4 link, Coilover, 4x4, e350 Conversion - King / Full Traction

[non_applicable]

First off, thanks to everyone that's helped answer my questions so far. I have a few threads going at the moment that have been really helpful, and I promise this will be the last one full of my questions. The next thread you'll see from me will be a build thread.

So, I think I've got a pretty good plan here, I'd appreciate any feedback on this idea, particularly if you can think of something that's going to be difficult to resolve, pose a safety concern, or just plain not work.

I'm thinking I'll grab a Dana 60 and do a 4x4 conversion on an e350 using the bolt in, 4 link, coilover conversion system from Full Traction. This system is designed for 99-04 F250/F350 and Excursions.

The best I can tell the kit comes with an adjustable Panhard Bar, adjustable 4 link components, a pretty slick sway bar extension, and all of the bolt on brackets to make things work. I'll include a couple of pictures here to show the kit.

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A few questions:

1) Are you aware of any problems that I might have swapping this kit into an late model e350?

2) If I get a 4" lift kit, will that actually lift the e350 4" from its stock ride height, or will the lift wind up being more like 6.5", factoring in the extra height gained from the Dana 60?

3) Can I push the front axle toward the front of the vehicle 2" by adjusting the length of the 4 links, moving the upper suspension/shock mount over, and fabricating a new set of arms for the sway bar?

4) I would like to swap in a set of highsteer/crossover knuckles to get that up and out of the way. How will this affect things? How do I resolve the length of the bar that controls the steering? (I know that's a dumb question, I just can't think of any other way to state it. I'm new.) Any links to articles, parts, or information is appreciated! I am also hunting on my own, but I've not yet found the answer to this question, at least not one that I understand.

Thanks so much! I really appreciate all of the help I've received. I'm still new, but I understand things much better now thanks to your replies. You guys rock. See you in the build thread!

 

[spencyg]

OR....you could just do a UJoint leaf sprung front end which gets nothing but rave reviews for both longevity as well as ride comfort and safety. I have a coil sprung front end on my rig so I'm not trying to drag you "into the club" or anything....I think you'll be more than happy with a UJoint system. Buying a $3500 kit meant for another vehicle, then scabbing it onto a van sounds to me like nothing but an expensive fail. Sorry for the bluntness.

SG

 

[ujoint]

First off, thanks to everyone that's helped answer my questions so far. I have a few threads going at the moment that have been really helpful, and I promise this will be the last one full of my questions. The next thread you'll see from me will be a build thread.

So, I think I've got a pretty good plan here, I'd appreciate any feedback on this idea, particularly if you can think of something that's going to be difficult to resolve, pose a safety concern, or just plain not work.

I'm thinking I'll grab a Dana 60 and do a 4x4 conversion on an e350 using the bolt in, 4 link, coilover conversion system from Full Traction. This system is designed for 99-04 F250/F350 and Excursions.

The best I can tell the kit comes with an adjustable Panhard Bar, adjustable 4 link components, a pretty slick sway bar extension, and all of the bolt on brackets to make things work. I'll include a couple of pictures here to show the kit.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
A few questions:

1) Are you aware of any problems that I might have swapping this kit into an late model e350?

2) If I get a 4" lift kit, will that actually lift the e350 4" from its stock ride height, or will the lift wind up being more like 6.5", factoring in the extra height gained from the Dana 60?

3) Can I push the front axle toward the front of the vehicle 2" by adjusting the length of the 4 links, moving the upper suspension/shock mount over, and fabricating a new set of arms for the sway bar?

4) I would like to swap in a set of highsteer/crossover knuckles to get that up and out of the way. How will this affect things? How do I resolve the length of the bar that controls the steering? (I know that's a dumb question, I just can't think of any other way to state it. I'm new.) Any links to articles, parts, or information is appreciated! I am also hunting on my own, but I've not yet found the answer to this question, at least not one that I understand.

Thanks so much! I really appreciate all of the help I've received. I'm still new, but I understand things much better now thanks to your replies. You guys rock. See you in the build thread!

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You'd wind up having to re do almost all of the kit except the brackets that sandwich the axle. Hoops won't work, frame mounts won't work, trac bar length is wrong, upper trac bar mount, etc. Changing to crossover steering will complicate it even more requiring custom trac bar brackets. That x-over knuckle pictured is an 05/up too. (you probably just posted it as an example)

If you're dead set on a 4 link coil over suspension then you'd be better making it all from scratch. Or like Spence said, just get a UJ kit

 

[ujoint]

And... if you're scared of the leaf springs just let me know where you are so we can try to get you behind the wheel of a UJOR van. We've removed a bunch of coil sprung 4x4 van suspensions and the vans always drive/handle much better.

 

[Skooter_Built]

While I hate when people tell me this, stop trying to reinvent the wheel.

Using leaf springs and Ujoint parts is hands down the easiest way to go.

With that kit you will spend more time reworking the brackets to fit, remember they wernt designed for the van. Van & truck frames are 100% different.

In all honestly, coilovers on a heavy rig like a van are over rated. Big vehicles ride like trucks because that is what they are.

 

[toddz69]

Based on what it appears you're wanting, and the questions you're asking, I'd go visit Ramsey and Glen at Agile Off Road in El Cajon, CA. www.agileoffroad.com.

Todd Z.

 

[dcguillory]

I'm not understanding why you want to use a system not made for your vehicle when it wont even save you any money.

 

[DEFENDERBEAM]

that 4x4 van place in colorado does 4-link coils on vans. Maybe give them a call.

