Thinking of putting EBC brakes and rotors on the 4Runner...

[cbradley]

Unsuprisingly, ever since I put the 285/70/17s on the 4Runner the brakes have not felt the same as they used to. In an effort to increase the braking power, I have been considering switching to EBC pads and rotors.

If anyone is using them, can you tell me how much of a difference they make? Are they worth the extra money? What are your thoughts on the Yellow Stuff pads versus the Green Stuff pads?

Thanks ahead of time for any information you have to offer.

 

[Cackalak Han]

Pads will make the biggest difference. The rotors will hardly make any. I'd say save yourself some money and buy some Autozone Duralast rotors (blank, not x-drilled or slotted--waste of money).with the 2 year warranty against warping/cracking/failure. I've used them on 2 Toyota's and numerous Honda's. They've held up very very well. For pads, I use just some ceramic pads. I have heard good things about EBC, but I've never felt the need to get any more expensive pads than what I'm running now. I also live in the rockies, which means lots of hills/canyons and heavy brake use. Have not felt any brake fade thus far.

 

[BKCowGod]

I only run EBC pads on every vehicle I own. I usually just use the greenstuff myself, though the Porsche gets better items. Can't tell you about rotors, but I was a huge fan of the slotted and vented rotor upgrade on my too-heavy Grand Cherokee.

Also a good bleeding and use of synthetic fluid (Ate Super Blue is all I use) will do wonders, even if you think your system is in good shape.

 

[Cackalak Han]

Most of the rotors these days are vented. The holes on the outer edges are vents.

 

[BKCowGod]

But it's amazing how many solid rotors are out there...

 

[zjsheller]

EBC green are the way to go for sure. I've run them on my ZJ for 4 years now and they are still going strong. Slotted, cross-drilled on the front seem to help them run cooler on the trail under load.

 

[cbradley]

Thanks for the responses. I think I am going to give the EBCs a try. I want to read a little bit more on the differences between the green and yellow stuff pads, but it looks like the green is more geared towards off road use, so...

I have only seen the part number for the front pads. Does anyone know if the rear pads are the same size/part number?

 

[DaveInDenver]

I put EBC green pads on my truck last summer after turning the rotors. My rotors (I use Toyota stock rotors) warped after about a month with them. I dunno if it makes any difference, but they were just at the minimum limit for thickness. I replaced the pads and rotors, now using plain old Toyota stock semi metallic pads with no rotor warping. I think the EBC pads worked OK (except for the rotor warping, didn't care for that), but realize that they are performance pads and work best when things get warm. They did stop pretty darn well coming off the highway.

Off highway in 4wd low I found that they were significantly worse than stock pads. Often I would have to stand with both feet on the brakes to hold the truck back (but in fairness I have quite a bit more than stock reduction in my drivetrain, 5.29 R&P + 4.7:1 4-low + 4:1 1st gear = ~100:1 crawl, so overpowering my brakes is not surprising).

But with the stock pads I use now the slow speed braking has improved a little, although neither is anywhere as good off highway as the cheap organic Toyota pads that I used before going to the EBC. On the upside, the EBC pads were quiet and didn't seem to make much dust in the few months I had them. I personally would not bother with them again on anything but a WRX STi or Porsche or something. For an off highway truck it seems my truck likes old fashioned, soft organic pads rather than rally car brakes. The friction material in high performance pads seems to want the operating temp to be higher than what you (or at least I) see crawling.

 

[ntsqd]

Dave's experience is pretty typical. The pad temperature vs. braking effectiveness, not the warping. Performance pads are designed with higher heat loads in mind. They are meant to stop better when you are driving hard, not when you are creeping along in 4 Lo.

Have a look at the various Cf vs. temperature curves for wilwood pads found here (page 4): http://info.wilwood.com/Images/BrakePads/data-sheets/Wilwood_Brake-Pad_Data-Sheet.pdf
For low speed work you're looking for a high Cf at low temperature. For highway use you're looking for a curve that either stays the same as temperature increases or slightly increases with temperature. Few folks can get their pads into the plus side of 1,000*f, so unless you're towing something heavy or are really hard on the brakes I wouldn't worry too much about what happens out there.

Most, but not all rotor "warping" is actually this: (http://info.wilwood.com/BrakPads2.aspx)
"With some compounds, a layer of pad material may also be embedded onto the rotor face. It is important that this "transfer layer" be deposited slowly and smoothly. Otherwise, pedal pulsing and compromised friction values can result."
The link above has instructions for properly bedding pads and rotors.

People always look at me cross-eyed when I say this, but for slow speed work (that is not buried in mud/muck/water/etc.) a drum brake is better. Heat dissipation is the disc's advantage over a drum. In this use you don't have any real heat and the drum's Servo-Effect makes for a better low speed and position holding brake than does a disc.

 

[Redline]

My '06 4Runner is heavy, 5,500-lbs empty. Both before and after my mods I think the brakes on this vehicle are the best brakes of any truck/4x4 I have ever owned. I'm admittedly very easy on my brakes because of my driving style and technique, but the few times I have really got on them I have been impressed with their bite.

 

[BKCowGod]

Chris - I assume yours came stock with the 16" wheels? (EDIT - it's the same part#'s for the 17")

DP71657 EBC 7000 Heavy Duty Green; Disc Pads; Front;
DP61657 EBC Greenstuff Street Sport; Disc Pads; Front;
DP6993 EBC Greenstuff Street Sport; Disc Pads; Rear;
UD606 EBC Ultimax Pad Set; Disc Pads; Rear;
UD976 EBC Ultimax Pad Set; Disc Pads; Front;
DP41657R EBC Yellowstuff High Friction; Disc Pads; Front;

and rotors

GD7238 Rotor; 3GD EBC Sport; Set of Two; Front; 13.3 in. Dia.;
GD7161 Rotor; 3GD EBC Sport; Set of Two; Rear; 12.3 in. Dia.;
UPR7238 Rotor; Ultimax Replacement; Each; Front; 13.3 in. Dia.;
UPR7161 Rotor; Ultimax Replacement; Each; Rear; 12.3 in. Dia.;
USR7238 USR EBC Sport Rotor Kit; Front; 13.3 in. Dia.; Set of Two;
USR7161 USR EBC Sport Rotor Kit; Rear; 12.3 in. Dia.; Set of Two;

 

[Cackalak Han]

But it's amazing how many solid rotors are out there...

Really? I don't think I've seen one in quite a while. Even the 98 Caravan that my friend's neighbor owns has vented rotors. Every single Toyota I've worked on has vented rotors, too.

We're talking about this, right?

SOLID

Vented

 

[OTR]

I used green EBC pads and drilled roters on my frontier. I was very happy with the combo. I was rear ended by a guy in a mini-van. He said that he couldn't stop nearly as fast as I did. The pads had very little dust and last 70,000 miles with 60% aggressive city driving. Highly recommended from my experience.

 

[kjp1969]

I've had mixed results with EBC Green, but I've just installed a set of Porterfield street pads on new rotors on my '03 G35 (about 1000 miles so far) and they are very, very good. I paid extra attention to the bed in by the way.

 

[ntsqd]

Really? I don't think I've seen one in quite a while. Even the 98 Caravan that my friend's neighbor owns has vented rotors. Every single Toyota I've worked on has vented rotors, too.

We're talking about this, right?

SOLID

Vented

'79-'85 Toyota Mini's have non-vented (i.e "solid") rotors up front.