Thinking about a Pause

[mvbeggs]

Regarding the suspension, I've looked at it carefully and talked to the engineers, in person, that designed it. I toured the Morryde factory. I talked the their spokesman about it. ...

Raspy,
I totally respect your opinions, but wow—that kind of access sounds next-level! Are you sure you’re not so close that you’ve got some biases going on? 😉

...
Morryde and Pause worked together very closely on various parts of the trailers to develop the Reboot and the Pause. Pause decided, going in, that the trailers would be completely US built. ...

I’m all for supporting US products- if they provide the best value, but we live in a global economy. Focusing only on 'Buy America' could be a bit short-sighted and risky if it means missing out on better ideas or materials from elsewhere. Hopefully, MORryde is balancing that by aiming for top-quality—I hope they succeed.

I do struggle a bit with the idea that MORryde- a multi faceted design and manufacturing company, building everything from trailer steps to trailer frames to now suspensions- can build a better suspension than a company whose sole focus has been perfecting suspensions for years. Time will tell.

.....They beat the heck out of the swing arm system in thorough testing on torture tracks....

I don’t doubt it, but even a few thousand hours on a torture track can’t compete with years of real-world abuse from actual users—that’s the ultimate torture track! At the end of the day, time’s the real judge.

...They came up with a system that has nearly 12" of travel and one in which the stub axles can be upgraded or replaced easily in the field if someone has a bearing failure that wipes out the spindle, wants to upgrade to 12" brakes or just bends a spindle from a severe impact. The Bilstein shocks, or equivalent are easy to get and not proprietary units from overseas, like Cruisemaster uses....

The amount of travel is impressive.

Also, can't disagree that CruiseMaster uses some proprietary parts, but as you have said, engineering involves compromises and the engineers have reasons for their design choices.

...To replace a stub axle, in the field, you can go to any trailer supply and get an axle of any length, simply hacksaw off 24" of it and bolt it in with simple tools, out in the desert if needed. Try that with Cruisemaster or Black Series or others.

Yeah, but if it doesn't break- I don't need to fix it.
Also, rarely do I carry extra axles with me. Still have to get to town for parts.
Also, that's why I'm dual axle guy, or in this case, 4 independent swingarm guy. Bust one, ratchet strap or secure the broken one, and limp it out of the back country.

...I like the Cruisemaster system too, but it is not made in the US and it is a proprietary system that can only be ordered from them, including the swingarms and the shocks. And everything Cruisemaster is very expensive. A set of bearings costs over $70. and takes time to get, whereas we can get Timken bearings for Morryde, that uses common bearings, and good seals, at NAPA or Amazon easier, for way less and quicker.

As I've mentioned, I have no problem with non-US-made parts if, in my opinion, they offer the best bang for the $'s.

I’m not sure about everything from Cruisemaster being pricey, but when it comes to bearings—even if they’re $140 instead of $70 a set—let’s be honest, if we're that worried about dollars, we probably should be rethinking our trailer purchases! 😄

As for lead times, you’re absolutely right—it’s always better to plan ahead. That’s why I carry a full set of the manufacturer’s replacement bearings with me, just in case!"

....We don't have to wait and see if they are well made.

We'll have to agree to disagree. Time WILL reveal the design and manufacturing flaws. It always does.

...It's better to look carefully at what it is and base any comments on real information.

Not sure if that was aimed at me, but hey, don’t hold back—feel free to call me out if you think I’m running low on 'real info'!

I'm also happy to admit that the Cruisemaster system is very good. It is a simple and elegant design. The bags are a different design than Morryde. The travel is less, but the clearance is better.

Finally! Agreement!

...But again, it has the disadvantages of being very expensive, harder to get, uses proprietary shocks and the whole piece must be replaced if we damage a spindle.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'very expensive,' but sometimes you really do get what you pay for—quality included! I’m genuinely impressed with the quality, fit, finish, support and design features that CruiseMaster offers. I’m more than happy to pay a premium for a proven premium product that comes with excellent manufacturer support.

As for replacing the entire swing arm due to spindle damage, I don't think that’s unusual. In fact, I see it as a sign of a robust design. For instance, my Adventure Trailer Chaser and Teardrop both had spindles welded into the swing arm, and if the spindle was damaged, the whole swing arm had to be replaced. Personally, I think a fully welded spindle is very strong and less prone to failure. The key, to me, is how difficult it is to swap out the swing arm if needed.

There are always compromises in engineering and always differing points of view on what is important.

Agreed. Everyone gets to vote with their $'s.

Raspy, to wrap up, I truly appreciate the time and effort you put into sharing your knowledge here, as well as on your Facebook pages. I really do value the information you provide. My comments are simply meant to provide a balanced/different viewpoint.

 

[Raspy]

Raspy,
I totally respect your opinions, but wow—that kind of access sounds next-level! Are you sure you’re not so close that you’ve got some biases going on? 😉


I’m all for supporting US products- if they provide the best value, but we live in a global economy. Focusing only on 'Buy America' could be a bit short-sighted and risky if it means missing out on better ideas or materials from elsewhere. Hopefully, MORryde is balancing that by aiming for top-quality—I hope they succeed.

I do struggle a bit with the idea that MORryde- a multi faceted design and manufacturing company, building everything from trailer steps to trailer frames to now suspensions- can build a better suspension than a company whose sole focus has been perfecting suspensions for years. Time will tell.


I don’t doubt it, but even a few thousand hours on a torture track can’t compete with years of real-world abuse from actual users—that’s the ultimate torture track! At the end of the day, time’s the real judge.


The amount of travel is impressive.

Also, can't disagree that CruiseMaster uses some proprietary parts, but as you have said, engineering involves compromises and the engineers have reasons for their design choices.


Yeah, but if it doesn't break- I don't need to fix it.
Also, rarely do I carry extra axles with me. Still have to get to town for parts.
Also, that's why I'm dual axle guy, or in this case, 4 independent swingarm guy. Bust one, ratchet strap or secure the broken one, and limp it out of the back country.


As I've mentioned, I have no problem with non-US-made parts if, in my opinion, they offer the best bang for the $'s.

I’m not sure about everything from Cruisemaster being pricey, but when it comes to bearings—even if they’re $140 instead of $70 a set—let’s be honest, if we're that worried about dollars, we probably should be rethinking our trailer purchases! 😄

As for lead times, you’re absolutely right—it’s always better to plan ahead. That’s why I carry a full set of the manufacturer’s replacement bearings with me, just in case!"

We'll have to agree to disagree. Time WILL reveal the design and manufacturing flaws. It always does.


Not sure if that was aimed at me, but hey, don’t hold back—feel free to call me out if you think I’m running low on 'real info'!


Finally! Agreement!


I'm not sure what you mean by 'very expensive,' but sometimes you really do get what you pay for—quality included! I’m genuinely impressed with the quality, fit, finish, support and design features that CruiseMaster offers. I’m more than happy to pay a premium for a proven premium product that comes with excellent manufacturer support.

As for replacing the entire swing arm due to spindle damage, I don't think that’s unusual. In fact, I see it as a sign of a robust design. For instance, my Adventure Trailer Chaser and Teardrop both had spindles welded into the swing arm, and if the spindle was damaged, the whole swing arm had to be replaced. Personally, I think a fully welded spindle is very strong and less prone to failure. The key, to me, is how difficult it is to swap out the swing arm if needed.


Agreed. Everyone gets to vote with their $'s.

