Family Adventure Rig - Planning Stages

[john101477]

John,

You drive an old 4 runner... but the power in the H2 was a deal breaker for you?

325 horsepower / 370 ft lbs torque is a little better than the 22RE.

The last H2's came with the 6.2 403 horsepower / 417 ft lbs torque.

I know sounds funny right. but here is the deal. We have a long straight road out of chico called Hwy 32. It climbs very steady into the foothills before turning into a road racers wet dream. While on the test drive with the H2 it would not even hit 70 and the throttle was on the floor. even in my 22re I can hit 70 (with a running start) lol. My parents ended up buying a rare sports car anyways and as I stated before I am still making up my mind lol. What used to meet my needs before is starting to become more of a pain than a positive. 4 doors would be nice, a little more power for the weight ratio.

the last H2's did have the 6.2 the 2007 and before had the 6.0 standard. As a whole IMO the H2 was just to heavy for the motor that GM chose to use. The Duramax setup in the H2 was the answer and the cure. The power to weight ratio is what kills the H2 and from what I have heard about the H3 Alfa those issues should not be a problem although the standard h3 with the inline 5 will always be a bit sluggish (like the toyota 3.0)

Honestly if Hummer was not about to disappear forever I would probably look closer at the H3's smaller platform. But seeing as how GM is trying to off load the last ones now and will no longer be supporting the line... Kind of makes me queezy to think about it. I have looked at several vehicles and still having issues matching up to what i want out of a rig.
somewhere between a excursion with a PSD and a tacoma lol

Anyone ever hear that song from Johnny Cash - "One Piece at a Time"? :coffeedrink:

Oh and thats a 84 Hp 22re

Hey Rugged. I notice your in Salt Lake. I am gonna be about 2 hours north west of you if your ever bored on a sunday.

 

[R_Lefebvre]

I never understand the horsepower wars. It's a truck. As long as I can get up to the speed limit on your typical on-ramp, I'm happy. If I can pull up a hill at least as fast as a big rig, I'm happy. It's a truck. If I want to go fast, I take a sports car.

 

[The Adam Blaster]

I never understand the horsepower wars. It's a truck. As long as I can get up to the speed limit on your typical on-ramp, I'm happy. If I can pull up a hill at least as fast as a big rig, I'm happy. It's a truck. If I want to go fast, I take a sports car.

The lack of power becomes apparent when people try to drive them like cars, or pull a very heavy trailer.
And our society is impatient, we always want to go fast-fast-fast!

 

[R_Lefebvre]

I understand why a guy with an F350 wants 400hp to pull a 15,000lb trailer. I don't know why a guy with a 5000lb truck, maybe towing a 2000lb trailer at most, just NEEDS more than 200hp.

 

[jim65wagon]

I understand why a guy with an F350 wants 400hp to pull a 15,000lb trailer. I don't know why a guy with a 5000lb truck, maybe towing a 2000lb trailer at most, just NEEDS more than 200hp.

Come out and drive around the DC Beltway, the semi trucks will give you every reason for needing and wanting more than 200 HP in anything you drive!

 

[R_Lefebvre]

I do avoid cities, so maybe that's why.

 

[AxeAngel]

I understand why a guy with an F350 wants 400hp to pull a 15,000lb trailer. I don't know why a guy with a 5000lb truck, maybe towing a 2000lb trailer at most, just NEEDS more than 200hp.

I think the guy with the F350 is more concerned about torque Rob. I hear your point and am not arguing against it.

-Sam

 

[john101477]

I think the guy with the F350 is more concerned about torque Rob. I hear your point and am not arguing against it.

-Sam

it is a lot more involved than that but yeah having the horsepower with out the low end torque is pointless in a rig that hauls anything but your butt and a suitcase.
having hauled a lot of heavy machinery up and down california in both commercial and personal vehicles, I can safely say I would rather have the HP and torque than just the torque. Vehicles such as the Isuzu NPR HD that are beaming with torque but suffer in the top end can be interesting on mountain roads. it could also be down right dangerous on roads such as Hwy 58 going up before tehachapi. I know in my npr on many mountain roads loaded I am lucky to make 30mph where as dad's PSD never even slows down.

Now what I never could figure out is the guys that have to have more than what it came with. stacking chips in a PSD, Duramax, or cummins is crazy but in the same breath a lot of fun. I did not quite get the power hungry gene that my dad has. 2 stack chipped PSD, airplane, jet boat, rousche P51, you get the drift. I am happy (for the most part) with my 84hp toyota, 190hp isuzu, and Dodge Magnum with the small V6.

 

[R_Lefebvre]

it could also be down right dangerous on roads such as Hwy 58 going up before tehachapi.