Not 100% sure if they do fords though?

also, it is a $15,000 cost range.

 

[non_applicable]

Thanks Chris!

You'd wind up having to re do almost all of the kit except the brackets that sandwich the axle. Hoops won't work, frame mounts won't work, trac bar length is wrong, upper trac bar mount, etc. Changing to crossover steering will complicate it even more requiring custom trac bar brackets. That x-over knuckle pictured is an 05/up too. (you probably just posted it as an example)

If you're dead set on a 4 link coil over suspension then you'd be better making it all from scratch. Or like Spence said, just get a UJ kit

Hey thanks for answering my questions, Chris! I appreciate your input. I'm new to trucks and to modifying vehicles in general, so it's taking me a bit to catch up to how everything works. Good to know that frames are significantly different from one vehicle to another, and that this kit would require some modifications to work for me. I've been investigating why that is, and I understand your points now.

I can see that the track bar would need to be addressed, I feel pretty good about that.

I can also see here why you say the hoops won't work, though I think that would be easy to modify and the rest of the upper mount is still good to go.


The frame mounts look like they would work (unless I'm missing something obvious), though, nothing special here, so it wouldn't be that difficult to just fabricate these.


Yeah, the knuckle is from an 05+, and I haven't yet found the knuckle I'd need for 99-04. If I needed to use that knuckle though, I'd just get the kit for a coilover conversion on the 05+ trucks. Good to have options depending on what axles I find, etc.

Since I'd only need a "4.5in lift" to make 6 inches, and I can now adjust for caster, the steering should be reasonably easy to address. I can always swap the knuckles out later, treat that as a separate issue, and build something that works. I'm actually unsure if Highsteer would work in this application anyway, I think I'll have to measure the D60 knuckles to get an idea.

So, I can definitely understand your expert advice, that I could just make all of this from scratch. That might be more fun anyway, and then I can avoid the Johnny Joints, and go with some of the stuff over at Parts Mike instead. The only component I'm not thrilled to fabricate would be the upper suspension mount, though perhaps I can find a generic "builders" one available somewhere. Or perhaps I'll go with this kit and modify it to my needs. The swaybar is pretty slick, the frame brackets should work, the hoop needs a bit of modification, and I can probably use the supplied trac bar to make something that works for me. I guess I'll have to think about it and price compare building my own to purchasing the kit, though I'm also guessing it's cheaper to just build my own.

Now I just need a vehicle!

 

[Toolman]

Bring all that crap over here. I will do it for you. See you guys in a couple of years on the trail. Don't bother waiting for me, I just have a few bugs to work out here.

 

[Toolman]

NO nol, I know where camp is I'll be fine. go on ahead it's just a few miles. I'll make it.

 

[Toolman]

Meanwhile

 

[philos]

One thing to consider is parts availability if/when you break something, or it wears out.
This is the part that has me planning on using the Ujoint setup, it's mostly stock parts that I can get just about anywhere in the world.

Plus what the others have said about it being figured out already, the pricing is fair enough too.

Why try and bodge something together when all the hard work and testing is already done for you? You'll be done faster and cheaper in a proven design.

 

[tgreening]

One thing to consider is parts availability if/when you break something, or it wears out.
This is the part that has me planning on using the Ujoint setup, it's mostly stock parts that I can get just about anywhere in the world.

Plus what the others have said about it being figured out already, the pricing is fair enough too.

Why try and bodge something together when all the hard work and testing is already done for you? You'll be done faster and cheaper in a proven design.

That's a big reason I went with the Ujoint kit. I could install it myself and have the satisfaction of saying "I did it", but I didn't have to fab much. I am TIRED of fabbing stuff doing a build. I've pretty much run out of patience for that. I've gotten to that elderly point of when I want something I pretty much want it now, and don't feel like dinking around with R & D and fabricating.

I didn't even want to bother with sourcing all the pieces/parts for myself. Tired of that phone/email game as well. Made a call to Chris and done. Everything taken care of.

 

[non_applicable]

Let's move along

Ok guys .... I'm sure the UJOR kit is a great kit, I've never said nor implied anything to the contrary. And Chris is obviously a very helpful and nice person. I'm glad that Chris has produced a high quality kit that meets your needs. I'm glad that he stuck with his plans, even though I'm sure he received all kinds of crap about going with leaf springs over coil springs, and that now the tables have turned in his favor.

Now, if you don't mind, I don't really understand all of the criticism. I'm not going with the UJOR kit, could we stop bringing it up, please? Why am I going this route? Why not? Isn't this supposed to be a forum of discovery, adventure, and expedition? Not everyone wants to go the same route that you went. And I think that we're all making a big deal out of something simple. An axle, a few mounts, some tubing and inserts, make sure the angles are correct.

Yes, I'm new to vehicles, I have some questions, and I definitely appreciate your knowledgeable replies. There is a lot that I don't yet know about vehicles, which is exactly why they're interesting, and why I'm here to learn from people that know more than I do.

As far as parts availability, there's just not a lot going on here, and I will most likely build the components in such a way that I will know ahead of time which one is going to fail. I've looked into these custom setups for a couple of days now and I noticed that companies over-build their components. I understand why they do this, they have a reputation to keep up and they don't want their parts to fail and receive poor reviews. But, if those easy to access parts don't fail, then something else will, and it's going to be expensive, difficult to get to, and probably leave the vehicle stranded and inoperable. Ultimately though, these components are simple and easy to build or repair.

Anyway, I tried to avoid this post, but now that it's out of the way, how about we get back to building some vehicles! =)