Raspy, to wrap up, I truly appreciate the time and effort you put into sharing your knowledge here, as well as on your Facebook pages. I really do value the information you provide. My comments are simply meant to provide a balanced/different viewpoint.

I definitely am not "too close" to Morryde or Pause to be influenced in some way that makes me excuse them. Quite the opposite. I challenged them face to face about various designs and pointed out deficiencies in the designs of the suspension and the Morryde articulating hitch. I am fortunate to have had the opportunity to meet the engineers, tour the factories, have some engineering knowledge and be willing to point out real world problems when I see them. I used those opportunities to challenge them, and point out how it could have been done better, but not as a way to help with their marketing or blindly support them. They either sheepishly agreed with my analysis, or explained why they did what they did. And as you've acknowledged, engineering is full of educated guesses and compromises. Often, right and wrong in engineering are judgements, not absolute values. Before you can downplay their testing, and imply that others are better because of a longer track record, you should compare actual testing and real world failures and post these numbers. Not just make the generic, "one is better because it's been around longer" argument. That is a false value assessment. I'm not saying the Morryde is perfect, just the opposite. They are imperfect, but very good, made in the US, have available parts, lots of suspension travel, did severe testing and have given real reasons to have faith in them. They fully intend to stand behind their system, without question. Anyone can go on a factory tour and converse with them. Try that in China. And again, I like Cruisemaster. I just don't like the prices, and proprietary parts that have to come from Australia. Black Series is hit and miss with their suspension and hitches. Some stuff is good and some is junk. The brakes are junk, the backing plate bolts rust, The shocks are junk, the bearings are installed incorrectly in too many cases, the alignment is almost never right and causes a lot of tire problems. Imperial with their Roamer 1 and X195 have terrible frames, that rust, can crack and do flex too much. This led to one suspension system failure the I know of, with the factory blaming the owner. The Cruisemaster suspension didn't fail, the frame failed and caused a problem with the suspension. One of the things I liked about m R1 was the Cruisemaster suspension. Probably the best feature of the whole trailer. Black Series hitches, the Polyblock, have almost all failed. I've seen piles of literally hundreds of them broken and being scrapped out. They don't care and don't want to improve. I've been to their assembly plant and talked to the owner about it. The first generation of Morryde articulating hitch was completely ridiculous and I made it very clear why it was. Then they improved it, but it is still not correctly done. I pointed out why to the engineer that designed it. I don't make excuses for poor designs, just because I might like the company or because I've toured the facility. Cruisemaster and McHitch are the two best hitches on the market. I had a Cruisemaster DO45 on my Roamer 1, but changed it to a Mchitch because the McHitch is much more user friendly and actually rated for more weight. Either will serve us well. The Morryde is not in the same category. It cannot be used upside down like the McHitch can, and neither can the Cruisemaster, this means it is harder to match the tongue height to the truck and clear the tailgate.

You may want to make the point that if something doesn't ever break, it never needs to be replaced, but one of the most common failures with trailers is wheel bearings. And when they fail, they likely ruin the spindle. The next thing is bending the spindle. No matter how well these are made, they are vulnerable to hitting something hard enough to bend, such as a parking lot bollard, a boulder on the trail, etc. It happens. If it does, I'd rather be able to fix it cheaply and easily in the field, than order expensive parts from the other side of the planet. Along with that ability we can change the weight rating of the axles and the size of the brakes, simply by bolting in a new 24" stub axle assembly. Or go to disk brakes. It's nice we have competition and different good products to choose from. And I try to be as fair as I can, with the least amount of bias, while being practical and after using this stuff myself.

 

[mvbeggs]

I definitely am not "too close" to Morryde or Pause to be influenced in some way that makes me excuse them. Quite the opposite. ....

Not saying you excuse them, but you appear very passionate and committed to a brand new design/product. Again, time and real world conditions are always the best test of a design.

Often, right and wrong in engineering are judgements, not absolute values. Before you can downplay their testing, and imply that others are better because of a longer track record, you should compare actual testing and real world failures and post these numbers. Not just make the generic, "one is better because it's been around longer" argument. That is a false value assessment.

Not downplaying their testing- in my opinion, testing on a track is not equivalent to hundreds of thousands of hours of real world units running down trails with some of the harshest back country trails. (i.e. Cruisemaster in Australia) You cannot argue that Cruisemaster is not a tried and tested suspension design. As far as I'm concerned, Cruisemaster is the "gold standard" to which most manufactures try to replicate. Isn't that why we now see more independent trailing arm suspensions? (Adventure Trailer started doing this 15 years ago.)

As far as I know, statistics regarding failures rates/modes are not typically published by private companies. I could turn your statement back to you. "Please provide MorRyde's statistical failure rates and modes of failure as well as those of their competitors- so we can truly evaluate their product vs the competition." (that was rhetorical and admittedly a bit snarky- sorry) I doubt that anyone has that data.

See, most of what you have provided, is simply, your opinion as well. That's what we do here, discuss and give our opinion(s).

I'm not saying the Morryde is perfect, just the opposite. They are imperfect, but very good, made in the US, have available parts, lots of suspension travel, did severe testing and have given real reasons to have faith in them.

Again, glad you have faith in them and found the trailer for you. In the past, I too have jumped in on what appeared as "the ultimate trailer design"- 4 times now and still look'n- but 90% there. I'm taking a "sit back and see" approach on this one- waiting to see how this one plays out. 🍿

They fully intend to stand behind their system, without question.

Time will tell and how do you know that with any certainty?

.....And again, I like Cruisemaster. I just don't like the prices, and proprietary parts that have to come from Australia.

I think we both are in agreement that Cruismaster makes a great product.

Personally, I don't have issues with the price of Crusiemaster parts especially when I consider the amount of support I get in the form of technical videos, documentation, development of specailty tools, engineering, etc. That all costs $'s. I'm happy to support a company that started and has been developing trailing arm suspensions for over 20 years.

... One of the things I liked about m R1 was the Cruisemaster suspension. Probably the best feature of the whole trailer.

Agreed. One of the main reasons I have an X195.

....The first generation of Morryde articulating hitch was completely ridiculous and I made it very clear why it was. Then they improved it, but it is still not correctly done.

One of the first things I saw on the Pause that turned me away.

....I had a Cruisemaster DO45 on my Roamer 1, but changed it to a Mchitch because the McHitch is much more user friendly and actually rated for more weight. Either will serve us well. The Morryde is not in the same category. It cannot be used upside down like the McHitch can, and neither can the Cruisemaster, this means it is harder to match the tongue height to the truck and clear the tailgate.

Aren't both the McHitch (4.5-tonne model) and the DO45 rated for 4.5 tonnes (10,000 lbs)?

From my experience, and as we've discussed in another thread, I used the McHitch on my HQ-19 for about two years. While hitching up was easy, I often faced challenges with it binding and not releasing on uneven ground—this happened about 80% of the time when unhitching in off-road/off-camber situations.

I understand you may sell the McHitch and/or represent the manufacturer, and I can see how its design would appeal to some users. However, for my needs, it didn’t work out. In contrast, the DO45 has been very reliable for me. It’s been easy to hitch and unhitch, even on uneven terrain, and I haven’t experienced any binding issues since switching.

Regarding hitch height adjustments, purchasing a different drop is a straightforward solution. While flipping the McHitch can provide about 2 inches of additional drop or rise, I personally didn’t find that adjustment to be a significant factor- although I ran my McHitch upside down on my HQ-19.

