Why isn't anybody but Aluminess making a side ladder?

[BobbyJones]

Goonie-

I'm curious as I have no hands on point of reference for fabrication. How many hours did that take?

 

[NLPRacing]

I wonder if something could be fabricated economically using aluminum extrusions from www.tslots.com or someone like that? Probably would end up costing more than the Aluminess.

 

[superparabuteo]

Do the Aluminess ladders have the same long lead times as roof racks and bumpers (~9 or 10 weeks currently)? I was going to place an order, but the long lead time is giving me second thoughts to start looking for alternatives.

 

[SirMrManGuy]

Not much about tslot extrusion is "economical" minus the easy setup. You'd still need to make mounting brackets which would take some time.

Something like Goonies ladder I'd spend an entire day on, maybe a bit more including paint and fit up. The ladder is the easy part, brackets and tabs are what takes time.

 

[Petrolburner]

http://xtendandclimb.com/
Keep a telescoping ladder in the van and then you can move it to wherever you need it...or potentially doing other campsite chores?

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

This is what I would do too.

1) No constant parasitic drag hanging off the side
2) Use it around camp and job site for a million other things.

 

[Goonie]

Goonie-

I'm curious as I have no hands on point of reference for fabrication. How many hours did that take?

Like SirMrManGuy says, it was probably a full day. I think the most tedious part was getting the angle just right on some of the cuts, if I had a chop saw i could have "chopped" 1~2 hours off the build time. I was using an angle grinder with a cut off wheel so all the cuts were freehand.

Totally doable though, and tons of fun, anyone with a passion or even a mild interest in making their own hardware (probably a pre-requisite for browsing the camper van forums!) could make one in a weekend. The $ you saved not purchasing one would almost buy you a good 125V welder....

 

[shenrie]

********....I see the shopping continues in your busted up state. maybe update your build thread???

these guys offer a collapsible ladder, but no idea on cost. http://www.optoverland.com/

im with your brother too. these vans get bad enough mileage without crap hanging off the side. maybe craft up something that involves climbing up top with your spare tire setup, and everything in a van should be multipurpose

 

[Corneilius]

I scamper up my spare and onto my high top... it gets old fast. It gets near impossible with my bike or motorcycle rack. Im working on a design that uses CNC side plates with 8020 for the rungs. Im picturing a line of accessories that utilize the 8020 as well, a table that locks on, shower mount etc

 

[86scotty]

$150-$250 is super low margins... Not worth the effort unless the right profitability is there.

The only way to drive the costs down is volume and I don't see enough demand to justify large production runs. I've only had 2-3 ladder inquiries in the last several years

Inquiry #4 RIGHT HERE!

Like SirMrManGuy says, it was probably a full day. I think the most tedious part was getting the angle just right on some of the cuts, if I had a chop saw i could have "chopped" 1~2 hours off the build time. I was using an angle grinder with a cut off wheel so all the cuts were freehand.

I bought a cheap Harbor Freight chop saw when I upgraded to a nice 200 amp welder but I really don't use it that much. It's too slow and messy for thick stuff. I still use and recommend what I was doing most of my cutting with before, a porta-band (handheld bandsaw). Unbeatable versatility.

I scamper up my spare and onto my high top... it gets old fast. It gets near impossible with my bike or motorcycle rack. Im working on a design that uses CNC side plates with 8020 for the rungs. Im picturing a line of accessories that utilize the 8020 as well, a table that locks on, shower mount etc

That's a brilliant idea! I'm in for one since MG won't make me one.

 

[NLPRacing]

I scamper up my spare and onto my high top... it gets old fast. It gets near impossible with my bike or motorcycle rack. Im working on a design that uses CNC side plates with 8020 for the rungs. Im picturing a line of accessories that utilize the 8020 as well, a table that locks on, shower mount etc

Can't wait to see it!

 

[Mat Mobile]

You know, 410$ does seem expensive... but it isn't.

Here's my calculations (and I'm low balling everything).

Material: Per Goonie's example = 100$ + Paint = 20$ for rattle can or 100$ for powder coat. Stainless steel hardware = 10$ (assuming it wasn't too had to find as the hardware store never has what you need!)

Labour: Anybody who builds his own ladder will probably only be making one or two in their lifetime. So expect 1 day. Your time is free... but you weren't camping that weekend and your significant other went shopping... so you lost money there too!

Tools: No need for high end but you need decent tools. So you need a grinder (30$), something to cut metal (200$), something to weld (300$), maybe welding gaz (100$).

Skills: If you didn't pay for classes, you tried your hand on other stuff. So you paid $50 in material to make an ugly lawn ornament.

Refreshments: $20 :friday:

So we already reached the $400 Aluminess is asking for the ladder.

At this point, you need a place to work on your van so you buy a house with a decent driveway ($200,000 + ) or maybe a house with a garage ($250,000 + ).

Then you keep on making other stuff and buying more tools ($5,000 + ).

Spending more time in the garage building, maintaining the house, cutting the d@mn grass and less time camping...

I built three vans and never had the time to finish any of them. I loved learning and making stuff. I also applaud anybody who makes their own! But I ended up being fed up of this vicious cycle and wanted more camping time. :camping: So I sold it all :wings: and I'm happy to pay others (local or vendors that support Expedition Portal) to build the stuff I need!

