Wow!! No disrespect to Taco owners. . .

[gjackson]

. . . but holy cr@# these things are hard to work on! Just been doing a front bearing job on a friend's Taco, and I could have done all 4 wheels bearings and the diff seals on my Defender in the time it has taken to pull one wheel bearing on the Taco. Apart from needing 10 SST's for the job (I have none, but have made several), it is just plain hard. No wonder they never leak oil!

So the real question I have for all you Taco owners is this: have you ever had to do a bearing replacement in the field? Specifically on the IFS. If so, are there any tricks you learned/took with you?

cheers

 

[bigreen505]

For those of us less mechanically inclined, what is an SST?

Hey Graham, want to help me with my wheel bearings? I think the just need to be tightened.

 

[gjackson]

SST I think is a "special service tool". The manual just lists them as SST followed by a number. Most vehicles have specialized tools for certain operations, but the Taco has more than anything else I've ever worked on. (And yes, that is limited to things like VW beetles and Land Rovers!)

If you have a welder and some metal you can often make the simple SSTs, like the one to pull the bearing nut off the hub, but others, like the one to pull the bearing out of the steering knuckle are a bit more complicated!

Hey Graham, want to help me with my wheel bearings?

Sure! As soon as some Taco experts let their secrets out of the bag!!

cheers

 

[Brian894x4]

I assume a pre-05 Taco? Because I'm sure there's probably a difference in the '95-'04 Tacos. Also, the few Tacos that had manual hubs are probably easier to work on, like the older trucks, but I'm not exactly sure why.

I'd like to hear some details of some of the problems you ran into?

 

[DaveInDenver]

I assume a pre-05 Taco? Because I'm sure there's probably a difference in the '95-'04 Tacos. Also, the few Tacos that had manual hubs are probably easier to work on, like the older trucks, but I'm not exactly sure why.

I'd like to hear some details of some of the problems you ran into?

I'm not so sure, Brian. I think the Tacoma has always had a sealed wheel bearing design. I'd bet that the design is similar between all Tacomas, as well as the 3rd & 4th gen 4Runners, FJCruisers, Tundras and maybe 100 Series IFS (OK, maybe not the Cruiser). These things are not constructed the same way as the front ends on our trucks. The Hilux and Cruiser wheel bearings are pretty much all the same, besides the hubs or drive plates themselves and A.D.D. half shafts if so equiped. Ours uses traditional taper roller bearings, lock nuts and all that. In fact I've used up my supply of spare parts left over from my '78 FJ40 on my '91 IFS during services. Things like star washers, seals, etc. It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out that the bearings and races were the same (never checked specifically).

I guess these new styles are basically all one big hub and bearing assembly. I think it's more like the bearings you'd see in a third member, where you press a bearing on and off the spindle, right? I wonder if you took the whole spindle off the truck that there'd be less need for SSTs? The obviously does not hold up well for field repairs, but just thinking out loud. Thing is, Graham, new US-spec SUV Rovers probably are going to be similar. Probably more so with the Ford influence as it creeps into their designs. If you could buy a regular 70 series or pre-06 Hilux (the front end on the new Hilux is identical to our Taco, so I'd guess so are the wheel bearings), they'd be far easier. What was wrong with the old way? I guess since you had to periodically adjust the pre-load, it was deemed to be too much effort. Just another reason the world is passing me by, eh?

 

[Grim Reaper]

I know that through 95 they used traditional bearings on the front. The front hub from a 94 IFS front is a bolt on to a 79 Solid axle truck. The only difference is where the rotor flange is. A popular swap is to put the IFS hub on to get the offset of the solid front axles to match the wider rear IFS axle from 86-95.

I really didn't feel it was any worse of a job then my GM solid axles (same as D44). Now I have not worked on the newer trucks with the sealed front bearing. No first hand knowledge of them.