...You may want to make the point that if something doesn't ever break, it never needs to be replaced, but one of the most common failures with trailers is wheel bearings. And when they fail, they likely ruin the spindle. The next thing is bending the spindle. No matter how well these are made, they are vulnerable to hitting something hard enough to bend, such as a parking lot bollard, a boulder on the trail, etc. It happens. If it does, I'd rather be able to fix it cheaply and easily in the field, than order expensive parts from the other side of the planet.

I think I might have been misuderstood and it seems we might be confusing maintenance and repair. Over time and with enough use, everything will eventually wear out or fail.

Bearings, for example, can fail, but they don’t always result in catastrophic spindle damage. As we all know, proper maintenance plays a significant role in minimizing these kinds of issues.

Personally, I’m not as focused on these types of failures as you seem. In all the off-trail miles I’ve covered, I’ve only experienced one catastrophic bearing failure. It happened with my brand new '11 Adventure Trailer Chaser on its inital outing while approaching Ophir Pass. I noticed one of the trailer tires leaning excessively, so I stopped, found excessive play in the tire, removed the hub assembly, and found the Timken bearing had completely failed. Fortunately, there was no spindle damage. After 5 hours, with a 1.5-hour drive each way to get new bearings, races, and seals, I was back on the road. ( Lesson learned- I now carry several sets of replacment bearings with me.)

Since I started towing off-road trailers in '11, I haven’t bent any suspension components from hitting obstacles. (knock on wood) That’s not to say it can’t happen, but I tend to crawl on trails, especially with a 7,000-lb trailer in tow. The only failure I’ve seen resembling what you’re describing was in a YouTube video of Patriot Campers. They nearly sheared off the entire suspension while driving aggressively down a dirt road. Those guys don't hold back.

Along with that ability we can change the weight rating of the axles and the size of the brakes, simply by bolting in a new 24" stub axle assembly. Or go to disk brakes. It's nice we have competition and different good products to choose from.

Why would you want to? "Don't fix what ain't broke".
Surprising, I didn't realize Pause wasn't running disc brakes.

And I try to be as fair as I can, with the least amount of bias, while being practical and after using this stuff myself.

Raspy, you keep doin you! ;-)
Glad you're putting in the time to share your experience(s).

 

[Raspy]

Not saying you excuse them, but you appear very passionate and committed to a brand new design/product. Again, time and real world conditions are always the best test of a design.


Not downplaying their testing- in my opinion, testing on a track is not equivalent to hundreds of thousands of hours of real world units running down trails with some of the harshest back country trails. (i.e. Cruisemaster in Australia) You cannot argue that Cruisemaster is not a tried and tested suspension design. As far as I'm concerned, Cruisemaster is the "gold standard" to which most manufactures try to replicate. Isn't that why we now see more independent trailing arm suspensions? (Adventure Trailer started doing this 15 years ago.)

As far as I know, statistics regarding failures rates/modes are not typically published by private companies. I could turn your statement back to you. "Please provide MorRyde's statistical failure rates and modes of failure as well as those of their competitors- so we can truly evaluate their product vs the competition." (that was rhetorical and admittedly a bit snarky- sorry) I doubt that anyone has that data.

See, most of what you have provided, is simply, your opinion as well. That's what we do here, discuss and give our opinion(s).


Again, glad you have faith in them and found the trailer for you. In the past, I too have jumped in on what appeared as "the ultimate trailer design"- 4 times now and still look'n- but 90% there. I'm taking a "sit back and see" approach on this one- waiting to see how this one plays out. 🍿


Time will tell and how do you know that with any certainty?


I think we both are in agreement that Cruismaster makes a great product.

Personally, I don't have issues with the price of Crusiemaster parts especially when I consider the amount of support I get in the form of technical videos, documentation, development of specailty tools, engineering, etc. That all costs $'s. I'm happy to support a company that started and has been developing trailing arm suspensions for over 20 years.


Agreed. One of the main reasons I have an X195.


One of the first things I saw on the Pause that turned me away.


Aren't both the McHitch (4.5-tonne model) and the DO45 rated for 4.5 tonnes (10,000 lbs)?

From my experience, and as we've discussed in another thread, I used the McHitch on my HQ-19 for about two years. While hitching up was easy, I often faced challenges with it binding and not releasing on uneven ground—this happened about 80% of the time when unhitching in off-road/off-camber situations.

I understand you may sell the McHitch and/or represent the manufacturer, and I can see how its design would appeal to some users. However, for my needs, it didn’t work out. In contrast, the DO45 has been very reliable for me. It’s been easy to hitch and unhitch, even on uneven terrain, and I haven’t experienced any binding issues since switching.

Regarding hitch height adjustments, purchasing a different drop is a straightforward solution. While flipping the McHitch can provide about 2 inches of additional drop or rise, I personally didn’t find that adjustment to be a significant factor- although I ran my McHitch upside down on my HQ-19.



I think I might have been misuderstood and it seems we might be confusing maintenance and repair. Over time and with enough use, everything will eventually wear out or fail.

Bearings, for example, can fail, but they don’t always result in catastrophic spindle damage. As we all know, proper maintenance plays a significant role in minimizing these kinds of issues.

Personally, I’m not as focused on these types of failures as you seem. In all the off-trail miles I’ve covered, I’ve only experienced one catastrophic bearing failure. It happened with my brand new '11 Adventure Trailer Chaser on its inital outing while approaching Ophir Pass. I noticed one of the trailer tires leaning excessively, so I stopped, found excessive play in the tire, removed the hub assembly, and found the Timken bearing had completely failed. Fortunately, there was no spindle damage. After 5 hours, with a 1.5-hour drive each way to get new bearings, races, and seals, I was back on the road. ( Lesson learned- I now carry several sets of replacment bearings with me.)

Since I started towing off-road trailers in '11, I haven’t bent any suspension components from hitting obstacles. (knock on wood) That’s not to say it can’t happen, but I tend to crawl on trails, especially with a 7,000-lb trailer in tow. The only failure I’ve seen resembling what you’re describing was in a YouTube video of Patriot Campers. They nearly sheared off the entire suspension while driving aggressively down a dirt road. Those guys don't hold back.


Why would you want to? "Don't fix what ain't broke".
Surprising, I didn't realize Pause wasn't running disc brakes.


Raspy, you keep doin you! ;-)
Glad you're putting in the time to share your experience(s).

Since I'm not tied to any manufacturer, except McHitch, I don't feel obligated to blindly support any of them. You keep implying that I am biased against Crruisemaster and that somehow If I choose not to provide real world failure rates, which none of us have, or if you don't understand torture testing, it somehow proves your opinion that Cruisemaster is superior. A false argument. Just another opinion. We all have them. A typical arguing strategy is to dream up issues and play them as facts, or statistically relevant, if they suit your position. So, go ahead and argue that bearing failures are uncommon and don't hurt spindles. Argue that spindles don't get bent. And then argue that since Cruisemaster has been out longer, that they are easier to fix. Or provide some support for your opinion. Or just accept that both can be good at the same time.

So let me repeat. I do not care which system you use. I've had both and I like them both. They are different in ways that I do understand. Travel, serviceability, ease of repair, for instance. But let me repeat again, they are both fine, just different. And if you are buying an Imperial trailer, you get Cruisemaster. If you are buying a Pause or Reboot, you get Morryde. They are not interchangeable on either one. Since you are not familiar with the testing and development of the Morryde system, you seem to think that that means it's weak. It's not weak. And since it can be repaired much easier and much cheaper, with USA available parts, somehow that is a disadvantage. It's not. And not every trailer in Australia uses Cruisemaster. Who cares? I don't. There are a number of good systems. So what?