Basically:

- If you already have the tools, the time and the skills... Go ahead! Have fun building it and be proud. You deserve it. You don't need Aluminess for a simple ladder.
- If you don't have the tools, the time and the skills... Buy the parts. They're made by skilled workers who have the right to a decent job that rewards them for their hard work (to make and design the parts).

Sorry for the whole philosophy class... Your calculations might be different but that's how I calculate it in my situation.

 

[Mat Mobile]

I scamper up my spare and onto my high top... it gets old fast. It gets near impossible with my bike or motorcycle rack. Im working on a design that uses CNC side plates with 8020 for the rungs. Im picturing a line of accessories that utilize the 8020 as well, a table that locks on, shower mount etc

Thanks for sharing that Corneilius! I thought the scampering up the spare was a good idea but I'll make sure I have a ladder built to access my roof rack.

 

[Goonie]

You know, 410$ does seem expensive... but it isn't.

Here's my calculations (and I'm low balling everything).

Material: Per Goonie's example = 100$ + Paint = 20$ for rattle can or 100$ for powder coat. Stainless steel hardware = 10$ (assuming it wasn't too had to find as the hardware store never has what you need!)

Labour: Anybody who builds his own ladder will probably only be making one or two in their lifetime. So expect 1 day. Your time is free... but you weren't camping that weekend and your significant other went shopping... so you lost money there too!

Tools: No need for high end but you need decent tools. So you need a grinder (30$), something to cut metal (200$), something to weld (300$), maybe welding gaz (100$).

Skills: If you didn't pay for classes, you tried your hand on other stuff. So you paid $50 in material to make an ugly lawn ornament.

Refreshments: $20 :friday:

So we already reached the $400 Aluminess is asking for the ladder.

At this point, you need a place to work on your van so you buy a house with a decent driveway ($200,000 + ) or maybe a house with a garage ($250,000 + ).

Then you keep on making other stuff and buying more tools ($5,000 + ).

Spending more time in the garage building, maintaining the house, cutting the d@mn grass and less time camping...

I built three vans and never had the time to finish any of them. I loved learning and making stuff. I also applaud anybody who makes their own! But I ended up being fed up of this vicious cycle and wanted more camping time. :camping: So I sold it all :wings: and I'm happy to pay others (local or vendors that support Expedition Portal) to build the stuff I need!

Basically:

- If you already have the tools, the time and the skills... Go ahead! Have fun building it and be proud. You deserve it. You don't need Aluminess for a simple ladder.
- If you don't have the tools, the time and the skills... Buy the parts. They're made by skilled workers who have the right to a decent job that rewards them for their hard work (to make and design the parts).

Sorry for the whole philosophy class... Your calculations might be different but that's how I calculate it in my situation.

Right on dude! that's a very valid point, it's not everyone's cup of tea.

Option 3, find a buddy with all the hardware needed to build it and bribe them with $40 worth of beer and pizza :victory::victory:

 

[temporarydweller]

Do the Aluminess ladders have the same long lead times as roof racks and bumpers (~9 or 10 weeks currently)? I was going to place an order, but the long lead time is giving me second thoughts to start looking for alternatives.

Mine was in stock when I called. It depends on what their current inventory is for your usage and the side you want. When I first called to get a shipping estimate I was told they only had a couple of the one I wanted ready to go (drives side Chevy Express) and if those sold before I actually pulled the trigger and ordered, it would be several weeks before they had another batch. So you're best just to give them a call and see.

 

[Backcountry Pursuit]

It appears I have struck a nerve with this post for some folks.

First, being a small business owner I very much understand margins, the need to keep and retain talented people and overhead in general.

In the big scheme of things and the scope of cost for the build I am working on, no $400 isn't that much. I know it's a dang good ladder. However I was just more surprised that NOBODY else makes one. Seems like once you get a jig made it would be pretty easy to knock out a batch. But what do I know? As I am sure some people would love to point out: NOTHING.

I just sent an email to a pretty good friend who makes really beautiful frames for rafts and catboats. Class V here in Idaho. I'll see what he comes back with to make one. I know he likes these one off projects. If he says the same thing that $400 is really a reasonable price, I will attempt to make my own.

I had a solar system installed on my house last week and that necessitated getting a 200 amp panel put in my garage. They then added a 220V plug for me that I didn't have before. Now I can run a welder. I have no idea how to use one but that is what youtube is for. An ex of my girlfriend abandoned a fairly nice Lincoln tombstone arc welder ages ago and it just saw the light of day for the first time in years as I drug it to my house today. I shall teach myself to weld.

Footnote: No matter what I do, my van gets 10-11mpg. Fully loaded pulling a fully loaded raft trailer-10.2mpg. Empty around town-10.8 mpg. Empty highway trip-11.1. That ladder isn't going to affect anything much. And I don't want a portable one for several reasons. It is another thing to figure out where to put it in the van. Also would probably be a little sketchy on ice in a ski parking lot. That is the main reason for wanting a ladder. I need to get ski gear in and out of the rocket box many times a week during the winter. That rocket box doesn't open from the end, only the side. So scampering up the spare tire is totally not an option. I want something solid I can climb in AT or Tele boots.