Unimog 404 help?

[Nashorn101]

What's funny is I've gotten 19 replies to this thread on this forum. And only 9 on the Benz forum.


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[Nashorn101]

I read the production numbers for the 404.0 - and according to: http://www.cs.brandeis.edu/~zippy/unimog-model-baumuster.html - only 527 of the M130 Unimog 404's were produced? That seems like an extremely small number.

Are there any advantages to an M180 over an M130? Cheaper parts, etc.?

I really don't want to "swap" in an M130 or maybe a diesel engine from a 406 - so before I possibly do that, is the M180 performance THAT abysmal? Does adding a high compression head make a worthy difference to an M180?

Thanks!

 

[Tennmogger]

Posted this thread on the Benz Forum - only two people responded. So thought I'd try my luck here!

Been interested in Unimogs for a while, and for as long as I can remember I have wanted to own a military cargo truck of some kind.

I thought about buying a US 2.5 ton or a 5 ton truck - but to me those are just boring, and too big as well. I looked into buying a Unimog 1300L (I asked some questions about a 1300 on this forum a while ago) but I think that truck is also just too big for me as well and too expensive, even though it seems to have much more creature comforts than the 404 offers. So, that brings it down to a 404, an M130 404 to be exact. And yes I thought about a 416 or a 406 - I just don't fancy how they look.

My question is: what are ya'll's thoughts, that you could present to a newbie, about the practicality of owning a 404?

• I have read that out of fear of transmission failure, most owners stop every hour of highway driving to keep the various brass bearings in the transmission from getting too hot; I also have read that if you completely take apart your transmission and clean out all of the cooling channels thoroughly, that this 'transmission failure' gremlin won't be a problem? @HadokaGuy already helped me with some of these questions - thank you sir! However I wanted to get a larger spread of answers.
  
• The safe top speed is 50mph (due to transmission heating issues as well as high speed safety factors with MPT's)? Correct?
  
• The engine bay is very hard to work in due to the small hood, but the engine is still rather simple to perform maintenance on? Or, if you take out the dash you can access the back of the engine easily?
  
• Portal axles on the highway - resulting in foaming oil - is this a true concern? I've read conflicting answers to this.
  
• Clearly M180 404's are much more common - however does that mean that M130's are hard to find? And, no I do not want to swap in an M130 from a Benz sedan into an M180 404.
  
• Do you LOVE your 404? Or just like it?
  • 
    
    I want this 404 mainly to use like you would use a pickup. Throw stuff in the bed. Haul around stuff. But at the same time, it'd be awesome to take in on some trails, and drive it around town.
    
    I own a 2002 Jeep TJ, so I am used to not being able to have a conversation while driving down the highway, terrible gas mileage, and a low top speed with my 33" tires and measly 3.73 gears. With that being said, a 404 doesn't seem like it would be too foreign to me. I just am not sure if it's TOO slow on the highway and just not meant for the open road?
    
    Thank you!
    
    
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• • 
    
    If you want the uniqueness of a Unimog, prefer to keep the truck small(er), can live with few creature comforts, don't mind routine maintenance, and slowing down the pace on road is ok, then the 404 is a great truck. They are very reliable, tough, simple to maintain, and lots of parts available. Maintenance items can come from an auto parts store.
    
    There are a few glaring misconceptions broadcast across the web. The 404 portals are not a high failure item. Keep lube in them and they last forever (the U1300 has front hub issues). The 404 transmission will overheat but its better to avoid that by keeping high speed bursts (60 mph or more) short term, and don't be tempted to get on the interstate and keep up with traffic. Cruising speed of 50 avoids the heating problem.
    
    Why was the 404 supposed to be such a hard vehicle to work on, for normal maintenance? You can sit in the drivers seat and change the spark plugs. Other engine stuff is under the hood and on the front of the engine. Easy to get to.
    
    Changing an engine or transmission is as difficult as described. That's why it pays to get a good truck and not a fixer-upper. The transmission is the center building block of the whole truck. The transmission supports the engine except for one pivot point up front, and both axles are anchored into the transmission (all 3 point mounts for articulation). That unique design which is responsible for the Unimog's outstanding performance, has dictated the difficulty of a transmission swap.
    