So, enjoy your Cruisemaster suspension. I thoroughly enjoyed mine on my Roamer 1. The reason I changed to a Reboot was because of the abysmal quality of the Roamer 1/X195. To put it bluntly, they are very poorly made and I can go into serious detail in case it's necessary. I can easily bridge the gap between opinion and fact on Imperial quality. I easily and unarguably invite you to challenge me on Imperial lack of quality, if you wish. But I won't argue against the Cruisemaster suspension on them. It is excellent, except for the minor issue of remote control glitches and the more serious issue of compressors that fall off from under the trailer and get lost or destroyed. My getting rid of my R1 had nothing to do with Cruisemaster. Nothing. It was about the other much more serious Imperial problems. I can supply you with a substantiated list if you are curious.

I didn't change because I wanted the Morryde suspension, I studied Morryde at the factory, with the engineers and decided it was worthy, with a couple of minor points I want them to consider.

I have to break this up into two posts.

 

[Raspy]

Since I'm not tied to any manufacturer, except McHitch, I don't feel obligated to blindly support any of them. You keep implying that I am biased against Crruisemaster and that somehow If I choose not to provide real world failure rates, which none of us have, or if you don't understand torture testing, it somehow proves your opinion that Cruisemaster is superior. A false argument. Just another opinion. We all have them. A typical arguing strategy is to dream up issues and play them as facts, or statistically relevant, if they suit your position. So, go ahead and argue that bearing failures are uncommon and don't hurt spindles. Argue that spindles don't get bent. And then argue that since Cruisemaster has been out longer, that they are easier to fix. Or provide some support for your opinion. Or just accept that both can be good at the same time.

So let me repeat. I do not care which system you use. I've had both and I like them both. They are different in ways that I do understand. Travel, serviceability, ease of repair, for instance. But let me repeat again, they are both fine, just different. And if you are buying an Imperial trailer, you get Cruisemaster. If you are buying a Pause or Reboot, you get Morryde. They are not interchangeable on either one. Since you are not familiar with the testing and development of the Morryde system, you seem to think that that means it's weak. It's not weak. And since it can be repaired much easier and much cheaper, with USA available parts, somehow that is a disadvantage. It's not. And not every trailer in Australia uses Cruisemaster. Who cares? I don't. There are a number of good systems. So what?

So, enjoy your Cruisemaster suspension. I thoroughly enjoyed mine on my Roamer 1. The reason I changed to a Reboot was because of the abysmal quality of the Roamer 1/X195. To put it bluntly, they are very poorly made and I can go into serious detail in case it's necessary. I can easily bridge the gap between opinion and fact on Imperial quality. I easily and unarguably invite you to challenge me on Imperial lack of quality, if you wish. But I won't argue against the Cruisemaster suspension on them. It is excellent, except for the minor issue of remote control glitches and the more serious issue of compressors that fall off from under the trailer and get lost or destroyed. My getting rid of my R1 had nothing to do with Cruisemaster. Nothing. It was about the other much more serious Imperial problems. I can supply you with a substantiated list if you are curious.

I didn't change because I wanted the Morryde suspension, I studied Morryde at the factory, with the engineers and decided it was worthy, with a couple of minor points I want them to consider.

I have to break this up into two posts.

Second part:

Next point about your opinion of the McHitch. And again, I don't care which hitch you use. Really, I don't. But denigrating it because you didn't understand how to use it is not the hitches problem. Trying to support a weak argument about Cruisemaster by including false information about McHitch, does not enhance your argument. They are two separate issues. You might do better by simply asking us how to lube your McHitch instead of arguing that something is wrong with it. But you do it your way. That's fine. And I will admit I'm biased. Yes I am. Based on years and many miles of using off-road trailers with different systems, letting the facts drive the decisions, and selecting McHitch because of its design and ease of use. I don't like them just because I sell them, I started selling them because I like them. I developed a relationship with the owner in Australia. I sold many at cost just to share them with fellow enthusiasts. And Since Black Series uses Hitches that almost all break, the Polyblock, we have put well over 1000 of them on Black Series trailers. Cruisemaster hitches are fine too. I'm capable of liking two things at once. But McHitch has two distinct advantages over Cruisemaster. One is ease of use, and the other is that McHitch works perfectly upside down, unlike Cruisemaster. So it can be mounted under the trailer tongue to better match the connection to the truck and to leave more room to open the tailgate. I don't have to be in that business, but I like them. I'm involved in the whole off-road scene and I do a lot of analysis of products and companies. I've used them on four of my own trailers for many thousands of miles, as have many friends who actually get out there and pull trailers as far into the wilderness as possible. My buddy, for example, snapped off a U joint and we had to winch him into a very precarious position on a steep rocky trail. We disconnected and re-connected the McHitch in that situation with no trouble. We've had to do it other times too, on narrow trails where we needed to turn around. It works fine if you understand how to do it. If you don't, I'm here to help. Simple as that. The hitches don't get stuck unless they are not lubricated over many miles. All they need is an occasional spray with Houdini, WD 40 or, some dry lube. We've sold nearly 2,000 of them. They are standard equipment on some trailers, like OBI, and we have dealers around the Country. Overwhelmingly, people tell me and write to me about how much they like them. I don't care which system you use. You can have your own opinions all you want. But when it comes to facts, try to do better. It is possible to like two things at once, without having to take sides and invent reasons why one is bad, in order to like the other. One of the best features of the Imperial trailers is the Cruisemaster suspension. If only the rest of the trailer was so good. But it's simply not. Pause and Reboot are much better trailers. And since they have Morryde suspension, that works very well, I'm happy. And BTW, my Reboot has a McHitch on it because that works much better than the Morryde hitch.

I think this discussion has run its course. You can stick with your opinion to hate Morryde and that's fine. They are both good, but 'll continue to actually compare, with facts, factory tours, discussions with engineers and by using them out on the trails over time, while getting feedback from other owners and trailer dealers. I'll continue to buy trailers and equipment with my own money, use them in the field and modify them. I never get any, or seek any sponsorship. I'll happily admit my preferences because they are based on real world use and analysis. I'm happy to see people using other products because I get to see why and dispel or reinforce my information. It helps me find better products, better companies and learn better methods. And I try to be as honest and accurate with my information as possible. Arguing that one is better based simply on imagined "facts" or invented data, is not valuable, except to the arguer trying to make a weak point.

Come on out and join the fun. You and I do have one thing in common, we both bought "premium" Imperial trailers. The R1 is just an X195 with some upgrades. I've moved on and I'm glad I did. I hope yours continues to serve you well. Over on Xplore Trailer Community, we have gone over many of the problems and how to deal with them, or what to watch out for. Preventive maintenance on them is important.

 

[mvbeggs]

Since I'm not tied to any manufacturer, except McHitch, I don't feel obligated to blindly support any of them. You keep implying that I am biased against Crruisemaster and that somehow If I choose not to provide real world failure rates, which none of us have, or if you don't understand torture testing, it somehow proves your opinion that Cruisemaster is superior. A false argument. Just another opinion. We all have them. A typical arguing strategy is to dream up issues and play them as facts, or statistically relevant, if they suit your position. So, go ahead and argue that bearing failures are uncommon and don't hurt spindles. Argue that spindles don't get bent. And then argue that since Cruisemaster has been out longer, that they are easier to fix. Or provide some support for your opinion. Or just accept that both can be good at the same time.