The rear is just like a Ford 9 inch set up. People say you can drive the bearing off by grabbing the backing plate and slamming the shaft into a board on the ground. I have tried it and I was not successful. I rigged up my little 12 ton HF press since I didn't have the SST bearing puller. I was not sure my 12ton was going to get it off. In fact I had the press really under some pressure and was hiding behind the uprights in case it blew apart. When it finally did pop it sounded like a gun and scared the pajesus out of me LOL. Now it was the original bearing so it may just have been stuck really good.

You want Fun.....Supra rear bearings is it. I had to go over the factory manual about 10 times before I understood the process on that. To do the job a press is mandatory and you have to reposition 6-8 times to swap the bearing. Once you understand the steps its not hard but has a lot of steps and you have to keep flipping over the hub assembly to drive the next part out.

Overall the only vehicle I have ever worked on that was easier was my old GM trucks. I really like the way Toyota does things but I have not worked on the newer truck that you had a time with. My little 4Runner I have had completely apart swapped motor, rebuilt the transmission,change rear wheel bearing, service the fronts and really never was frustrated with it at any point. My Old supra was the same other then the 7M is really tight in the engine bay and just in general having small hands (and I don't) is a big plus but its logical and it came apart and went together without a fight once you learned the procedure.

If you want to feel great about a Toyota go work on a front drive VW.......I have assured my place in hell with some of the cuss words I have invented and evil thoughts I have had working on them. Where they went so wrong from the simple Air cooled I will never know. Every engine repair other then tune up should start out with "remove engine". Honda is not much better, they just don't break down often like the VW's do.

 

[calamaridog]

Graham,

The trick is not to do this in the field

If you are going to be far afield, I'd suggest plenty of spares and all necessary SST's.

 

[gjackson]

Thing is, Graham, new US-spec SUV Rovers probably are going to be similar.

Oh yeah, I don't doubt that the LR3 is equally hard to work on (if not worse!)

Pulling the steering knuckle off wasn't too bad. But getting the hub out of the knuckle (bearing) and then getting the bearing out of the knuckle was a fight:exclaim: My puller has a 3/4" shaft on it. We bent the shaft. Had to go to a friend's place and use a puller with a 1" shaft. Took a 3' breaker on that to get it out. To pull the unibearing race out of the knuckle we had to cut it, grind ledges into it and then pound on it with a 6 pound sledge!

I got to say, doing this in the field would be a bummer! But bearings do go out, and being able to swap in the field would be cool. I have never had to do a bearing on my own LR in the field, but I have done others. Having that old solid axle design with the loose fit (i.e. leaks oil!) makes them pretty easy to work with. I assume that LC solid axles are similar.

But we got the job done. Just took 2 days and making some pretty cool SSTs! Always fun when you can use the welder!

So has anyone done a Taco front bearing in the field?

cheers

 

[devinsixtyseven]

yuck. was it a sealed unit bearing? if so, you cant do it in the field, unless you're lugging an industrial hydraulic press around the field with you. what year taco? since it sounds like there are several different bearing designs and the design you recently dealt with sounds different than the current unit bearing design, if you were able to do the work with nothing more (!) than a few SSTs. the new setup requires a 15T press as well as several SSTs.

-sean

 

[gjackson]

Sean,

Yes it was a unit bearing design. And I did not have a press. And only home made SSTs. Getting the new bearing into the knuckle was easy enough -- put the bearing in the freezer overnight and put the knuckle in the oven at 350 deg. Bearing slipped in with no worries. Also froze the hub and then heated the knuckle w/ bearing to 310 deg. That didn't slip in quite so well. Pounded on it with a sledge until the hub threads came through. Then made a tool so I could get an impact soket on it. That got it going!

Assembly wasn't nearly as hard as taking it apart! I would be a bit worried taking a truck on a long expedition that I couldn't do a bearing job on. (But then I'm used to trucks that don't have near immortal bearings)

cheers

 

[HongerVenture]

Ours uses traditional taper roller bearings, lock nuts and all that. In fact I've used up my supply of spare parts left over from my '78 FJ40 on my '91 IFS during services. Things like star washers, seals, etc. It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out that the bearings and races were the same (never checked specifically).

