Will Automakers Get the Market and Make Simple Vehicles Again?
- Thread starter Rachmaninoff
- Start date
Jurfie
Adventurer
About as simplistic an expedition capable vehicle as possible, that is still road legal in the U.S.
https://www.arielna.com/arielnomad/
I'm waiting for the optional roof rack kit to add a roof top tent.
And for those expeditionists who don't get off the pavement:
https://www.arielna.com/arielatom/
Probably better to stay in hotels when expeditioning across the country in this one.
Neither are cheap, but if happiness is measured by the bugs in one's teeth, these rate higher than a BMW 1200GS. :victory:
I thought to myself "self, that looks like fun!" :smiley_drive: And then I saw the price. :Wow1::yikes::squint:
My plan is at some point in the next few years pick up another regular cab Tacoma or really, most likely an extended cab with the 2.7 and five speed with the lowest miles I can find. I bet that will be my last " simple truck" base model. you can find the late model second gen regular cabs for a decent price and the 2012-2014 4 banger extended cabs can be had fairly cheap too.
I can not fault toyota for moving away from manual everything. I wish mine had manual hubs ( cheaper to replace ) and a non electronic 4x4 system. But I have to admit it is a pretty simple and relibial system. I just dont want to mess with replacing an accuator when that time comes.
My rig I drive at work is a 2015 ford 350 turbo diesel. It is an impressive machine but very complex. I mean if the exhaust filter farts out the truck goes into limp mode and can not be driven further then the end of the driveway and onto a flat bed. If the ehxaust farts out on my tacoma I most likely smashed it off a rock off road and one only needs to smash it all the way off and replace the piping when you get home.
a truck built for truck stuff aka not built to ride like a benze and or pull a tri axel fifth wheel at 80 MPH up a grade is a dying breed.
yea you can still find regular cab fleet rigs, but the price on them is insane for what they are.
I can not fault toyota for moving away from manual everything. I wish mine had manual hubs ( cheaper to replace ) and a non electronic 4x4 system. But I have to admit it is a pretty simple and relibial system. I just dont want to mess with replacing an accuator when that time comes.
My rig I drive at work is a 2015 ford 350 turbo diesel. It is an impressive machine but very complex. I mean if the exhaust filter farts out the truck goes into limp mode and can not be driven further then the end of the driveway and onto a flat bed. If the ehxaust farts out on my tacoma I most likely smashed it off a rock off road and one only needs to smash it all the way off and replace the piping when you get home.
a truck built for truck stuff aka not built to ride like a benze and or pull a tri axel fifth wheel at 80 MPH up a grade is a dying breed.
yea you can still find regular cab fleet rigs, but the price on them is insane for what they are.
The days of talk like this are gone, because electric vehicles are here. And nothing is more simple than an electric vehicle. No transmission needed! No oil changes or maintenance. Very simple.
Look up the "Bollinger" vehicles. If you want simple that is exactly what you should be looking for. They have made it the most basic 4x4 electric vehicle. That is exactly what you are talking about.
Look up the "Bollinger" vehicles. If you want simple that is exactly what you should be looking for. They have made it the most basic 4x4 electric vehicle. That is exactly what you are talking about.
That is a fairly cool looking concept. And, there has been no updates to their blog since june 2017. So what does it mean, I dont know. I watched a few of their clips and it looked like they had to push the truck around for the photo shots. Look how long it has taken tesla to get off the ground. Look how expensive their cars are.
No doubt this is the most simple 4x4 out there.
And if anything it is going to be a very pricy, made to order boutique car for a long time. If that truck was street legal in all 50 states and under 25 grand I would buy it tomorrow.
I would surprised to see a price tag below 60 K on that rig when and if they ever make it into production
and dont get me wrong. I hope they do.
6 k towing, 4x4, 200 mile range. Like I said, I would buy one tomorrow if this thing was reality right now. ( and it had a warranty to back it up )
D
Deleted member 9101
Guest
Well... because the newer trucks have emissions control, make over 100 HP, and can tow more than their own weight...Lol. My F150 gets 24 MPG, comfortably cruises on the HW, will tow what ever I want, and has more room on the inside than most cars and SUV's. You can keep the old trucks, I've had enough of 'em....Lol.
Clutch
<---Pass
Interesting. did not know that..will have to stop by one of many tractor dealers in our area an take a look see. Guess I could look it up online, but much more fun to crawl over that stuff in person.
Thats cool...
Say money no object...Even a restored FJ, with a modern engine? You would pass that up and take a F150? That is what I was thinking with the HiLux, just enough modern features like EFI, power steering and brakes, AC...and not much else. Some modern features are nice. Some are excessive. Do we really need a 12" touch screen like in the new Rams, really think people need to pay attention to the road.
It is kinda crazy that the once humble basic work horse Land Cruiser is now the play thing of the wealthy.
https://www.resurrectionlandcruiser...e-red-menace-1962-stage-3-patina-restoration/
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rruff
Explorer
I have no issue with cars having these safety features, but why not make it optional? Why are we *all* required to pay for and use them? Heck you can even subsidize the cost to some degree the way high mpg cars are subsidized. Just don't make it mandatory for everyone.
Because the market just isnt there for manufacturers to spend more money to built that basic car.