Raspy- Wow! I didn't say much of what you quoted me as saying:
I never said you were biased against Cruisemaster. I implied you might be biased toward Pause. That's ok, we all have our favorites.
You were the one that asked me for "failure rates". I simply said to you, what you said to me. I actually said that failure rate data is likely proprietary information and unavailable to us commoners.
I never said that "torture testing" proves that Cruisemaster is superior. I did say that Cruismaster has stood the test of time and is a proven suspension that most try to copy.
I never said bearing failures are "uncommon". I did say preventative bearing maintenance reduces the chance of failure.
I never "argued that spindles don't get bent". I did say, I thought they were not common. I know of only a handful. With that I questioned the emphasis and importance you place on being able to make a spindle replacement in the field. To each his own.
I never said "since Cruisemaster has been out longer, that they are easier to fix". I did say they have developed a few specialty tools and a ton of technical videos to help with maintenance and repairs. They do have great support.

My main point, that I was trying to make- but obviously failed to get across, is that the Pause's suspension is a brand new design that has not been proven in real world conditions and that it is simply an opinion/judgement/hypothesis of the adequacy of the design and how it will actually perform in the field.

.... Since you are not familiar with the testing and development of the Morryde system, you seem to think that that means it's weak. It's not weak.

Never said, nor implied, that they are weak. Again, just said the Moryde suspension is a new design/system that hasn't been proven in use.

Again, the point I was trying to make was; that running equipment over a "torture track" cannot possibly equal the amount of repetitions/cycles that 1000's of units have seen running down 1000's of hours through the real world. It's just simple math and the number of $'s and hours that a company can spend on physically running a unit across a track. Now if you're actually talking machine testing of components- that may be a different story.

And since it can be repaired much easier and much cheaper, with USA available parts, somehow that is a disadvantage.

Never said that either.

Who cares? I don't. There are a number of good systems. So what?

You do seem to care....just say'n.

So, enjoy your Cruisemaster suspension. I thoroughly enjoyed mine on my Roamer 1. The reason I changed to a Reboot was because of the abysmal quality of the Roamer 1/X195. To put it bluntly, they are very poorly made and I can go into serious detail in case it's necessary. I can easily bridge the gap between opinion and fact on Imperial quality. I easily and unarguably invite you to challenge me on Imperial lack of quality, if you wish. But I won't argue against the Cruisemaster suspension on them. It is excellent, except for the minor issue of remote control glitches and the more serious issue of compressors that fall off from under the trailer and get lost or destroyed. My getting rid of my R1 had nothing to do with Cruisemaster. Nothing. It was about the other much more serious Imperial problems. I can supply you with a substantiated list if you are curious.

John, you and I have had conversations on the Imperial product. As you know, I own one.
Please don't assume you are the only one with intimate knowledge/experience with Imperial trailers. There are other knowledgeable people on this forum.

"Quality"- that is a relative term. Imperial does not produce an inferior "quality" product. Is it perfect- no. Is it crap- no. What would you rather take in the field a Jayco, Sportsmen or your Roamer1. I think we both know.

To be fair, I have had very few issues with my X195. This scenario reminds me of when I owned my Black Series HQ-19. I heard lots of horror stories about Black Series failures. I never had any of the issues reported. Maybe, because mine was built before 2020. Who knows? Always been a mystery to me.

Funny you mention the air bag remotes om the Imperial. I had trouble with the AirBag man remote on my trailer as well. What was nice, is that it was taken care of with one call to the manufacture. They sent me everything I needed to make the repair at no charge- shipping included. Got the parts in about a week. No muss. no fuss.

Again, to be fair, we both know that the attachment of a compressor to the frame is a manufacture issue and not an Airbag Man or Cruisemaster issue. The compressor attachment is one of those design details that gets exposed from real world use. Mine has not fallen off, but a couple of fender washers under the nuts secures the compressor.

....I have to break this up into two....

Removing most of what I didn't say from your response, you might have gotten this into one post. but hey, no prob.
Admire your passion for this kind of stuff! Keep it com'n!

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

Raspy- Wow! I didn't say much of what you quoted me as saying:
I never said you were biased against Cruisemaster. I implied you might be biased toward Pause. That's ok, we all have our favorites.
You were the one that asked me for "failure rates". I simply said to you, what you said to me. I actually said that failure rate data is likely proprietary information and unavailable to us commoners.
I never said that "torture testing" proves that Cruisemaster is superior. I did say that Cruismaster has stood the test of time and is a proven suspension that most try to copy.
I never said bearing failures are "uncommon". I did say preventative bearing maintenance reduces the chance of failure.
I never "argued that spindles don't get bent". I did say, I thought they were not common. I know of only a handful. With that I questioned the emphasis and importance you place on being able to make a spindle replacement in the field. To each his own.
I never said "since Cruisemaster has been out longer, that they are easier to fix". I did say they have developed a few specialty tools and a ton of technical videos to help with maintenance and repairs. They do have great support.

My main point, that I was trying to make- but obviously failed to get across, is that the Pause's suspension is a brand new design that has not been proven in real world conditions and that it is simply an opinion/judgement/hypothesis of the adequacy of the design and how it will actually perform in the field.



Never said, nor implied, that they are weak. Again, just said the Moryde suspension is a new design/system that hasn't been proven in use.

Again, the point I was trying to make was; that running equipment over a "torture track" cannot possibly equal the amount of repetitions/cycles that 1000's of units have seen running down 1000's of hours through the real world. It's just simple math and the number of $'s and hours that a company can spend on physically running a unit across a track. Now if you're actually talking machine testing of components- that may be a different story.

Never said that either.


You do seem to care....just say'n.


John, you and I have had conversations on the Imperial product. As you know, I own one.
Please don't assume you are the only one with intimate knowledge/experience with Imperial trailers. There are other knowledgeable people on this forum.

"Quality"- that is a relative term. Imperial does not produce an inferior "quality" product. Is it perfect- no. Is it crap- no. What would you rather take in the field a Jayco, Sportsmen or your Roamer1. I think we both know.

To be fair, I have had very few issues with my X195. This scenario reminds me of when I owned my Black Series HQ-19. I heard lots of horror stories about Black Series failures. I never had any of the issues reported. Maybe, because mine was built before 2020. Who knows? Always been a mystery to me.

Funny you mention the air bag remotes om the Imperial. I had trouble with the AirBag man remote on my trailer as well. What was nice, is that it was taken care of with one call to the manufacture. They sent me everything I needed to make the repair at no charge- shipping included. Got the parts in about a week. No muss. no fuss.

Again, to be fair, we both know that the attachment of a compressor to the frame is a manufacture issue and not an Airbag Man or Cruisemaster issue. The compressor attachment is one of those design details that gets exposed from real world use. Mine has not fallen off, but a couple of fender washers under the nuts secures the compressor.



Removing most of what I didn't say from your response, you might have gotten this into one post. but hey, no prob.
Admire your passion for this kind of stuff! Keep it com'n!

Starting to see that maybe your just a bit but hurt of Raspy's criticism of the Xplore 😉

You guys both have good points and are very knowledgeable so like you said keep it coming as I learn from you both.

