Which SLR to get

[Ursidae69]

Which digital SLR to get

So, I'm planning on upgrading to a digital SLR this year. I have a big Brazil trip in June and I would like to have a better camera for that trip. I'm looking to spend up to ~1k, so I am looking at either the Canon 20D or the Canon Rebel XT. There are several members here that are very camera savy and maybe you can help point me to the best choice.

Here is a good comparison of the two. ***LINK***

So the question in my kind really is: How much will I use the faster shutter speed, higher ISO, faster fps, and with a few more focal points with the 20D to justify the larger price?

I don't know enough about cameras to answer that question right now.

The XT is cheaper, lighter and will fit my needs now, but as I get more advanced in my photography, how much will I start needing the higher options of the 20D? I don't want to upgrade camera again for many years after this purchase.

Thanks for any insight.

 

[jeffryscott]

long reply

Chuck,

If you don't want to upgrade for many years, be aware that with digital cameras you are basically buying a computer. New models will be coming out every 1 to 3 years, depends on the target audience for the camera. Pro models have a lifespan of maybe 3 years, max. Consumer cameras are on one year cycles. (of course, times are approximate, but fairly accurate).

Between the two, the 20d will be vastly superior over the long haul (build quality, general usefulness, camera controls) - and the high ISO is absolutely fabulous.

I'd recommend two lenses to go with the camera: the 17-40 4L and the 70-200 4L. The two lenses together are about $1,200 and are optically fantastic and are Canon's high end L glass.

Be aware the EFS lenses that come in the kits will only work on the XT and 20d - as CMOS sensors get cheaper and bigger, it is hard to say whether the EFS will be supported. I.E. the EOS 5d, a full frame camera for $3,000.

Good luck with the choice, the Canon's make a good product.

As an aside, you may want to look at the Olympus E1. I had one for nearly two years and loved it. Only reason I sold it was work went all Canon and I wanted access to the big lenses.

The E1 has beautiful color (film like quality) out of the box, two lenses, the 14-54 2.8/3.5 and 50-200 2.8/3.5 give you 35mm range of 28 to 400. The camera body is all metal, seal against dust and the elements and has a nifty feature on the sensor that shakes off dust (no annoying dust marks on pictures in the whole time I owned it, on my Canon's dust gets on the CCD routinely and is a pain).

The downside, somewhat, is the "noise" at high ISO is worse than the Canon - but looks a lot like film so I never was bothered by it and used it at 1600 all the time.

I really liked the E1 and if I was wealthy, I'd have stuck with it because Olympus makes some killer lenses for the system - but too expensive for me.

Good luck,

Jeff

 

[Life_in_4Lo]

Nikon D50 and D70s are real bargains and I like both better than the Rebel XT

You can go up the Nikon food chain from there but the Nikon stuff is really good, the D50 is alot better than my Rebel Digital, I like the body shape better than the XT and the features/pic quality is better, imo.

Take a look at the Nikon stuff too.

 

[DaktariEd]

I've had Canon's for more than 20 years. Terrific optics and always reliable (almost...except after dunking in a river once).

Having amassed a great lens system I wanted to get a digital body that would take my EF lenses, so I got the D60. Probably not made any more as Jeff said...but the 20D would be a great choice, IMO.

Ed

 

[Scott Brady]

Spend the money you have on glass before the body. Optics and composition/lighting are the most important IMO (well, negative/image size does help a bit too).

Just look at the pictures Chris takes, all with a point and shoot and a high quality 2.8 lens. His images kick ass because of the composition and lighting. The attributes of a great image that cannot be purchased, despite the price.

 

[Ursidae69]

Thanks for all the comments and I will be looking at Nikons too now. :ylsmoke:

Scott, no question that operator skill is the biggest component of a good picture. I just feel like I ahve maxed out my capabilities with the Fujifilm S3100 (4megapixel) I am using now. It is great and all, but I want more. I want more megapixels and I want better quality.

I have aspirations to publish stuff someday and I want to get more into wildlife photography. I often find myself in remote places and I can't tell you how many times I've missed cool shots of some critter doing something because of the huge lag in startup time or the lag between frames. The <1 second startup and fast fps are two of the main reasons I'm looking into SLRs to be honest.

Thanks again for all the feedback from everyone. :luxhello:

 

[Scott Brady]

With aspirations to publish, save your pennies and buy the 5, full frame unit. It will be worth every penny IMO. 12mp provides better than 35mm quality.

 

[Ursidae69]

With aspirations to publish, save your pennies and buy the 5, full frame unit. It will be worth every penny IMO. 12mp provides better than 35mm quality.

That's a lot of pennies...

 

[BajaTaco]

Chuck, I will follow this thread too, as I am also interested in getting a digital SLR, mainly for the higher quality optics/resolution options that are available.

