Use of Memory Clear and Diag Check for ECU Errors instead of MUT/OBD

[gait]

bending my brain a bit

volts are acceptable. A bit low at idle. Charging ok. Must be a warmish day in UK or battery quite a bit discharged. I'm picking the latter.

I believe governor servo is another name for the fuel rack actuator. Error 11 is one that would be expected. I also don't have an error 26 in my manual - I'll keep looking.

We are a little ahead. I believe "11" occurs when there is a difference between target actuator position and actual position. Which means its probably not a sticking actuator, means that the control loop detecting actuator position and moving it to a desired position is not causing an error "11" when all connected. Possibly means the "limp mode" is a deliberate action from the ECU and the fuel rack is doing what its supposed to. Finding nothing is sometimes good. Just frustrating.

Keeps pointing us back at something in the ECU programme, wiring or sensors, rather than something mechanical.

I guess I expected more codes. Have you read the past codes? Is there more than one connector to the fuel rack/pump? It also may be that it gives us the worst code.

Has system gone back to "normal" (error but no error) after reconnecting fuel rack? Always methodically go back to known condition and check.

As-built not matching manual is story of my life. The accelerator "should" have two sensors. Simple variable resistance. Connected through the same plug. Worth disconnecting to see what code is created. There is a separate code for each sensor. 16 and 24. Strangely (to me) the vehicle is still drivable, sets max accelerator angle to 30 degrees.

At present we are disconnecting, looking for error codes, then connecting. Generally homed in on the area of fuel delivery. There's really only two things that can go wrong with a diesel. Air and fuel. The engine is controlled by controlling the fuel. We have got as far as "the fuel rack is probably working ok". Again, keeping an open mind, discount nothing.

If we continue to find nothing we will probably have to start checking sensors. There's a part of this section of the manual that has values for resistance between pins for each sensor and other checks. Is your voltmeter a multimeter (for resistance). We may not find anything but we will know what isn't wrong. Beyond that there's continuity of wiring between sensors and ECU (dirty connections) then the ECU itself.

If its easy a quick visual look at the ECU. Just looking for obvious things like dirt/dust/water damage, etc.

Probably a long shot. Is there a Mitsubishi shop near that would lend you an MUT (Multi Use Tester). As well as diagnostic codes it can tell us the values the ECU is reading.

 

[SJI]

So thought it would be worth putting an update up incase others come across this in a search to solve their problem . . . . .
Right thanks to Mog, who sent me a workshop manual, and Gait (who has helped lots behind the scenes with his knowledge and time), my truck is fixed and working better then ever and can confirm I got my code reading sorted.

It was giving a code 23 in blink code history, (which is not covered or listed in the manual I had) but when in limp mode was giving no blink code or indication what was wrong, by accident I found that it would give code 23 (by normal blink code reading - lead unplugged for diagnostics) after 15 seconds if the engine was running - this is also the point when the limp mode would kick in, so the truck/ecu would only see and find the fault if the truck was running as when then switched off it would reset and be fine, and in normal diagnostic reading would read no fault present.

The outcome I believe for blink code 23 was a TCV (Timing control valve) in the diesel pump - this on mine a VP44 Bosch pump which is not an unscrew-able part form the pump itself (but think it can be done on some bigger Canter pumps looking at some manuals for the trucks) but on my little VP44 after removal and getting it on a test rig it required the pump to be reconditioned and new EDU on the pump itself. So not 100% sure if on my truck blink code 23 is the TCV or a generic fuel pump issue as no individual parts to replace when fitted to the truck, but either way this code 23 pointed to the pump or part in it being at fault and this has fixed it.

Thanks again Steve!

 

[Aussie Iron]

Thanks for putting up the follow up on your problem. It is not that it will ever be a problem with my Canter but will certainly be of value to some of the others with latter model trucks.

Dan.

 

[Canter Diesel]