    I hear so much about 404s being so slow. Historically they have been one of the faster Unimogs, designed for 95-ish kph top speed, but they will do better. That little M-180 loves to rev, and over 5000 rpm is easy. Acceleration is poor due to power to weight ratio, but if you are impatient then an Unimog is not the right truck for you. Of course the newer Unimogs are much faster, especially if you invest in an overdrive and fast ratio axles, but each of those upgrades can cost more than a 404.
    
    The 404 is not a tractor. It was designed specifically as a transport truck, not a tractor.
    
    A buddy of mine and I travel together a lot. He is in a 404 (mid 60's, Belgium) and me in the 1300. He runs off and leaves me around town! It's only on the longer stretches that the U1300 runs off and leaves him. Point is, NO vintage Unimog is designed for 'fast', but the 404 is better than most. Of course we all know that the 404 runs out of power on hills, but, most suburban areas are not built on steep hills and it sounds like you wanted a daily driver. On the trips 'to the hills', just gear down and enjoy the drive.
    
    I edited to add that the lack of responses over on the Benzworld Unimog forum was probably due to the ho-hum factor. These same questions have been asked and answered over there so many times that maybe the group thought you would simply do a little more searching. You should still do that. Most importantly, ask around and try to drive (or at least ride in) the type of Unimog you get interested in.
    
    Bob

 

[Nashorn101]

If you want the uniqueness of a Unimog, prefer to keep the truck small(er), can live with few creature comforts, don't mind routine maintenance, and slowing down the pace on road is ok, then the 404 is a great truck. They are very reliable, tough, simple to maintain, and lots of parts available. Maintenance items can come from an auto parts store.

There are a few glaring misconceptions broadcast across the web. The 404 portals are not a high failure item. Keep lube in them and they last forever (the U1300 has front hub issues). The 404 transmission will overheat but its better to avoid that by keeping high speed bursts (60 mph or more) short term, and don't be tempted to get on the interstate and keep up with traffic. Cruising speed of 50 avoids the heating problem.

Why was the 404 supposed to be such a hard vehicle to work on, for normal maintenance? You can sit in the drivers seat and change the spark plugs. Other engine stuff is under the hood and on the front of the engine. Easy to get to.

Changing an engine or transmission is as difficult as described. That's why it pays to get a good truck and not a fixer-upper. The transmission is the center building block of the whole truck. The transmission supports the engine except for one pivot point up front, and both axles are anchored into the transmission (all 3 point mounts for articulation). That unique design which is responsible for the Unimog's outstanding performance, has dictated the difficulty of a transmission swap.

I hear so much about 404s being so slow. Historically they have been one of the faster Unimogs, designed for 95-ish kph top speed, but they will do better. That little M-180 loves to rev, and over 5000 rpm is easy. Acceleration is poor due to power to weight ratio, but if you are impatient then an Unimog is not the right truck for you. Of course the newer Unimogs are much faster, especially if you invest in an overdrive and fast ratio axles, but each of those upgrades can cost more than a 404.

The 404 is not a tractor. It was designed specifically as a transport truck, not a tractor.

A buddy of mine and I travel together a lot. He is in a 404 (mid 60's, Belgium) and me in the 1300. He runs off and leaves me around town! It's only on the longer stretches that the U1300 runs off and leaves him. Point is, NO vintage Unimog is designed for 'fast', but the 404 is better than most. Of course we all know that the 404 runs out of power on hills, but, most suburban areas are not built on steep hills and it sounds like you wanted a daily driver. On the trips 'to the hills', just gear down and enjoy the drive.

I edited to add that the lack of responses over on the Benzworld Unimog forum was probably due to the ho-hum factor. These same questions have been asked and answered over there so many times that maybe the group thought you would simply do a little more searching. You should still do that. Most importantly, ask around and try to drive (or at least ride in) the type of Unimog you get interested in.

Bob

Thanks for your response! That's exactly what I was looking for.

I already read through Bill Caid's website, Rocky Mountain Moggers, a good plenty of forum posts about the 404, and still never really found an answer to my question like you just gave me.


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