In the high end sports car market, they stopped selling manual transmissions. Toyota and majority of truck makers favoring IFS and luxury over a farn truck. They go where the money is and unfortunatley our market is not the target. As for me i'd keep my 'old' vehicles.
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rruff
Explorer
Less money. They are spending a lot *more* money to build that sophisticated vehicle. The one that has to pass all the silly crash tests and consequently weighs more, and then needs a complex engine and drivetrain to try and meet the MPG *and* emissions requirements.
I'll put up my '84 Toyota SR5 Xcab 2wd truck as an example. That thing had more luxury and comfort than I needed. It was an order of magnitude more refined than my Dad's '69 Chevy. Smooth, quiet, rode and handled fine. Nice bucket seats. Slick 5 speed manual. Didn't need a big motor because it only weighed 2600 lbs. 1600 lb payload. 30 mpg highway. Probably would pass 2018 emissions standards. Most definitely would "not" pass 2018 crash standards. Built to be strong and lightweight, not collapse on impact. No airbags. Durable and reliable. Even though I used the clutch as a low gear offroad, I didn't have to replace it til ~200k miles.
If I could buy a new truck like that now (only a little bigger and 4wd) I'd definitely do it. I'd pay extra.
Regcabguy
Oil eater.
Hang on to that rocket ship. My neighbor averages 15-17 combined 2wd with stock Michelin pizza cutters. 3.5 engine. I know a guy who hase the same truck with the 2.7. He gets very good mileage 24/7 all conditions. No towing.
Quick,quiet trucks and very roomy. Suckers have great resale value too.
The F-150 will be my next truck.
It's because of those morons that I am thankful there are government-mandated safety benchmarks for OEM's to meet.
I like the old-school trucks and cars, but those things were not at all safe to crash in. Air-bags, crumple zones and rollover ratings have all been instrumental in increasing the survivability of crashes.
I get that people should be accountable for their own safety and follow the rules, but the fact is there are lot of morons out there, crashes are going to happen (no matter how careful a driver you are) and government regulations on vehicle safety has saved lives.
Clutch
<---Pass
Just today...the last mile before work, I watched the girl in front of me screwing around with her phone...could see her eyes in her rear view...barely glanced at the road...was weaving all over it. Good thing we were in a 30 MPH zone and not going 70 up on the highway.
I sure do like the old stuff, but in all reality...wouldn't want to daily drive one as they are basically hobby vehicles. Maybe if I was fully I retired and just plunked around town.
While the whole resto-mod thing is super cool...kinda throws the basic "cheap" vehicle thing out the window.
Martinjmpr
Wiffleball Batter
If "money is no object" and you want an old, simple vehicle, what's stopping you? Just buy whatever old vehicle floats your boat, put in a modern engine, transmission and whatever luxuries you think you need. There are a bajillion of them out there on the road. By the time you're done you'll be close to the cost of a new vehicle anyway - $30k - $50k probably but you'll have exactly what you want.
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The reason manufacturers don't make "simple" vehicles anymore is because they're not cost effective to make and not enough people would buy them.
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"But I would buy one!" you say.
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Yeah, you and 20 other people in the country. Sorry, that's not enough to sustain the multi million $$ cost to bring a vehicle up to US emissions and safety standards.
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BTW those "great" old Toyota 4x4 pickups that everyone loves? The ones that got 25 mpg? They got that because they had sheet metal that was only a little thicker than a beer can, tiny, cramped cabins, no power steering and an engine that put out a whopping 110 hp on a good day. And yes, I know this from personal experience:
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That's me in 1985 with my then-new 1985 Toyota pickup (first vehicle I ever bought new.) For a 23 year old kid in 1985 it was a great vehicle. For today? Yeah, not so much.
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Sometimes the past is better left in the past.
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The reason manufacturers don't make "simple" vehicles anymore is because they're not cost effective to make and not enough people would buy them.
.
"But I would buy one!" you say.
.
Yeah, you and 20 other people in the country. Sorry, that's not enough to sustain the multi million $$ cost to bring a vehicle up to US emissions and safety standards.
.
BTW those "great" old Toyota 4x4 pickups that everyone loves? The ones that got 25 mpg? They got that because they had sheet metal that was only a little thicker than a beer can, tiny, cramped cabins, no power steering and an engine that put out a whopping 110 hp on a good day. And yes, I know this from personal experience:
.
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That's me in 1985 with my then-new 1985 Toyota pickup (first vehicle I ever bought new.) For a 23 year old kid in 1985 it was a great vehicle. For today? Yeah, not so much.
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Sometimes the past is better left in the past.
rruff
Explorer
I suspect most of the decline in fatalities has come from the war on drunk driving.
I remember reading a study somewhere that the safer you make something the more careless people become, greatly reducing the effectiveness of the safety measures. People watch TV and text while driving....
"Saving lives" has an ultimate success rate of zero. Always has and always will. The expense and hassle we incur to further reduce risk when we are already reasonably safe, goes up exponentially.
Like I said early, if you want a car with all the most extensive safety features, then you can pay for them. Shouldn't I have the freedom to "live dangerously" with 40 year old safety tech? Hell, I can still ride my motorcycle and bicycle. Where are the airbags and crumple zones on those?