New Member here, I know this is an old thread which I have resurrected but after googling blink codes and how to go about it, this link came up.
I was intrigued to read that member SJI and I have or had something in common with the Canter. My lorry 2001 3.0litre turbo intercooler has the exact same symptoms and I have put up with it for the last 4 and a half years. I have spent thousands with so called main dealers and mechanics who seem to just throw parts at it and say 'All fixed for you Sir'
It was first diagnosed as a camshaft position sensor which was inside the pump, this was duly done and the problem persisted, now we are back to the diagnosed pump camshaft position sensor, so basically gone around in a complete circle! Anyway I bit the bullet and had the pump done for the second time in 4 years, only to have the same issue with the safe mode and engine management light coming on. Bosch have asked for the lorry to be scanned, though in this case the blink code. Now the next issue is that there was no flash codes that come up,(apart from the one that tells you everything is normal, on off, on , off and this will carry on for as long as you let it) though when the memory check was done it came up with 3 long blinks followed by 4 quick blinks. This, I think equates to code 34, which does not show on any of the lorry codes as far as I can see.
I know that everything electrical has been replaced with new parts and the wiring checked etc I did discover that the throttle pedal has a sensor on it, which was a surprise to me. I am now thinking as this is the only part that is electric that hasn't been changed could it be the or an contributing factor?
I will say that after having the pump done, the problem with intermittent safe mode has reduced some what and if I am able to keep the revs above 2500 all the way up to top gear there is a less likely hood of it going into safe mode, motorway driving is okay at 50 and above but once I come into slower traffic or towns and the revs drop it will send it into safe mode. Normal round town driving will cause safe mode to intermittently come on but will also intermittently go out of safe mode too. Very frustrating in traffic and roundabouts. If I stall or turn the ignition off and restart or crash start it can make it come out of safe mode, sometimes after restart it will behave itself, other times it wont. It does seem however to be in the lower rev range that can cause the eml and safe mode to engage.
Any feed back with other Canter owners/drivers would be much appreciated if they have had similar issues as I. I know that Steve got sorted with his a few years ago, mine just seems to be a real head scratcher and since spending large amounts of money, I thought it might be worth a go adding my issues to this thread.
Regards Pete

 

[gait]

welcome Pete. Not much help to you. Behind the scenes solving Steve's problem through email was a bit of a saga as various avenues were explored with much miscommunication due to email. Required a lot of disciplined methodical problem solving and meticulous description of problem and each step. Fortunate I had similar model.

 

[Canter Diesel]

Hi,

Thanks gait for your response. this is certainly a mystery.
Bosch contacted me with this 34 code which has no reference at all. However after a short journey in the lorry this morning (2 miles) the EML activated for all of 5 seconds. I carried out the blink code check when I got home and it is coming up with 2 long and 3 quick blinks. This is a code in which Steve had? The code will only come up as a stored code too. I cleared this code a few days ago relating to the 34. All Bosch could say was that if I had read the code wrong and it was 43 then that relates to air being drawn in through the fuel lines. I have contacted the pump reconditioners again to let them know this new code and I will have to wait now for them to get back to me. In the mean time I have ordered a throttle sensor to try as the problem only seems to happen at low driving speeds.

Regards Peter

 

[Canter Diesel]

Just got back from a short run and as the eml appeared for a brief moment I rechecked the blink code. 2 Long and 3 Short.
I haven't received the throttle sensor yet, when it arrives I will clear this 23 code and fit the replacement sensor and see how it goes.

Regards Peter

 

[gait]

if I've read correctly the fuel pump has been rebuilt by a diesel shop rather than Bosch. There's possibly a microprocessor in the fuel pump that can throw errors to the vehicle ECU (the source of 23 in Steve's case). I would have the pump checked by Bosch. Just guessing as I have no idea which engine/pump/truck and ECU error codes can vary between models. Do you have a manual?

 

[Canter Diesel]

Hi Gait,

Many thanks for your reply.
Yes the pump has been fully reconditioned and all the electrics inside or attached to the pump is brand new, not done 200 miles yet. When the pump was sent away it had a fault when placed on the test bed, those being, if my memory serves me correctly was 59 a code being 'cam timing sensor'?? Only available as a whole unit which included the pump ecu. Having the pump done has made no difference to the safe mode coming on with the eml. Another short journey yesterday and the eml was on 75% of the journey, this was some town driving and open road. Same code 23.
The only manual I have is the owners handbook, doesn't cover anything other than operation driving and switches etc.
I was told last week that on my m40m engine that the cam timing sensor was either situated on the left hand front of the engine or the bellhousing. This engine is a 2 camshaft model and as far as I can see no sensor in the head or front of the engine at all, though I haven't checked the bellhousing yet.

Regards Peter

 

[gait]

just guessing - the engine is possibly 4M42, twin camshaft, with VP44 pump.

pump same as Steve's engine. Code 23 on engine ECU was pump timing control valve.

Question was whether pump reconditioned by a general diesel shop or by Bosch? Not whether it was reconditioned. Did reconditioner know that the engine code 23 was probably relevant to the pump?

Reconditioning can cover a multitude of sins. I have no idea what parts would be replaced or reworked with "normal recondition". Nor what bench testing wold be performed.

Just guessing, maybe one of those "did all the information get to the person that needed it".

