trails with no gas stations nor anything else to include potable water. If you are going to need something, no matter what it is, you best have it in your vehicle. I strongly suspect the first common usage of the term overland and overlanding happened somewhere in the African Bush or Australian Outback and meant exactly that, traveling overland which is so far removed from what any American could possibly conceive.

My very first vehicle was a 1974 Bronco with front and rear replacement bumpers with a tire mount, a winch, a roof rack , overhead mounted CB with dual foldable antennas , rear side window gun rack and the duel fuel package, I got it when I was 16 years old through saving every single penny I made and help from my parents for my birthday. It was compact, very sturdy, with the rear seat removed huge amounts of internal storage and could get anywhere a true off road built vehicle could go. They were simple in design, no luxury, easy to repair and their suspensions were built with being heavy and off road in mind this meant heavy duty leaf springs and shocks. Ford originally designed them to compete with the Jeep market offering more internal storage space. They are the very first vehicle to actually be labeled and officially called a Sports Utility Vehicle which back then, actually meant that when you know Jeeps were in a category called Sports Vehicles. To be honest, when Americans are talking about overland vehicles, they are talking about what the original concept was for Sports Utility Vehicles however demographics were changing and in order to still have SUVs they had to be changed to some kind of suburban utility vehicle.

So yeah, I like the marketing and consumerism, that grows the market and when the market grows that leads to innovation. The older you get, anything that leads to added ease, comfort and time conservation to an activity you love will have a higher economic value. As for the social media/you-tube influencer issue, what kind of person wouldn't want to make a living by doing what they love to do that is a costly recreation to the rest of world? I imagine it is not easy to be successful at it, and kudos to those that get to live the dream getting paid to do it, whatever the dream is.

 

[AbleGuy]

“Auto shop was probably the most popular elective class taught in school throughout the south for males, so we had a lot of really knowledgeable mechanics in our group who could answer any question we had and if they could not, the teacher would so every single aspect of our vehicles”

?? x2 ⬆

It’s amazing how much this country has changed. Learning important, basic skills back then like those taught in the various shop classes was considered to add great value to our lives.

For many of us older members, more and more the US today doesn’t much resemble the simpler, better America we were priveledged to grow up in.

Our bewilderment caused by this is too difficult for younger folks to understand, and thus they generally don’t try to do so. Sadly, with each passing year our accumulated knowledge and experiences become more and more worthless to an increasingly lost and confused society. There are useful lessons to be learned here, but few seem to be listening.

 

[Todd780]

There are useful lessons to be learned here, but few seem to be listening.

Pardon? Sorry, did you say something?

 

[Jay61]

“Auto shop was probably the most popular elective class taught in school throughout the south for males, so we had a lot of really knowledgeable mechanics in our group who could answer any question we had and if they could not, the teacher would so every single aspect of our vehicles”

?? x2 ⬆

It’s amazing how much this country has changed. Learning important, basic skills back then like those taught in the various shop classes was considered to add great value to our lives.

For many of us older members, more and more the US today doesn’t much resemble the simpler, better America we were priveledged to grow up in.

Our bewilderment caused by this is too difficult for younger folks to understand, and thus they generally don’t try to do so. Sadly, with each passing year our accumulated knowledge and experiences become more and more worthless to an increasingly lost and confused society. There are useful lessons to be learned here, but few seem to be listening.

I was thinking the same thing as I wrote it. I debated about talking about two pieces of gear that never once would leave any of our vehicles but then I might have confused people. The good old logging chain, you could really snatch with that and the come-a-long that had more uses than anything out there today.

 

[billiebob]

The one piece of technology I might love would be a drone. Not so much for aero videos of my rig running a trail altho I do love those clips.... More for the ability to send a drone to scout out a logging road spur or find a route to the waters edge..... for recon you'd be hard pressed to beat a drone.

 

[billiebob]

That says you are a boon docker.

Overlanders tend to be in constant motion, they have goals, destinations to reach and many include breaks in AirBnBs or hotels on route,

Boondockers are just hiding from reality.

OVERLANDER.....
48 states, 365 days nuf said