This is one aspect I love about the T100... the IFS is mostly the same as the IFS from earlier trucks. We have taper roller bearings and replacing a bearing and/or repacking them is easy! This would not be bad to do in the field at all... its just faster in the garage with air tools. Easy to maintain and a joy to work on.

The rear is fairly simple as well. As Grim Reaper alluded to, the rear bearing can be driven off using the backing plate... though a press would be nice. I have successfully done this using the backing plate and it takes A LOT of work. Ugh. Again though, I could do this in the field in a pinch.

There is a lot to be said for being able to do simple field repairs such as these. While Toyota sealed bearings can last a long time, I still like being able to service them if need be.

Graham, if you ever get to monkey around on a T100 or late-80's, early-90's IFS, you'll find it much more agreeable.

Joel

 

[devinsixtyseven]

Sean,

Yes it was a unit bearing design. And I did not have a press. And only home made SSTs. Getting the new bearing into the knuckle was easy enough -- put the bearing in the freezer overnight and put the knuckle in the oven at 350 deg. Bearing slipped in with no worries. Also froze the hub and then heated the knuckle w/ bearing to 310 deg. That didn't slip in quite so well. Pounded on it with a sledge until the hub threads came through. Then made a tool so I could get an impact soket on it. That got it going!

Assembly wasn't nearly as hard as taking it apart! I would be a bit worried taking a truck on a long expedition that I couldn't do a bearing job on. (But then I'm used to trucks that don't have near immortal bearings)

cheers

thats quite impressive. i've used heat/cold to assemble pieces in the past, but never considered doing the same for a unit bearing, since my only experience with unit bearings was from a manual hub swap...it took a 30T press and an air hammer to get the old bearing out of the hub, and when the retainer ring finally broke, slightly less than half the unit bearing briefly tried out life as aircraft componentry, slightly less than half remained in the hub, and the remainder ran for cover along with the guys standing around watching (story from the tech at the dealership who did the work, fairly common occurrence with the unit bearings). i guess pressing them back in was fairly easy with the industrial press, but i'd hate to have to do it in the field (not even sure it's possible), and the removal step has cracked a few spindles as well, oem and aftermarket.

the upshot is that the failure rate on the unit bearings is very low, tho iirc the recommended swap interval is 100k for hard use.

they are nice, but i am glad i will soon have "normal" bearings.

-sean

 

[gjackson]

Graham, if you ever get to monkey around on a T100 or late-80's, early-90's IFS, you'll find it much more agreeable.

Yeah, I'd like to check out the innards of a T100. The more stuff you can fix in the field the better. My view is somewhat skewed, since the Defender is really 1970s technology eventhough build date is much later. Hell, my truck doesn't even have seatbelt and door alarms! I have no doubt that the new LR stuff is hell to work on without a full shop.

i've used heat/cold to assemble pieces in the past, but never considered doing the same for a unit bearing

Worked like a charm! In the field it would be my camp stove and Engle doing the work, and I doubt it would be quite so easy!

cheers

 

[BajaTaco]

Graham, that sounds like some impressive work & ingenuity that you displayed - very cool!

I have done the rear bearings on my truck with a friend who had made a SST for doing it, and it wasn't so bad. Definitely not something I would care (or expect) to do in the field. The same goes for the front. I changed the rears on mine simply because we were replacing axle seals and since he already had the tool for it, what the heck. But I have not done the fronts (sealed units). I don't think I have ever heard of a bearing failure on a Tacoma in the field whereby the vehicle was inoperable (has anyone out there ever come across this?)

You are right about the tightness of the vehicle. Over 136,000 miles and nary a drop of oil has ever touched my driveway

 

[cruiseroutfit]

...I don't think I have ever heard of a bearing failure on a Tacoma in the field whereby the vehicle was inoperable (has anyone out there ever come across this?)...

I was thinking the same thing as I read this thread.... I'm yet to hear of it occuring. And with some of these trucks getting up over 300k, I'de expect that we likely won't hear much of it.