 

[mvbeggs]

Second part:

Next point about your opinion of the McHitch. And again, I don't care which hitch you use. Really, I don't. But denigrating it because you didn't understand how to use it is not the hitches problem.

Don't think it was "not understanding how to use". It's a hitch. It's selling point is "simple to use".

The biggest problem I had with the McHitch was determining how/where the load was being applied. Very difficult to tell if it was loaded from up/down, left/right, or forward/back positions. The tight tolerances, and restricted view of the pin, gave very little clue of where the trailer was loading the hitch.

Trying to support a weak argument about Cruisemaster by including false information about McHitch, does not enhance your argument.

It's not false if I experienced it on multiple- maybe every fourth decoupling- occasions. Apparently, I'm a "rock star" at binding the McHitch.
Previously, all I said was how I prefer the DO-45 over the McHitch.

They are two separate issues. You might do better by simply asking us how to lube your McHitch instead of arguing that something is wrong with it.

It wasn't lube. Lube doesn't matter if you can't get the load off the hitch to open the bale lever. Always worked great hooking up. If it was lube, it would've had difficulty hitching/engaging the locking pin.

But you do it your way. That's fine. And I will admit I'm biased. Yes I am. Based on years and many miles of using off-road trailers with different systems, letting the facts drive the decisions, and selecting McHitch because of its design and ease of use. I don't like them just because I sell them, I started selling them because I like them. I developed a relationship with the owner in Australia. I sold many at cost just to share them with fellow enthusiasts.

That's ok. We all have our biases- obviously.
You must have sold a bunch of hitches to RV's of America. I'm pretty sure that's where I first saw videos of those hitches being promoted. They were also one of the first places I saw Black Series' and Imperial's product line. I think they've moved away from those lines and are now selling Pause's. Is that right? Haven't seen much YouTube content from them lately.

And Since Black Series uses Hitches that almost all break, the Polyblock, we have put well over 1000 of them on Black Series trailers.

You're right. I didn't give mine a chance to break. Mine was replaced within a week.

Cruisemaster hitches are fine too. I'm capable of liking two things at once.

Me too, but I have to like 'em.

But McHitch has two distinct advantages over Cruisemaster. One is ease of use, and the other is that McHitch works perfectly upside down, unlike Cruisemaster. So it can be mounted under the trailer tongue to better match the connection to the truck and to leave more room to open the tailgate. I don't have to be in that business, but I like them. I'm involved in the whole off-road scene and I do a lot of analysis of products and companies. I've used them on four of my own trailers for many thousands of miles, as have many friends who actually get out there and pull trailers as far into the wilderness as possible. My buddy, for example, snapped off a U joint and we had to winch him into a very precarious position on a steep rocky trail.

We disconnected and re-connected the McHitch in that situation with no trouble. We've had to do it other times too, on narrow trails where we needed to turn around.

I would have zero confidence in being able to unhitch in that situation. I would have headed directly for the cutting torch.

It works fine if you understand how to do it. If you don't, I'm here to help.

Should have had you on speed dial. BTW- what's to understand? Block trailer, unload the hitch, remove the pin, throw up the bale, move forward.

Maybe you should make a video where you intentionally bind the hitch and then go through the trouble shooting steps to unhitch. I'd like to see that one.

Simple as that. The hitches don't get stuck unless they are not lubricated over many miles. All they need is an occasional spray with Houdini, WD 40 or, some dry lube. We've sold nearly 2,000 of them. They are standard equipment on some trailers, like OBI, and we have dealers around the Country. Overwhelmingly, people tell me and write to me about how much they like them. I don't care which system you use. You can have your own opinions all you want. But when it comes to facts, try to do better.

John, I don't make this stuff up. Why would I? I got no dog in this fight. I believe enough in what I'm saying that I voted with my $'s.

It is possible to like two things at once, without having to take sides and invent reasons why one is bad, in order to like the other. One of the best features of the Imperial trailers is the Cruisemaster suspension. If only the rest of the trailer was so good. But it's simply not. Pause and Reboot are much better trailers. And since they have Morryde suspension, that works very well, I'm happy. And BTW, my Reboot has a McHitch on it because that works much better than the Morryde hitch.

Just to be clear, I never said anything was "bad", just that it has not undergone the test of time.

I think this discussion has run its course. You can stick with your opinion to hate Morryde and that's fine.

Don't "hate it", just waiting to see how it performs. Like I said, been down this path before with the "latest and greatest", only to find out later, the "latest and greatest" undershot expectations and promotional hype.

They are both good, but 'll continue to actually compare, with facts, factory tours, discussions with engineers and by using them out on the trails over time, while getting feedback from other owners and trailer dealers. I'll continue to buy trailers and equipment with my own money, use them in the field and modify them. I never get any, or seek any sponsorship. I'll happily admit my preferences because they are based on real world use and analysis. I'm happy to see people using other products because I get to see why and dispel or reinforce my information. It helps me find better products, better companies and learn better methods. And I try to be as honest and accurate with my information as possible. Arguing that one is better based simply on imagined "facts" or invented data, is not valuable, except to the arguer trying to make a weak point.

John, we must be reading different books.

I've yet to say anything about Moryde's suspension's performance. For me, the jury's still out. What I do know, and have said repeatedly, is that it is a brand new design that hasn't been field tested to the degree that instills confidence- in me. You obviously feel differently. That's ok.
I'm turning over a new leaf- trying to give up the "guinea pig" role- for once.

Come on out and join the fun.

I'm out there. I think we actually met in the early spring of 2020, during COVID, at the Buffalo Bill State Park outside of Cody, WY. No one else was out but, we were both in our HQ19's. That was you, right?

You and I do have one thing in common, we both bought "premium" Imperial trailers. The R1 is just an X195 with some upgrades. I've moved on and I'm glad I did. I hope yours continues to serve you well. Over on Xplore Trailer Community, we have gone over many of the problems and how to deal with them, or what to watch out for. Preventive maintenance on them is important.

Preventative maintenance is always important.
I know about the Facebook group. It's a great source of information. Thanks for starting that page.

 

[mvbeggs]

Starting to see that maybe your just a bit but hurt of Raspy's criticism of the Xplore 😉

LOL- 😊

You guys both have good points and are very knowledgeable so like you said keep it coming as I learn from you both.

Thanks, but please don't feed the bears- it only encourages the behavior.

 

[Raspy]

In my world, it is important to remember that two things can be good at the same time. Often, there is no reason to take sides and grope for reasons to support one over the other. But facts are facts and important. If you overlay facts on the discussion, it helps all of us to see which of two good things might be better for us personally. Emotion is a huge part of the buying experience. And emotion leads to digging in our heels when a problem is pointed out.

I loved my Roamer 1 when I got it and felt it was the ultimate trailer. But as time went on, it became more and more obvious that it was a dead end street, for me. It became more disappointing and less fun to have. But through it all, I never was disappointed with the Cruisemaster suspension. I looked that over carefully from an engineering perspective as well as a real world use perspective. Generically, I was mildly concerned about the long term health of air suspension, but the benefits were obvious.

When I hit my personal wall and realized I was done with the R1, it was time to look for an exit strategy. As always happens, that strategy was not clear at the time, but then it was. Jump to a Reboot. I had discounted the Pause line initially and it took a second look to realize what the Reboot really was.

This is another example of liking two things at once, even though they are different. I have no reason to hate one, in order to justify the other. I was simply done with one and if I wanted the other, I knew it came with differences. Over and over the differences at first were startling. but then seemed to make a lot of sense. I allowed myself to not be stubborn, but instead embrace the differences. And I am a lot better off because of it.