I know what you mean. But I think this speaks more to road design and poor drivers. We shouldn't be building trucks with a million horsepower just so that we can drive up 15% grades hauling heavy loads and not slow below 65mph.

If you're going up a long steep grade, you should slow down. The road should have reduced speed limit and/or passing lanes, etc. Police should be stationed there, and if people are driving like ****************** because somebody is slow, they should be ticketted.

There's a price to be paid for all this horsepower. You pay it on the sticker price, and you pay it in inefficiency when cruising on level ground the other 99% of the time.

My truck ONLY has 217hp, and now that I have a manual trans and get to pick the shift points, I find I'm driving in the 1300-2000rpm range generally. That's all it takes to not hold up traffic.

 

[john101477]

I know what you mean. But I think this speaks more to road design and poor drivers. We shouldn't be building trucks with a million horsepower just so that we can drive up 15% grades hauling heavy loads and not slow below 65mph.

If you're going up a long steep grade, you should slow down. The road should have reduced speed limit and/or passing lanes, etc. Police should be stationed there, and if people are driving like ****************** because somebody is slow, they should be ticketted.

There's a price to be paid for all this horsepower. You pay it on the sticker price, and you pay it in inefficiency when cruising on level ground the other 99% of the time.

My truck ONLY has 217hp, and now that I have a manual trans and get to pick the shift points, I find I'm driving in the 1300-2000rpm range generally. That's all it takes to not hold up traffic.

I am not sure I follow on why I should go slower on an up hill pull. Down hill is another story and often has a secondary speed limit for tractor trailers and pickups hauling trailers.
you do pay for the Hp on the sticker price but that is kind of for the buyer to decide if they need it or can afford it. Diesel also used to be a lot cheaper to buy than gas since it takes less to make. Now that every tom ******** and harry has a lot bigger truck than they really need, and guys love the look of a lifted chevy even though they do not haul ANYTHING, the cost of diesel has inflated to the costs well above the cost to make ratio.

Your 217hp truck is a modest setup. For the guy hauling a boat, camp trailer, etc thats fine. Some of the equipment I used to haul was very big and heavy and that 217 is a far cry from what I needed to get my job done in a reasonable time. Could 217 suit my needs today? absolutely, 3 years ago? not a chance.

I do wish more people would go your route though Rob. Buy a modest pickup that will do what they need. Those days are gone now. The feel of a heavy Hp motor with a turbo or supercharger has turned everyones head. heck even small cars seem to have to have a turbo or supercharger now. Dodge Neons, Chevy Cavalier, etc. The thirst for power will never be quenched now. It is what kept the hybrids from booming years ago until toyota's prius came along. while not a power house, it will go faster than it's predecessors. The thirst for power is also what keeps the gassers and diesels on the road because until someone develops a more powerful hybrid.... you get my drift.

 

[Greggk]

I know what you mean. But I think this speaks more to road design and poor drivers. We shouldn't be building trucks with a million horsepower just so that we can drive up 15% grades hauling heavy loads and not slow below 65mph.

If you're going up a long steep grade, you should slow down. The road should have reduced speed limit and/or passing lanes, etc. Police should be stationed there, and if people are driving like ****************** because somebody is slow, they should be ticketted.

There's a price to be paid for all this horsepower. You pay it on the sticker price, and you pay it in inefficiency when cruising on level ground the other 99% of the time.

My truck ONLY has 217hp, and now that I have a manual trans and get to pick the shift points, I find I'm driving in the 1300-2000rpm range generally. That's all it takes to not hold up traffic.

i tend to disagree with the efficiency part. just remember the pounds per horsepower part. the more power you have the less of it you will have to use to move the vehicle. Perfect example. my buddies corvette that i drive on occasion and help him work on. its an 06 vette. 413 stroker, ported heads, intake, and throttle body , custom grind cam, long tube headers, supercharger, nitrous and methanol injection, 6 speed manual and 4.10 gears. over the 970 rwhp mark (not for long, going with new supercharger head capable of 27psi, should send him over the 1000 rwhp mark with ease). perfectly street able, gets 33 mpg at 75mph on the highway, and actually does better at emissions then when it was stock. the reason is a more complete combustion burn. best part is at the altitude in Pueblo Colorado, he ran a 9.82 in the 1/4... cant remember the speed though. unfortunately they will not allow him to run anymore, since he refuses to cage the car

 

[R_Lefebvre]

Don't confuse combustion efficiency with horsepower and fuel efficiency. Any direct link is tenuous at best. Sure, maybe he's more efficient with the worked motor. But the point is, he could "cut the engine in half", run a 3.0L 4 cylinder with the same work done, get even more MPG since there is half the friction, and not be banned from the dragstrip.

 

[Greggk]

hahaha very true