 

[Canter Diesel]

Hi gait, yes sorry it is the 4M42 twin cam engine with VP44 pump.
Bosch haven't got back to the reconditioners yet. I was just talking to the reconditioners and have verified that the timing control valve was replaced with all the electrics as the electrical parts are not supplied separately. Everything electrical associated with the pump was replaced with brand new electronics, the pump mechanicals are in excellent order according to the reconditioners.
To make matters worse the pump was tested by another company about 2000mls ago and was found to be in good order, however they cleared a fault. This is on the invoice. No idea what the fault was. As soon as the pump was refitted the eml and safe mode was back in action! The lorry has done 198,000 mls.
What gets me is that the reconditioners were quick to find the fault with the pump this time, saying that it show a fault 59 being timing sensor, but all of a sudden they don't know what the fault code is and have to phone Bosch.
Hopefully they will get back to me soon and I will up date.

Regards Peter

 

[gait]

difficult to know at this distance, just a sense that cutting out the middle man may help

 

[Canter Diesel]

I haven't had any response today from the repair shop, I will call them on Wednesday morning to find out what is going on. It seems to me now that I am getting the run a run. I drove it today and kept the rev's above 3500 through the gears and no issues, but not good in 40mph zones!
I'll keep you posted with any up dates.

Regards Peter

 

[Canter Diesel]

A quick up date on my problem with the eml and safe mode..........Bosch can't help, the Main Dealers says, could be mechanical problem with timing but other than that they can't help. Flash or blink code is 23 meaning camshaft timing sensor fault, this has been replaced and the pump has brand new electrical components. I took the lorry to a mechanic today to have the timing chain checked to see if there is any slack in the chain that could be causing the timing to fluctuate, but this checked out to be good.
The problem does get a lot worse when the lorry is up to normal running temperature, and has been suggested that it could be a vacuum and advance issue??
I will now have this checked out within the next 3-4 weeks, failing that, it looks like the problem is unrepairable or can't be fixed!......Seriously.
Fitting another throttle sensor made no difference, so every electrical component that can be related to this issue has been changed, so maybe the Main Dealer is right in saying to start looking at the mechanical side of the timing? The engine goes so well, has plenty of power for 130bhp, pulls well, even in top gear (5 speed) the engine doesn't use oil or blows smoke, when in safe mode it loses half its performance, but again no smoke plus its not really noticeable empty but very noticeable when loaded.

Regards Peter

 

[WayneRoberts]

you are reading it correctly Mark.

And it just got better. One more piece of the jigsaw.

At the bottom of page 13E-16 of the troubleshooting document you provided, and I have same in the manual for my 4D34 engine, is the following description of connecting the MUT tester:-

Place the starter switch at the LOCK position.
• Connect the a Multi-Use Tester II harness to b Multi-Use Tester II
and insert the c read-only memory in the tester.
• Connect the connector A to the cigar lighter socket.
• Connect the Multi-Use Tester II connector C (16 pins) to the data link
connector B (16 pins).

The data link connector is the 16 pin OBD connector with only one wire. I now believe the cigarette lighter connection provides the earth and 12v I've been missing.

I'd been mistakenly assuming that all four connectors of the MUT tester connection (pictured as special tool MK327601 in that document) had to be connected and misled by another empty socket near our two wires for blink codes. Durrrrrr.

So a little bit of rewiring of the 16 pin socket on the vehicle, or make up a cable with a 16 pin female OBD2 connector out and 16 pin male to vehicle female plus cigarette lighter male. We need to end up with 16-pin female OBD with pn 7 our single K-line data wire, pin 5 ground from cigarette lighter or elsewhere, pin 16 12v. My connector has that single wire already at pin 7.

The protocol is K-line, which is ISO 14230-4 KWP, which is one of the OBD2 protocols. Pre CAN Bus.

I believe an Elm327 cable (OBD2 to USB protocol converter) will then let us read the engine ECU. Same as in Pugslyyy's current thread using the bluetooth version. http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/115566-Android-OBD2-reader-error-code-P1335

Reading the Scangauge web page it looks like Scangauge will connect to our modified OBD2 socket, and recognises the same protocols as Elm327. I haven't found a fuel pressure sensor so complete trip data may not be possible.

Its easier for us than Pugslyyy and Owen. If the standard codes don't match we have the two digit PIDs for error codes, data and actuators. We also have the formulae for the data. We probably will even be able to test the exhaust brake without getting out of bed (someone had a problem with that a couple of weeks ago).

This could be really expensive though ..... maybe as much as $20 ... I'm kicking myself for not looking harder a couple of years ago.

Has to be worth a try ..... but a bit of caution. Some of the Elm327 cables are Chinese clones which may not function as expected.

Sorry if that's too much info, it seems to help when I write it down. Getting clearer every time.

Simply - add ground and 12v to our connector, buy an Elm327 cable, load the software to whatever, or add the ground and 12v then plug in Scangauge. Bob's your uncle!

Easier than finding Gin Gin?

Hi Gait, just reading your post, useful all these years later. Did you ever get the ODB connected up and working? Was your truck an FG649? I'm keen to sort something out to be able to read the error codes.