My points on this subject are not just knee-jerk responses. I look at things at a much more complicated level. Who is the factory? What is their ethos? Are they capable? What is their future? Are they good engineers? Is it run by people with the right intentions? Do they have the financial stability that breeds quality and success over the longer run? What materials and construction methods are they using? Is the equipment good, serviceable, efficient and available? Is the thing fun to use? Can it handle rough service? Does it tow well? Would I be proud to own it? Can I maintain it? But I never consider resale value because I am buying it for me, not someone else I will never meet, later on down the road. Cheap Indiana Sticky trailers are everywhere and low priced. But I'll pay the price for quality and I'll decide for myself if it really is quality, or hype. I sincerely appreciate the need for lower priced trailers. A young family with a stretched budget that wants to go camping, for instance. Perfect. And when they see how much fun they can have, and discover why something else might be better, they can move up later and be even happier.

For years, with Black Series, with Xplore, with Oliver, I asked "why did they do that?" Why did they cut that corner. And I could never get answers. Or I developed insight into who the folks were that designed them and built them. Then, with the Reboot, I was able to tour the three factories that build them and assemble them. I drove all the way across the Country to do that. I went face to face with the engineers and quizzed them. The workers, the managers, the machinery and saw the materials involved. I would ask: "Why did you make this decision, when you could have made that decision, with a better outcome?" They actually explained why. I respect that, even if I wish it was different.

I came home with a Reboot. Not perfect, but excellent.

I don't have to hate the R1, in order to like the Reboot. And I don't hate the R1. But when I consider the company, the decisions made, the development process, or when I consider their stated goals, and compare that to what they are actually doing, as well as a host of points I don't care to make here, I had to jump ship. And I'm happy to mention that some things about the R1/195 are the best I've ever seen. And I wish everyone a long and happy future with theirs.

 

[rdrop]

As someone watching the Reboot line really closing—especially after being really enamored with the Imperial Outdoors options—I think a lot of this conversation comes down to "making a bet on Reboot" vs. "waiting to see..."

I've spent my whole career in early stage start-ups, and am currently at a company that is a vertically integrated hardware, firmware, software company building products in the renewable energy space. As a result of my career bias, I personally align with how @Raspy is evaluating things because it reminds me of partnering with excellent investors who are making a bet, but who are very interested in understanding exactly what type of risk they're taking.

That said, given the track record of companies trying to build truly off road capable trailers, it's not hard for me to understand where @mvbeggs is coming from either!

Regardless...I'm just grateful Reboot isn't offering both options on the same trailer, or this conversation would probably move from popcorn to fireworks!

 

[mvbeggs]

In my world, it is important to remember that two things can be good at the same time. Often, there is no reason to take sides and grope for reasons to support one over the other....

I loved my Roamer 1 when I got it and felt it was the ultimate trailer. But as time went on, it became more and more obvious that it was a dead end street, for me. It became more disappointing and less fun to have. But through it all, I never was disappointed with the Cruisemaster suspension. I looked that over carefully from an engineering perspective as well as a real world use perspective. Generically, I was mildly concerned about the long term health of air suspension, but the benefits were obvious.....

This is another example of liking two things at once, even though they are different. I have no reason to hate one, in order to justify the other. I was simply done with one and if I wanted the other, I knew it came with differences....

Raspy,
There's no question that you do a lot of investigating before making a purchase. I appreciate, and think everyone feels the same way, that your willingness to share your findings and thoughts online benefits us all. Your information is especially beneficial for those who don't want to, or can't, take the time, nor have the ability, knowledge, or experience to evaluate as you. Thank you.

As someone watching the Reboot line really closing—especially after being really enamored with the Imperial Outdoors options—I think a lot of this conversation comes down to "making a bet on Reboot" vs. "waiting to see..."....

rdrop- you hit the nail on the head.
I am definitely in the "wait and see" camp on this one.

.....Regardless...I'm just grateful Reboot isn't offering both options on the same trailer, or this conversation would probably move from popcorn to fireworks!

If you mean a Cruisemaster equipment on a Pause/Reboot- I think that would be awesome! I assume when you say "fireworks" that would be in a good way- as in celebration and welcoming that option with open arms. 🎉🥳

 

[Raspy]

I was really enamored with the Imperial line of trailers too. I bought an X22 and loved it. It certainly was not perfect, but it was just the right size, had interesting suspension, was rugged and towed well. The V nose was unique and I liked it.

The problems were: the solar was a complete joke. Flexible panels installed in such a way that they were shaded, wired wrong and went under a pipe flashing that was caulked down to them. What?! I tore the whole system off and started over. After that, it became a true off-grid trailer. The water system with the tankless heater was a very poor design that wasted way too much water, so I redesigned that with a diverter system and it worked very well. The furniture inside is all pressboard as subject to serious damage if it ever gets wet. Not much can be dome about that, so you have to be very careful to b=not have water leaks. The trim extrusions are all held on with screws that are stripped out at the factory and one by one fall out. The fix is to go to larger diameter and shorter screws. The roff should be coated with a high quality trailer top coating periodically to make sure it remains in good condition. The alumni skeleton makes the walls very strong and the exterior fiberglass, (Crane Noble) is thick enough to buff out deep scratches. The frames are also well made. The Expo batteries are excellent, but not heated in stock form, so they shut down at about 35* F. we had a lot of dust intrusion, so we were always trying to improve the door and hatch seals. I installed a positive pressure system to help with it, and we had no more problems with dust. I installed a very nice tile backsplash on the kitchen sink and a stainless heat/splash shield next to the stove to protect the luan/paper walls.

After that, I became enamored with the Roamer 1. The stance and attitude of it is just so ************. It looks totally capable. I had some reservations as I watched their development over time, but eventually, I said OK. Mine was the second one sold and the first one delivered. It seemed excellent in so many ways. It towed straight as an arrow. The air suspension brought a whole new level of capability. But of course, the solar did not work at all until completely rewired. The frame was flexing, which caused the storage box to damage the body, and I found out the frames are not built as advertised, the cabinets fall off the walls if any weight is put into them, such as canned goods or cookware. So they must be reinforced right away. Then I discovered that the fridge was held in with some small plastic clips that hold the trim it is screwed to. Some fridges have fallen clear out onto the table. Mine didn't work well at all. I increased the venting, added fans, and replaced the thermostat twice. It still was erratic and caused spoiled food. So much heat comes in through the exterior extrusions that they can be too hot to touch if parked in the sun and leak so much heat that they drip with condensation when it's cold. Many of them have had blistering exterior walls and they are not UV stabilized. So they begin to fade even if parked mostly under cover. I got tired of working on mine and trying to redesign stuff. But the suspension was flawless, except for the compressors being mounted incorrectly. I caught mine and fixed it before it fell off. I liked the disk brakes even if they are not as linear in operation as electric brakes. They work well on long downgrades and are easy to work on when doing the bearing service or replacing the pads. The parking brake works, but is very weak. Don't trust it. The Cruisemaster hitch is a good unit, but not as user friendly as McHitch because it has to be lined up so carefully when connecting, so I swapped mine out and had excellent service. The bolt pattern is interchangeable.