Thanks for the comment Scott one good thing to be said for the small pocket type cameras is exactly what Chuck just inadvertantly mentioned - speed (which is often a result of convenience). Granted I miss some farther animal shots due to the lack of zoom/resolution on a larger lens, but to be able to quickly pull the camera out, turn it on and shoot a picture with one hand, "on the fly" is really a great attribute based on the sake of convenience. I have a little holster that hangs right next to my leg, off of the shifter console in the truck, and am able to grab my camera pretty much like a gun out of a holster - which is really cool. And it's just as easy to put it away. When I go to a larger camera body, I will still keep my little camera for hikes and my "quick draw" holster, when I just don't want to mess with the bulk of an SLR and extra lenses.

When Scott and I were talking to Nathan last week - he brought up an excellent idea. Get a camera body that can use the same lenses as your traveling companions/local buddies, and you can have a larger pool of lenses to share. Scott doesn't know it yet, but I might be keeping this in mind when I buy my camera body :hehe: I think some ultra wide lenses and macro would be fun. :ylsmoke:

 

[Scott Brady]

Yeah, but prices will continue to fall as you are saving. If I was buying a new camera with the intention of selling the images, I would not even consider anything less than full frame.

With my truck basically finished, I am going to be funneling most of my EW earnings into lenses.

I am happy with the performance of the 20D, but the 23mm CMOS is a real issue. It makes it difficult to get landscape without all new lenses (and the distortion that comes with ultra-wide angle) and hand holding requires extra caution too due to the magnification factor. The old rule used to be shutter speed in excess of focal length to eliminate shake. Now, you need to multiply the shutter speed by 1.6 too to ensure good clarity.

 

[Ursidae69]

Well, lots of think about. I don't intend to publish anytime soon, but I can foresee me doing some sort of wildlife photography as a side job someday, books, freelance stuff, I dunno.

In the meantime, I can get a Rebel XT fairly cheap for the amount of camera I'd be getting and like Chris said, I can share lenses with folks. In my upcoming trip, at least 3 of us will have Canon SLRs. This will give me a few years to save for a 5D while the prices down at the same time.

 

[Scott Brady]

When Scott and I were talking to Nathan last week - he brought up an excellent idea. Get a camera body that can use the same lenses as your traveling companions/local buddies, and you can have a larger pool of lenses to share. Scott doesn't know it yet, but I might be keeping this in mind when I buy my camera body :hehe: I think some ultra wide lenses and macro would be fun. :ylsmoke:

Yeah, good point Chris. Stephanie and I did that for years when we both had Canon 35mm bodies. Especially if one of the team prefers a different style than the other, it should be very complimentary. I do need a wide angle and a macro/portrait lens, which will be my next purchase.

Right now, I have 44.8-1280mm 35mm equivalent covered. It is the 44.8 that is killing me though. I really need a 16mm equivalent or so.

 

[Scott Brady]

Good plan Chuck. Most magazines are happy with 6.3 MP. Fine art mags and AZ Highways, etc. are just now accepting digital, but only the full frame images.

 

[OutbacKamper]

Spend the money you have on glass before the body.

I agree: buy the cheaper camera body (Canon XT Rebel) and spend the money on the lenses. The price of digital slr's is dropping, but the lens prices usually stay fairly constant. So learn on the cheaper camera and only replace it when your skills demand a more advanced camera. By then the equivelent of a 5D should be available at the current 20D price. I also agree that you should avoid the EF-s lenses as they will soon be obsolite (sp?). If possible ($) buy EF-L series lenses, the difference in quality is significant. I would also highly recommend the canon image stabilization feature, it really works.
Good luck with what ever you decide.
Mark

ps: I would recommend EF 16-35 F2.8L USM (77mm)- or- EF 17-40 F4L USM (77mm)
and EF 70-200 F2.8L USM (77mm)-or- EF 70-300 F4.5-5.6 DO IS USM (58mm)
Also circular polarizer filter(s) - size shown in brackets

 

[bigreen505]

I recommend you buy the cheapest camera that has the features you want and an interface/ergonomics that feel comfortable to you. The Nikon D70s, Canon XT and 20D are all capable cameras (as are the D60 and 10D if you are looking for used), but all feel very different in your hand. Jeffry's suggestion of a 20D or XT with 17-40/4 and 70-200/4 and maybe a flash (580ex) is an outfit capable of pro level images, but not super wide. If you like a wide view of the world consider adding a Canon 10-22 or Tamron 12-24 (for either Canon or Nikon).

Scott are you sure about AZ Highways accepting digital? He was the world's last hold out and very insistant that only 4x5 or 8x10 are good enough.