This explains part of the evolutionary process that got me considering a Reboot. Both Imperial trailers looked good on paper, but corners were cut that reduced their real benefits. The building of them was done in ways that revealed a lack of knowledge, or concern, for quality and good workmanship. They both looked exceptional, from distance. Both built by a smaller company with one person in charge, who is overworked and able to make ridiculous mistakes.

I was not about to jump without looking carefully first. So I did. And I jumped. The Reboot is not perfect either, and that's OK. It is the best trailer I have ever had, is built exceptionally well, with a lot of design consideration from a large company with huge financial resources. They intend to build quality and stand behind them. It works very well and it's a keeper.

 

[mvbeggs]

....After that, I became enamored with the Roamer 1. The stance and attitude of it is just so ************. It looks totally capable. I had some reservations as I watched their development over time, but eventually, I said OK. Mine was the second one sold and the first one delivered. It seemed excellent in so many ways. It towed straight as an arrow. The air suspension brought a whole new level of capability. But of course, the solar did not work at all until completely rewired.

Raspy- Owning one of the earliest units produced must have been both exciting and challenging, especially as manufacturers often face growing pains when bringing a new product to market. Sorry to hear about your issues with the R1.

Regarding the solar- mine has worked great and I've been pretty impressed. (no re-wiring required)
In the 1.5 years I've owned my X195, I have only plugged it in twice. The first time was right after I purchased to make sure the shore power electronics were working. The second time was last fall on a trip to Bar Harbor, Maine where we had 9 days straight of overcast skies and nearly constant rain. We were glad we had upgraded to a larger platform. It was nice to have a nice, warm, dry bed and larger area to retreat from the weather. Our previous teardrop and trailer mounted tent was a challenge in inclement weather.

From my casual glances at the solar monitor during relatively clear days, we typically see anywhere from 450w to 800w coming in from the solar. I have yet to see a battery storage level less than 75%- typically our low occurs first thing in the morning. (We have over 1,000 watts of lithium storage, but we are still stingy with electrical loads and duration.)

....The frame was flexing, which caused the storage box to damage the body, and I found out the frames are not built as advertised, the cabinets fall off the walls if any weight is put into them, such as canned goods or cookware. So they must be reinforced right away. Then I discovered that the fridge was held in with some small plastic clips that hold the trim it is screwed to. Some fridges have fallen clear out onto the table. Mine didn't work well at all. I increased the venting, added fans, and replaced the thermostat twice. It still was erratic and caused spoiled food.

I've also heard about and seen photos of issues related to suspected frame flexing- which I believe Imperial has acknowledged. Imperial Outdoor's website now reads: " We’ve upgraded our chassis to improve tow-ability and handling, while maintaining strength and durability. Our customers have spoken, and we’ve listened… explore our Features/Packages to learn more!" (https://imperial-outdoors.com/x195/ as of 2025-01-27) Not sure exactly what that statement means- but if purchasing, you might want them to quantify that statement. I'd love to hear that answer and what upgrades they made to the chassis.

Our fridge has been rock solid- literally from a movement standpoint and cooling. After dealing with propane/electric fridge in the Black Series, the X195's 12V Isotherm fridge has been a significant upgrade for us. We loved the fact that Imperial chose, what I consider to be, a "marine grade" fridge. Never had any cooling issues with the Isotherm. (we loved the 12V fridge in our AT Chaser and Teardrop- which now serves as a beverage fridge for the truck.)

So much heat comes in through the exterior extrusions that they can be too hot to touch if parked in the sun and leak so much heat that they drip with condensation when it's cold. Many of them have had blistering exterior walls and they are not UV stabilized. So they begin to fade even if parked mostly under cover.

I also haven't seen condensation on the interior extrusions. I'm not saying this hasn't happened to Raspy or others, just saying I haven't experienced that condition. Any extrusion that is continuous from outside to inside is going to create a thermal short and will definitely sweat in the right conditions. Air flow and air exchange is critical in any relatively air tight, insulated box as well as minimizing humidity inside the trailer by using the exhaust fan when showering or inside cooking.

I got tired of working on mine and trying to redesign stuff. But the suspension was flawless, except for the compressors being mounted incorrectly. I caught mine and fixed it before it fell off. I liked the disk brakes even if they are not as linear in operation as electric brakes. They work well on long downgrades and are easy to work on when doing the bearing service or replacing the pads. The parking brake works, but is very weak. Don't trust it. The Cruisemaster hitch is a good unit, but not as user friendly as McHitch because it has to be lined up so carefully when connecting, so I swapped mine out and had excellent service. The bolt pattern is interchangeable.

This explains part of the evolutionary process that got me considering a Reboot. Both Imperial trailers looked good on paper, but corners were cut that reduced their real benefits. The building of them was done in ways that revealed a lack of knowledge, or concern, for quality and good workmanship. They both looked exceptional, from distance. Both built by a smaller company with one person in charge, who is overworked and able to make ridiculous mistakes....

To anyone considering an offroad trailer, Raspy’s advice to evaluate carefully and ask detailed questions is sage advice. I would also stress that every successful manufacturer evolves, and understanding their designs and/or updates made to their current lineup- regardless of the manufacture- will allow for a better informed decision.

Good stuff here. Thanks to all that have contributed.

 

[Raspy]

MV, I don't know exactly what that Imperial statement means either. But here is what I do know:

The frames were always advertised on their website as being made of 1/4" wall tubing, .250". However, it turns out they are 11 gauge, which is .123" or just under 1/8". I'm not saying that thickness is wrong, but the frames are weak and not made as advertised. So it seems obvious that the tubing thickness is wrong. A number of us had flexing that made the storage box rub on the front of the body, damaging it. My friend had his frame break at the suspension mount and wreck a swingarm. Then his frame cracked near the front, where the rails turn to become the tongue. While inspecting it we discovered the body mounting bolts were pulled out of the frame on the drivers side front and the body was just sitting on the frame there, but not attached. The frame cracked at a bad weld, my friend had a welder reinforce it. I was also told of another one that had both frame rails crack and partially collapse, but I have no first hand knowledge of that one. Meanwhile, Isaac from Imperial said flexing is normal and the breaks were not their fault, that my buddy must have hit something, which he did not. The frame manufacturer, told us the frames were built as designed. In the end, after us telling the frame builder that the welding was not done correctly, and having that story backed up by the welder that fixed it, they stepped up and paid for the crack repair. It has been pointed out to Imperial that they are falsely advertising the frame tubing dimensions on their website. They also proudly talk about powder coating, but the frames are rusting. There is a beautiful big truss under the front section of the frame, but it doesn't stiffen the part with the most stress, so it is just really for looks. I designed a stiffener for my frame, but in the end, I moved on. I really don't want to go deeper into the development of the trailers, which I am familiar with, but when I totaled it all up, I decided it wasn't right for me or for the long run. I hope Imperial gets the bugs worked out, steps up their quality and is successful. And I don't know how much they have improved since they came out. I am always interested in the ethos of companies, where and how they fall short. Imperial is a classic case of being overworked, one person in control of the whole show and making some obviously bad decisions. I think it was a sincere attempt that had the potential to be the best in America while made in America. And the trailers can still be great if Imperial can muster the resources and energy to make them right.

Another interesting story with a much bigger crash is Black Series. They managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of success. And it was almost all driven by one bad apple. Their obvious mistakes were legendary and completely unnecessary. I just shook my head in wonderment as they hammered themselves into irrelevance.

These stories are better suited to campfire talk than here, but I did want to fill in the blanks just a bit on Imperial. Everyone should be inspecting their frames periodically.